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Fretless-Lined or unlined?

S

SCMan88

May 1, 2011
215
2
#1
Hey there fellow TBers!

I'm really digging the fretless basses lately,and hoping to get one(it'd probably be a Warmoth build).

Now,there are 2 things:
1)It will most likely be my ONLY bass.
2)I don't know if to take a lined or unlined fingerboard.

Whoever wants to read the short story,skip to the hide smiley.

The thing is,I saw on Warmoth's showcase Jazz fretless necks some really interesting stuff,at low price.
Those I really get interested in are unlined fingerboards.

At the lined Jazz showcase fretless necks,everything is quite "normal" and not so interesting(Maple and Ebony/Rosewood).

Now,getting a lined fingerboard with the woods I want,will probably cost another $200 to what can be about $250-$300 neck unlined.
And as me being not the richest man at the moment,I prefer the bass to cost as less expensive as possible.
So far with what I want it goes about $1000 plus shipping to my country.


The thing is that I'm really worried about getting an unlined fretless fingerboard,because I need to get by ear the notes.
On one side,thats great!-Like that I can improve my hearing,and thats good because I also need to improve my hearing for the school music lessons.
I could also use my little piano that I've been using to improve my hearing.

On the other side,I'm in my school's band,I play with friends and such,and if I come to a rehearsel with my fretless bass(because there is no other one),and they want to play whatever they want,I'm afraid I won't be able to get it by ear there,and just waste time on nothing.


:hiding:
So what should I do?
Get a lined fretless and pay abit more so I won't get troubled,or get an unlined and try to improve my hearing to get the correct notes?

Thanks TBers!!!!!!!!:hyper:
 
#3
If you're not using your ears when playing lined fretless your intonation will suck. Lines (and dots on the side of an unlined) just give you an approximation of the note - your hands and ears need to do the rest. I personally find lined boards harder to play due to the visual cues fighting the sonic ones but ymmv. Play whatever you're comfortable with. But imho unlined is no harder than lined. Playing fretless well requires practice and good ears. Actually playing any instrument requires those - it is just that fretless makes it more obvious with those that don't practice.
 
#4
It really doesn't matter to me if people read the whole thing.
I'm just explaining WHY this choice between the two is important for me.

And yes,its going to be a 4 string bass.

nostatic,I already played a 4 string fretless Fender(for example),and after about 10 minutes I got used to it.
On another occasion,I picked up a fretless Cort which was unlined,and after 5 minutes that I just couldn't get the notes correctly I gave up,lol.
 
#5
My only bass is a lined fretless, and I wish it were unlined. The fret lines actually throw me off a little when I see them, and I think it really is easier to learn fretless well if you don't have the visual cheats. So I'd vote unlined, if you can find an affordable one. Cort's B4FL bass is supposed to be fairly nice (they look pretty, anyhow):
Invalid Link Removed
 
#10
I don't rely on visual cues very much at all myself, but I don't really know why unlined would be any better in any way except perhaps aesthetics. I mean if you don't want to depend on the lines, don't.
 
#11
nostatic said:
If you're not using your ears when playing lined fretless your intonation will suck. Lines (and dots on the side of an unlined) just give you an approximation of the note - your hands and ears need to do the rest. I personally find lined boards harder to play due to the visual cues fighting the sonic ones but ymmv. Play whatever you're comfortable with. But imho unlined is no harder than lined. Playing fretless well requires practice and good ears. Actually playing any instrument requires those - it is just that fretless makes it more obvious with those that don't practice.
Click to expand...
:cool:

Big +1.
Plus with an unlined fingerboard your neck will love you too, for not staring at the fingerboard while you play.
 
#12
Mojo-Man said:
:cool:

Big +1.
Plus with an unlined fingerboard your neck will love you too, for not staring at the fingerboard while you play.
Click to expand...

I stare at the neck whether I'm playing lined or unlined. The amount you look or listen has nothing to do with whether a bass is lined or unlined.
 
#13
Learn to play in positions the way db'er do things and this will pay off big time on lined, unlined or fretted instruments.

Lines on a fretless will provide a great deal of comfort for you if you are used to frets, but you will still have to use your ears big time and this is where using positions really helps you get much closer to accurate than using your eyes and lines. But having those lines there to provide a quick reference doesn't hurt any - other than making you 'line-dependent' and 'eye-dependent' - both dependencies are crutches, IMO and ones I welcome!

My only (playable) fretless is unlined and I was very intimidated by that at first until I bit the bullet and just started playing it. I stared life on an upright where lines were just not an option - and playing my unlined fretless brought all upright position training right back to the surface. Pretty soon I found it to be one of the most rewarding playing experiences ever - in the lab. I have yet to go for it live, however...

FWIW - you have to feel good about the instrument you are playing and you can grow to feel good about just about any instrument that's in good shape and worth playings if you commit to working with it and developing your chops.

I'd much rather be heading into a gig with a bass I don't have any worries about playing rather than one that's going to preoccupy me with technical BS. So if you are going to go for it and it's your only axe, spend a TON of time in the woodshed getting your fingers and ears calibrated!
 
#14
First, all fretless players use some kind of visual reference. There are marks on the fingerboard edge, and for a lined instrument on the fingerboard.

In the lower positions near the nut, where you will do most of your work, it is generally impractical to look at the fingerboard. In this case, the marks on the fingerboard edge are most useful. Since the fingerboard marks don't matter for the lower register, you have your pick - lines or no lines are basically equivalent; unless you get confused by reference to fretting in between frets on a fretted instrument.

The upper register is a different deal. Accurate large shifts into the upper register can be difficult without visual references. The side dots are not as useful because of parallax from the fingerboard edge. In this case, lines can be useful.

Each player has to decide on the marking system that is best for them. Edgar Meyer has (large) dots on the fingerboard face of his 17th century Gabrielli. He uses them. OTOH, there are a lot of other factors ranging from appearance to feeling like one has to prove their pitch discrimination that may come into play.

Most likely, you will try a couple of different systems before deciding what works best for you. So, my 2c would be to not spend too much money on a first fretless, and be prepared to mess around with it a bit.

After a while, you can know enough to come on TB and participate in enthusiastic bashing against the other side in this never ending debate. It happens all the time.:hiding:

YMMV
 
#15
I prefer an unlined fretless. Aesthetically I think it looks nicer. Plus an over-dependance on the lines can get you into trouble with your intonation. With time your ear is going to be better trained for discrepancies in your intonation if you focus on listening first and foremost.
 
#16
Mushroo said:
If you have to ask, get lines. (In my opinion) there is no disadvantage to having lines, only advantage.
Click to expand...

I've seen the lines sink or rise in a few instances, but I can only assume they might not have been stored anywhere near appropriately.

I'm an unlined guy, but lines always threw me off since the true note isn't at the line, but that's where my eyes and fingers want me to play. Remove them and I don't struggle.

Lined or unlined, it usually boils down to what you've learned on. If the first config doesn't work, try the other. If THAT doesn't work, might not be your thing.
 
#18
The only reason to get unlined is aesthetics. If you are more concerned with looks than functionality, then get unlined. Otherwise get the lines. You'll be more likely to play in tune. Once you get going, you can always just not look at them.

This conversation has been done to death on these boards btw. Someone will come along shortly with the doublebass isn't lined argument if they haven't already. Just so you know, that argument is crap.
 
#19
Kael said:
This conversation has been done to death on these boards btw. Someone will come along shortly with the doublebass isn't lined argument if they haven't already. Just so you know, that argument is crap.
Click to expand...

Given the design of the upright bass, it's much easier to use muscle memory to know where you're at. On an electric bass, the neck is virtually featureless, which make it hard to "feel" the 6th position from the 7th position.
 
#20
If the fret lines are in the wrong place, then your intonation is off and your bass needs a setup.

The nice thing about a lined fretless is you can convert it to unlined by simply closing your eyes. But you can't convert unlined to lined by opening them. :)

I agree it is ideal to always use your ears, however I have played in a lot of situations where this is impossible due to poor room acoustics or a bad mix. Better to use the lines and play in tune.

If you are an experienced fretless player and are confident you don't need lines, then you would not be asking this question IMHO.
 

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