From Thunderfunk 750A to...

[Alexander]

I've been considering either buying a second head or perhaps replacing my primary head altogether (Thunderfunk 750A). Although there is a lot I really love about this head, there are two areas where it seems to fall short during certain situations. The first is that, when paired with my Epifani UL410(s2), the tone is really, really polite - I guess that is what you get when you take an uber-clean head and pair it with a smooth, polite cab. I want something "gutsy warm" and what I am missing here is the "gutsy" part. I know I can switch out the cab to get there (Berg AE410?) and I may just well do that at some stage. But the other thing is the low end voicing of the Thunderfunk just doesn't fit in all of the situations I have. Don't get me wrong, the low end is HUGE, which is why I say it's the voicing that doesn't always fit. It is very tight and kicks really hard and I find sometimes I would prefer a wider, more buttery low end with a bit softer attack to it. Slow blues is the best example of where I see the lack - I just don't get that fat, warm, pillow underneath that carries the tune. That low end kick that works so well in other situations, just seems out of place there.

So, looking for recommendations to pair with the Epi, here. I want something warm and gutsy yet clear with a pillowy, yet not boomy\muddy low end. Would be nice to dial in a bit of tube grit\grind\growl, too. I also want something with plenty of headroom - now that I'm playing through a 750 watt head, not sure I want to step back too far.

Thoughts?

 

[KJung]

Wider and buttery attack..... bigger low end pillow. OK, I know what you mean versus heads like the TF and the wonderful RH450 and Markbass F1/F500, etc.

My guess would be that, for those types of gigs, the Mesa MPulse600 would do the trick. It is big and bloomy (kind of like the DB750) down low, and very organic. It has the most tubey preamp of any amp I've tried, and it literally will 'give' a bit when you dig in, just like a bit tube amp. With the 410UL you won't get the articulation and clean punch that you do with your TF750, but you will get big, organic, bloomy, fat, deep low end. Too much for me personally, but I'm not you!

By the way, this is the only head in the current Mesa lineup that has this type of voicing.

FYI. And, going to the AE410 would take your tone in the opposite direction versus the 410UL... tighter and punchier and 'bappier' down low, brighter and more aggressive/grindy in the upper mids, less airy upper treble top end (although the TF does not produce much up there).

IMO!

 

[Alexander]

Thanks for the input, KJung!

I guess I'm looking for something that might be the best of both worlds - may not be possible, but a guy can dream, huh! I don't want to get too far away from having a nice, clear punch nor do I want something with too much bloom that results in this blubbery low end, either. I imagine things could go south really quick with that kind of amp paired with the UL410 in a bad room!

The GLK Fusion 1050 sounds really interesting, I must say and at least as described (i.e. the rich warmth of tubes combined with the quick punchy power that GK amps are known for...) seems aimed at what I'm going for. Any thoughts on that amp?

I also have been interested in Genz's GBE amps too as I know you can dial in the tube section as desired, which might help me achieve that best of both worlds...

 

[KJung]

Thanks for the input, KJung!

I guess I'm looking for something that might be the best of both worlds - may not be possible, but a guy can dream, huh! I don't want to get too far away from having a nice, clear punch nor do I want something with just this blubbery low end, either.

The GLK Fusion 1050 sounds really interesting, I must say and at least as described seems aimed at what I'm going for. Any thoughts on that amp?

Never played that amp (550). It gets good reviews. I don't think the 1050 exists yet.

I would think the TF750 (from reviews I've read) would be plenty wide and big down low (versus the very compressed TF550), but would be VERY polite up top, given the smooth, somewhat compressed top end of the TF amps, and the very open, smooth tone of the 410UL, with that bit of a hole between the upper mids and the tweeter. If you want more character, the AE410 just KILLS with the TF voicing, and adds some 'life' to the upper mids and lower treble of your tone (i.e., the 'windings on the E string sort of sound). However, the low end will be tighter and more 'upper bass lower mid punchy'. I love that tone in a mix... punch versus bloom, grind versus sizzle compared to the 410UL. However, if you are looking for a bloomier, deeper, pillow type response, the AE410 will not get you there.

 

[tombowlus]

The GLK Fusion 1050 sounds really interesting, I must say and at least as described (i.e. the rich warmth of tubes combined with the quick punchy power that GK amps are known for...) seems aimed at what I'm going for. Any thoughts on that amp?

Going by your stated tone goals, the Fusion 550 should be on your radar, for sure. It definitely has that quick, dynamically powerful GK output section (which I just love). The tube front end is quite nice, and Bob utilizes all six tube gain stages (three 12AX7's). The tone is harmonically rich, but still quick and clear. You can definitely push it into some overdrive, if you want (and it's a "good" overdrive, IMHO), but it also yields lots of clean headroom. In some regards, the preamp curve is similar to the Mesa/Boogie M6, with a bit of a lower-mid scoop and a bit of an upper-mid boost. The end result is still plenty full sounding, but not muddy/thuddy/slow in any regard.

I did a Quick Look review of the Fusion 550 in issue #2, and Vic Serbe and Tom Lees did a full review of the Fusion 550 in issue #3.

Regarding the Fusion 1050, Bob and crew have some changes in mind, which should end up being pretty darned awesome, but I don't think that we'll see anything prior to Summer NAMM. The thing is, that Fusion 550 is plenty powerful as is. This amp has lots of dynamic headroom, and it is capable of putting out substantially more than its rated "steady state" power when you hit it with a burst signal. GK amps always "feel" more powerful than their ratings would otherwise have you believe, and this dynamic power is a big part of it, IMHO.

Getting back to Ken's post for a moment, I definitely agree that if you want a thicker, more warm, punchy tone, then something from the M-Pulse line might be up your alley. But the M3M6/M9 are a very different design, and they have that "harmonically rich, but very fast and clear" tube tone, versus the more thick and warm M-Pulse line.

Hope this helps, Tom.

 

[Alexander]

Thanks guys for the responses - that Fusion sure sounds like a nice amp. I tried some GK stuff way back when and really liked the dynamics, but it wasn't as warm as I'd hoped, so with the all-tube pre it might be right up my alley. And if it has a low-mid scoop, I imagine it will match rather nicely to the UL410, which seems to have a bit of a low-mid hump...

I really do love the Tfunk though, so it would be hard to get rid of it - it just doesn't pair well IMO with the UL410 in every situation. Sounded like a great match in the store, but after gigging it for a while, it just isn't happening at times. Ken, I think you summed up the problem with it really well - it is just too polite. If the cab had a bit more presence and grind to it, I'd be a bit more forgiving of the tighter low end - in fact, I bet in a lot of situations, I'd REALLY dig it! Funny that I went in to buy a Berg HS410, but walked out with the Epi as I was drawn to the smooth, wide tone - now I wish I had gone the other direction. Expensive effing mistakes, let me tell you...

So, I don't know if I should switch out the head, the cab or both. But the quest for that tone in my head continues. Good thing I have my Sadowsky NYC, though - that mutha ain't going nowhere!

 

[funkometer]

Alex, maybe you could try a diff preamp through the tfunk effects loop #2. I use a SAMAMP preamp (tube)when id like to have a more wider bloomy low end, and a more tube based sound, and it does grit and distortion too......best of both worlds!

 

[Matt Dean]

Here's a +1 for the M-Pulse 600. I'm on my second one after trying some other heads in the hybrid market segment. It really does (IMO) come closest to sounding like an all tube head. I've had a number of people make unsolicited comments on how profoundly it fills what ever room I'm playing in with low end.

 

[Alexander]

Interesting idea. I had one of those many moons ago but sold it when I moved into more powerful and somewhat higher end heads. I'd prefer going straight into the amp, but it might be worth a shot...

 

[Alexander]

Here's a +1 for the M-Pulse 600. I'm on my second one after trying some other heads in the hybrid market segment. It really does (IMO) come closest to sounding like an all tube head. I've had a number of people make unsolicited comments on how profoundly it fills what ever room I'm playing in with low end.

Thanks - I'll see if I can find one to try out!

Has anyone here ever A\Bed the Fusion and MPulse?

 

[kobass]

Has anyone here ever A\Bed the Fusion and MPulse?

I owned an M-Pulse 600 about five years ago. I currently own a Fusion 550. To my ears, the Mesa was much woolier than the GK, and it actually felt more like an "all tube" amp with a little "give" in the response. I found the bottom end to be very difficult to control.

The Fusion on the other hand is "GK quick" but you can still dial in some nice tube warmth. I use it with a GK Neo 212-2 (4 ohm). What a combination! It's everything I've been looking for... tube warmth (can be adjusted from very subtle to a more overdriven sound), nice punchy midrange and a deep and round-but-tight/defined bottom. As mentioned above, it's a LOUD amp for it's wattage rating. I play in a loud classic rock and blues band w/o PA support and I've yet to turn the master volume past nine o'clock.

 

[Alexander]

I owned an M-Pulse 600 about five years ago. I currently own a Fusion 550. To my ears, the Mesa was much woolier than the GK, and it actually felt more like an "all tube" amp with a little "give" in the response. I found the bottom end to be very difficult to control.

The Fusion on the other hand is "GK quick" but you can still dial in some nice tube warmth. I use it with a GK Neo 212-2 (4 ohm). What a combination! It's everything I've been looking for... tube warmth (can be adjusted from very subtle to a more overdriven sound), nice punchy midrange and a deep and round-but-tight/defined bottom. As mentioned above, it's a LOUD amp for it's wattage rating. I play in a loud classic rock and blues band w/o PA support and I've yet to turn the master volume past nine o'clock.

Cool - I notice from your profile that you also had a Thunderfunk 550 - how would you compare\contrast that with the GK Fusion?

 

[Kael]

Have you tried diming the enhance knob and rolling the timbre knob back to around 9 o'clock? Yes it cuts some mids, but not as much as one might think. It also manages to pull off a convincing clean tube thing. Not as punchy with a hint of bloom to the note.

Just something to try before blowing any $.

 

[kobass]

Cool - I notice from your profile that you also had a Thunderfunk 550 - how would you compare\contrast that with the GK Fusion?

Hmmm. That's a tough one. I definitely enjoyed the TF550B. I really have a hard time describing tone, but I'll do my best. The TF was definitely more compressed in the lows and not as "open" in the highs.

The Fusion really is something. It has a nice, big, round bottom, but it's articulate/well-defined at the same time. The midrange is rich and complex but punchy, and the highs are more open than the TF. Have I used enough cliches? One other thing-it's LOUD. Much bigger sounding than the rated 500W. No shortage of headroom at all.

At the moment (chronic GASsy TBer disclaimer), I 'm really digging the Fusion 550. It's getting some great reviews around here, but quite frankly, I'm surprised it's not more popular. I'm guessing it's just the fact that it's a departure for GK from their core element. If you're looking for some tube warmth (very nice range- adjustable from subtle to somewhat overdriven), a big, deep/round-but-not-out-of-control low end, a punchy-but-not-harsh midrange, and an open top end, you should definitely check out the Fusion 550. I could do without the motorized knobs, but they are a non-issue for me as I am a set-it-and-forget-it kind of player. I think I just broke the hyphen key on my laptop!

All of the above is IMO and IME!

I hope this helps...

Cheers,
Kevin

 

[Alexander]

Thanks, Kevin - I have a pretty good idea what the basic GK sound is (though it's been a while since I tried one), so if its that with a really nice tube pre to warm things up, then it sounds right up my alley. I like what I'm hearing about the volume as well, because if I make the trade, I'd be dropping from 750w to 500w - I typically play the Tfunk with volume around 4-5, so I want to make sure I get there if I make the switch. I'm going to see if I can find one to try...

 

[Alexander]

Have you tried diming the enhance knob and rolling the timbre knob back to around 9 o'clock? Yes it cuts some mids, but not as much as one might think. It also manages to pull off a convincing clean tube thing. Not as punchy with a hint of bloom to the note.

Just something to try before blowing any $.

I've played with enhance and timbre and can get a nice tone in my practice room, but doesn't cut it on gigs (for me). I read somewhere I think that Dave thinks the amp sounds best set flat, with Timbre at 10:30 and Enhance at noon, which I'm going to give a try at practice this week. It isn't too far from where I am in my "normal" setting - Timbre at 11:00 and Enhance between 3 and 4...

 

[Alexander]

Yep - after spending a good part of my day yesterday with the rig, I've decided to make the switch (which I really hope I don't regret!). There is so much to love about the TF750A, but it just isn't the tone in my head. It has worked incredibly well in some musical situations, but less so in others. And unless the new head has just some sort of amazing love fest with the Epifani, the cab is probably history too...

What I'm hoping to get is an "updated vintage" type of tone and so will start off with the GK Fusion 550 head and go from there. Being here in the UK, it seems to be VERY difficult to get my hands on one to try out. I will likely order online where I have a couple weeks' "money back guarantee" so I can field test it and try it with a bunch of other cabs as needed. If I switch cabs, I'll likely try to go with GK NEO cabs or (if I can swing it) something from the Berg NV line.

Any thoughts on the cab pairing with the GK Fusion? I don't know anyone driving an NV series cab with one and wondering how that might fit together. Any other suggestions on amp\cab pairings, I'm open to as well.

Essentially, I'm looking for gutsy, warm, fat, clear, round punchy tone with a bit of growl - I play fingerstyle exclusively and gravitate toward blues, southern rock and "kicked-up" country (Allman Bros-ish). Needs to play well with my Sadowsky (braz RW board, nickel strings, SC pickups)

 

[kobass]

I've gigged the Fusion 550 with my GK Neo 212-2 (4 ohm) and my Bergantino AE410. It really works great with both, but I'd have to give the nod to the GK cab for what you are looking for. It's about half the price of the Berg (here in the US), and is a very even-sounding cab.

 

[Alexander]

Well, I made the leap and moved the TF750A - sure as heck hope I'm doing the right thing. Will try out the Fusion 550 first and I should be able to pick it up on Tuesday\Wednesday of next week. Will have to let you know if it is a step in the right direction for me or will be crying in my beer...