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FOTH Sound Peeps: Where to DI from?

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by weekendclimber, Jun 27, 2012.


  1. weekendclimber

    weekendclimber

    May 9, 2012
    First time poster who has been helped by a lot of the information on this website. I've built a bass rig and now have a question to the FOTH sound peeps out there. Where is the best place to DI this to the FOTH? I could provide a right and left feed straight from the SansAmp, but I really like the squashed and maximized sound coming from my cabs. Should I DI it from just in front of the AMP or from the SansAmp? I'm not sure what most sound guys prefer since they usually have more eq/comp/coloring options from the main board. Anyway, what do you think?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. salcott

    salcott Supporting Member

    Aug 22, 2007
    NYC, Inwood.
    Mic a speaker.
     
  3. walterw

    walterw Supportive Fender Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 20, 2009
    alpha-music.com
    "most soundguys prefer" a cheap IMP DI box coming right off the bass, whether it sounds like you want it to or not :(

    i'd guess maybe skipping the comp and BBE would give the house "your" sound without it being too over-processed.

    do you have to have the L-R thing? are you doing a wet-dry deal between the two cabs?
     
  4. weekendclimber

    weekendclimber

    May 9, 2012
    Mic'n it is always an option, but I'd like to have at least two options for the sound guy.

    I use several panning and ping-pong effects, so (at least for the larger venues I play with both cabs) I would still like to replicate my on stage sound as much as possible.
     
  5. seamonkey

    seamonkey

    Aug 6, 2004
    Why not take it off the SansAmp?
    FOH is already going to have a compressor and Maximizer or equivalent
    Those are just there to get your onstage sound?
    For stereo, you actually don't need to full range the bass. If the FOH has subs, the tops will handle stereo fine.
     
  6. weekendclimber

    weekendclimber

    May 9, 2012
    This was my first instinct and I can always just mic the cabs if they don't want to DI it through the SansAmp.

    I'm not bi-amped. Is that what you mean?
     
  7. AndyLES

    AndyLES

    Aug 25, 2008
    New York
    I'd DI right off the Sansamp.
     
  8. Your DI setup looks fine. It takes into account all your bass processing. Realistically, it maybe difficult to exactly replicate an Ampeg 810 cab sound through a FOH JBL system system as an example. And...

    As long as the sound guys do their best to make it sound good for the show and work with you on your sound needs--the show will be good. Theoretically.
     
  9. seanm

    seanm I'd kill for a Nobel Peace Prize!

    Feb 19, 2004
    Ottawa, Canada
    How big are the venues you are playing? I am interested in hearing if any of the soundguys will give you a true stereo feed.
     
  10. 4Mal

    4Mal Supporting Member

    Jun 2, 2002
    Columbia River Gorge
    That is a crazy rig! Got a spot for ear plugs somewhereI hope...
     
  11. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    I would mic cabs with that rig as well, although coming directly out of the last thing in your chain before the power amp would also work pretty well.
     
  12. If I'm doing sound and I see that rig it would go like this(follow the flow chart):

    "Do you have a regular way you do this?"

    yes ----> we do that.
    no ----> "Is the same sound coming out of both boxes?"

    yes ----> point an RE20 at whatever speaker looks like my best bet for minimizing bleed.
    no ----> point an RE20 at each box, using whichever speakers look like my best bet for minimizing bleed.

    If I see a rig like that I operate on the assumption that it sounds the way it does for a reason, I'm not taking a DI and building my idea of what a bass is supposed to sound like from scratch.

    The SVT 810 is a pretty distinctive sounding speaker box. They also sound pretty good. You can sound 'good' with a DI, for any number of definitions of 'good'. If you want it to sound like what it actually sounds like the easiest course of action (by quite some margin) is to just mic it up.
     
  13. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    Will you marry me???

    :D
     
  14. Floyd Eye

    Floyd Eye Banned

    Feb 21, 2010
    St. Louis
    Sure, sound guys like this come along now that you've switched to the Reddi. ;):D
     
  15. walterw

    walterw Supportive Fender Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 20, 2009
    alpha-music.com
    hey, we're out there!

    in my occasional house club gig, a tricky bass rig (actually any bass rig from a band that remotely looks like they have their s**t together) is met by me holding an XLR cable saying "where do you want this?"

    (if i had good bass mics i'd offer them, but a 57 is probably not gonna do the job as well as a good DI.)

    if he needs more channels and i have more channels, i'll give him more channels.
     
  16. nashman

    nashman

    Feb 11, 2011
    You don't need any FOH support with that rig. Wow.
     
  17. walterw

    walterw Supportive Fender Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 20, 2009
    alpha-music.com
    speaking to that, if the two cabs are strictly for "panning and ping-pong" effects as opposed to actual "processing"
    (i.e., if it's just different volumes for each one, as opposed to different tones), then you might be wasting your energy, as most bass gets panned straight up the middle (assuming the PA is even stereo in the first place) for maximum low end fullness in the whole room.
     
  18. ggunn

    ggunn

    Aug 30, 2006
    Austin, TX
    Jesus H Christ! Is it the 70's again? How many roadies do you have? :D

    My SVT hasn't been out of my studio in 10 years and I (and my back) do not miss it.
     
  19. Floyd Eye

    Floyd Eye Banned

    Feb 21, 2010
    St. Louis
    I was just poking a little fun at Jimmy, Walter. ;) I know, as Jimmy does too, that the majority of sound guys actually do want to make bands sound good and leave happy.
     
  20. testing1two

    testing1two Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2009
    Southern California
    When I see that diagram, I want my DI signal(s) coming off the SansAmp. The comp and BBE are set to work best with the SVT cabs, not the PA.

    For example, an SVT810 doesn't have much happening below 60Hz whereas any reasonable PA with subs should be flat to 30Hz or lower. So the BBE will add a tremendous amount of subharmonic energy that the SVT cabs won't reproduce but the PA will. Not good. If I get a mess of low end from the bass player I'm going to eq or HPF it out anyways.

    A similar rule applies to compression. The SVT810's eight identical speakers will respond to compression differently than a full range, multi-driver system, especially when it comes to noise. Since an SVT cab doesn't go much above 5kHz it doesn't reproduce the hiss (or noise floor) associated with higher levels of compression. The PA system on the other hand will reproduce everything, especially the noise. That's why it's important for the engineer to handle compression at FOH so he can optimize the settings for the best house mix and the lowest noise floor.

    And while I like stereo imaging as much as anyone it's important to note that dramatic stereo effects rarely work in a live performance environment and are only effective for people listening near the sweet spot of the room. Everyone else hears a mess of reflections that distorts/cancels the stereo image or they end up missing pieces of musical information because they are too close to one side.
     

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