My hope was that they would just put the Fender name or not on the current GB line , keeping the build here , use GB R&D and use Fenders website for marketing & distro in an effort to expand consumer awareness of the GB line of amps and cabs. Wishful thinking on my part , moving the build to China is the first domino to fall.
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Future of Genz Benz?
- Thread starter SeayBass
- Start date
Unless "here" for you is Korea, then you should know that GB hasn't been made in the states in a long time.
I'm still curious what the Genz brand could be worth from a business standpoint. I still maintain that they're just not that well known to the general musician public.
I have seen a couple/few old blues players move to little shuttle rigs, I assume because they're so small and handy, plus well built, sound good, etc., but I still see probabky a thousand Ampegs, GK's, Hartkes, SWR's, Peaveys, etc. for every one Genz I see around here.
I have seen a couple/few old blues players move to little shuttle rigs, I assume because they're so small and handy, plus well built, sound good, etc., but I still see probabky a thousand Ampegs, GK's, Hartkes, SWR's, Peaveys, etc. for every one Genz I see around here.
I have a Streamliner 900 that I adore through my Aggie DB212 and DB112's. In light of the impending fate of GB, I'm trying to decide if I should pick up a Shuttlemax12.2, Uber410, Uber Quad stack, or another Streamliner.
I sincerely hope that Fender uses the expertise of Jeff Genzler to make truly incredible bass gear. When they bought SWR they were already at a disadvantage because Steve Rabe had already distanced himself from the company. I hope this turn out better than the that situation.
I sincerely hope that Fender uses the expertise of Jeff Genzler to make truly incredible bass gear. When they bought SWR they were already at a disadvantage because Steve Rabe had already distanced himself from the company. I hope this turn out better than the that situation.
+1 Remember that Genz used Talkbass VERY effectively as a marketing tool (lots of participation, lots of endorsements given out to TBers, etc.).
My guess is, the TB community, more than with most other brands, does not in any way represent the market share and awareness of Genz.
I haven't kept up with it, but I know Fender was attempting to go public a while back and it didn't work (i.e., no interest, or whatever). I would assume, like most companies trying to get their act together, they are focusing on their core business and brands, eliminating smaller brand (a brand requires its own distribution, staff, etc.... complicated and expensive), and trying to fix some holes in their brand/product portfolio.
To me, VERY smart move to integrate this very nice product line into the Fender brand family. Shut down SWR, use the Genz staff and technology to possibly FINALLY make some solid state amps that would sell under the Fender name, and IMO all is good.
For example, from what I see around here, Ampeg really only needs to make 3 items...the SVT, the 810, and the 410 hlf cab. The next most popular item is probably the GK 700rb sitting on top the hlf cab. Next most popular is probably the Ampeg 3Pro.
You have to look long and hard to find a Genz anything.
It's certainly quality stuff, but I just haven't seen it penetrate the market out in the real world.
You have to look long and hard to find a Genz anything.
It's certainly quality stuff, but I just haven't seen it penetrate the market out in the real world.
It could just be me, but this screams typical.
GM, APPLE, MS, FORD, Gibson, Fender et al...have done this. Buy out the little guy. Not to incorporate their better product. But to silence it. To get it out of the way. Or Cheapen it to such a degree that nobody wants it.
For us a good example would be the Guild pilot bass. Fender raped it. Point blank raped it.
Kiss GB goodbye. Geoff will get lost in corporate hell. And eventually quit to work for someone else or retire.
IMO.
GM, APPLE, MS, FORD, Gibson, Fender et al...have done this. Buy out the little guy. Not to incorporate their better product. But to silence it. To get it out of the way. Or Cheapen it to such a degree that nobody wants it.
For us a good example would be the Guild pilot bass. Fender raped it. Point blank raped it.
Kiss GB goodbye. Geoff will get lost in corporate hell. And eventually quit to work for someone else or retire.
IMO.
It's hard to see how this makes any strategic sense, and isn't simply another futile exercise in corporate vanity...
MM
What many here seem to forget is that Fender dis not buy Genz, they bought Kaman, which owned Genz and about two dozen other music related Companies. There was probably very little, if any strategy wrapped around the Genz piece of the equation. This is obvious to anyone who realizes that the acquisition actually happened 5 years ago.
OK...I'm a dealer...and the rumors are true....Genz Benz is going away....there will be no more products with the Genz Benz name on them...and I was told they are going to China with all the amps....no word on the cabs yet.
I have an opinion on this....but it's probably best that I keep it to myself.
With all due respect, this is an awfully bold statement to make without any verification.
It does make sense.
I'm not basing my opinion on talkbass popularity, but rather just random stuff I see in everyday life.
Walk by a bar...hey, there's a band in there, what's the bass player using?
Or go see a friends originals band and there's 4 or 5 bands on the bill for that night. You're going to see at least 2 Ampegs, at least one GK, probably a rack rig or a Mesa or something and maybe one something else but it's not going to be a Genz.
I'm just telling you the deal I got. If you read the MF price match details you SHOULD have gotten a $100 credit. I lucked up on the free shipping.
I don't go out to hear other bands very often these days, but I've never seen another GB amp in use.
I get as many "I never heard of that amp" comments from other bass players as I do about about my fEARful cabinets.
I get as many "I never heard of that amp" comments from other bass players as I do about about my fEARful cabinets.
"Could be worth" is the key phrase, IMO.
When assessing the value of a brand, you have to look not only at the worth it has to offer right here and now, but also at the potential value it could develop in future, given the right quality & quantity of additional resources put at its disposal.
Small, boutique companies such as Genz Benz virtually have to create a superior product in order to compete at all with the Gallien Kruegers and the Ampegs of the world - because they surely can't do it with sheer size & might alone.
But think of how far a brand like Genz Benz could go - kept intact - but with the marketing & distribution muscle of a company like Fender. If what you've stated about the relative obscurity of Genz Benz is true, and TalkBass members constitute only a small fraction of the number of bassists throughout the world (or even throughout the USA & Canada), it would suggest strongly that there is a large untapped market for premium bass gear that Genz Benz would never have been able to reach on its own.
MM
"Could be worth" is the key phrase, IMO.
When assessing the value of a brand, you have to look not only at the worth it has to offer right here and now, but also at the potential value it could develop in future, given the right quality & quantity of additional resources put at its disposal.
Small, boutique companies such as Genz Benz virtually have to create a superior product in order to compete at all with the Gallien Kruegers and the Ampegs of the world - because they surely can't do it with sheer size & might alone.
But think of how far a brand like Genz Benz could go - kept intact - but with the marketing & distribution muscle of a company like Fender. If what you've stated about the relative obscurity of Genz Benz is true, and TalkBass members constitute only a small fraction of the number of bassists throughout the world (or even throughout the USA & Canada), it would suggest strongly that there is a large untapped market for premium bass gear that Genz Benz would never have been able to reach on its own.
MM
I get where you're coming from....but I highly doubt FMIC is going to handle it that way.
My curiosity about it's worth is because so few people know about them. The "brand" can't carry much weight. People don't know if it's quality or not when they don't even know what it is or aren't even aware it exists.
GK, Ampeg & Mesa are going to continue to dominate the bar band scene as long as bar bands continue to exist. They're durable, relatively cheap (except for Mesa), and LOUD! I'm not persuaded that bar band use is a fair measure for Genz Benz.
Genz Benz is in another class - the same or similar one as Glockenklang, Tecamp, Thunderfunk, Euphonic Audio, and Baer Amplification (as soon as Roger gets his new head to market). You're less likely to see any of those brands in the bars. But you may see them in wedding bands, corporate bands, and show bands. Different demographic, different segment.
MM
I think you're right. That's why it's such a damn shame.
Well, everyone's subjective impression of that is going to be different. There are ways of objectively measuring such things (i.e. market research). But that's probably beyond the scope of this discussion.
Personally, I'm not convinced that the Genz Benz brand is quite so obscure as you suggest. But putting that case aside, if you look only at the quantitative dimension (i.e. brand recognition x number of people), you miss a big part of the picture.
There's also the qualitative dimension, i.e. how good is the opinion of the brand by people who are acquainted with it? For years, Genz Benz has been able to charge a premium price for their products, because the quality of their products speaks for itself. The ability to charge a premium price - and get it: There's the value of the qualitative dimension.
Now if, for the sake of argument, Fender was willing to invest in the Genz Benz brand by allowing it to take advantage of the same economies of scale that Fender itself enjoys (i.e. in materials procurement, in manufacturing costs, marketing expenses, etc.), then you'd have a scenario for a greater profit margin - i.e. retail prices remain steady + costs of doing business decrease = more revenue. And that's not even factoring in the huge market reach that Fender could provide, that could raise the Genz Benz profile like it's never been raised before.
MM
Seeing great deals on the ShuttleMax and GBE. Has anyone seen any Streamliners out there at a discount?
