Gary Willis' Right Hand... OMG

[Wasnex]

So I went back and listened to video #1 in post 1. Basically the video focuses primarily on playing pentatonic chords over D min. He demonstrates three options:
1. starting on the root, D minor pentatonic (DFGAC)
2. starting on the 5th, A minor pentatonic (ACDEG)
3. starting on the 2nd (or 9th), E minor pentatonic (EGABD) Note we are following cyle of 5ths, I.E. D to A to E

Obviously the third option starts to get "out" a bit as you play a B natural, so it will sound like D dorian instead of D aeolian.

 

[smeet]

So I went back and listened to video #1 in post 1. Basically the video focuses primarily on playing pentatonic chords over D min. He demonstrates three options:
1. starting on the root, D minor pentatonic (DFGAC)
2. starting on the 5th, A minor pentatonic (ACDEG)
3. starting on the 2nd (or 9th), E minor pentatonic (EGABD) Note we are following cyle of 5ths, I.E. D to A to E

Obviously the third option starts to get "out" a bit as you play a B natural, so it will sound like D dorian instead of D aeolian.

It’s a very nice simple way to change up the sound, introduce different tensions, but still get a bluesy feel. Scott Henderson does similar stuff with pentatonics, I wonder if they came up with the concept together.

 

[Wasnex]

Scott Henderson does similar stuff with pentatonics, I wonder if they came up with the concept together.

Nah, there are all sorts pentatonic study books you can buy that teach these concepts. I worked through this idea some probably 15 or 20 years ago, but never had the chance to hear it, like in the video; so I never tried to apply it in a live setting.

Earlier today I was working in the Real Book and tried subbing in the minor pentatonic formed off the 5th of minor 7th chords and it definitely sounded cool and opened up some fresh ideas .

 

[IamGroot]

Gary is a unique talent and person. An incredible bassist and a funny guy.

A funny guy?
A FUNNY GUY?

 

[kesslari]

I used to take lessons from Gary back in the 80's. He made me a ramp, too. I used it for a while, but I could never get along with it. And I could never get his right hand technique down. Gary is a straight up monster of a player, a great guy and an excellent educator (my mediocre skills not withstanding). Glad to have had the chance to study under him.

I was similarly blessed. Sadly I was young and stupid and too focused on technique. I developed a really good floating thumb, but I missed out on a lot of the musicality that he could have taught me.
Youth is wasted on the young

 

[bass4more]

I was similarly blessed. Sadly I was young and stupid and too focused on technique. I developed a really good floating thumb, but I missed out on a lot of the musicality that he could have taught me.
Youth is wasted on the young

Yes, I wish I could go back to that time with an adult's mindset. I was 18-19 years old at the time. It wasn't a total loss or anything. Gary taught me a lot, especially about ear training, but I would have learned more if I had been more mature.

 

[Les Fret]

So are there any other famous players besides GW that use the same right hand technique?

 

[Brad Johnson]

This is nothing new. I think his right hand technique is highly specialized for him. I haven't seen many other players use. Are there any?

Also I don't really see the point in dampening the higher string with the ring finger. It gets damped automatically with the left hand most of the time so no real need to damp it with the right hand.

People seem to think that when they practice his right technique they will have the same speed as GW but that's not the case. And the same speed can be accomplished with other right hand techniques.

Also I am not convinced that a ramp will add speed.

Utilizing the technique that a ramp encourages can definitely speed up plucking, from a simple economy of motion aspect. Much like playing over a pickup that is very close to the strings. It's actually a pretty simple concept... that some tend to overthink.

Once you're used to it the same technique can carry over even without a ramp IME.

 

[maturanesa]

i think 3 fingers is good for speed. Other than that, its more simple to keep using two.
3 fingers is trickier for the mind...

 

[vindibona1]

i think 3 fingers is good for speed. Other than that, its more simple to keep using two.
3 fingers is trickier for the mind...

I think I would agree. It is easy to create a consistent method to use two fingers. Three is more complicated. I think to incorporate the third finger one would have to do it instinctively- or spend a ton of time learning to habitually use a "three pattern" within duples.

I find I can do some of the GW style instinctively, but when I start to think about it my left hand gets wonky. I don't know it more practice will make it better or ruin the two finger technique that I've been working hard to develop?

 

[Wasnex]

I think I would agree. It is easy to create a consistent method to use two fingers. Three is more complicated. I think to incorporate the third finger one would have to do it instinctively- or spend a ton of time learning to habitually use a "three pattern" within duples.

I find I can do some of the GW style instinctively, but when I start to think about it my left hand gets wonky. I don't know it more practice will make it better or ruin the two finger technique that I've been working hard to develop?

I am getting to the point where I use the ring finger sort of like a bridge to setup a jump across strings. GW also speaks of using the ring finger as a bridge for string crossings, but he does it differently.

After watching the video, I observed how I naturally use the third finger at this time, and the shape of my hand is generally inverted from what GW does. Instead of 123 being low to high I have been using 321 from low to high. So it seems natural to me to play a low note with the ring finger (3), and then jump up a fifth or octave and play 2,1 to continue the pattern. Also, I believe I normally start two finger pattern with my middle finger (2). Of course, there are times when syncopations and interval jumps in a line require you start the line with one finger or the other, so my technique is not so limited that I can only play one way.

I have been practicing repeated Thumb (T)321 as well as T123 patterns. Also 123123, 321321, and 12321. I don't really have any goals, so my practice is not very disciplined. I am just sort of seeing if anything breaks loose that I find useful. So far I can easily play faster sustained tempos if I just use 1,2. But it does seem useful to add the three when the are certain syncopations and interval jumps.

 

[vindibona1]

I am getting to the point where I use the ring finger sort of like a bridge to setup a jump across strings. GW also speaks of using the ring finger as a bridge for string crossings, but he does it differently.

After watching the video, I observed how I naturally use the third finger at this time, and the shape of my hand is generally inverted from what GW does. Instead of 123 being low to high I have been using 321 from low to high. So it seems natural to me to play a low note with the ring finger (3), and then jump up a fifth or octave and play 2,1 to continue the pattern. Also, I believe I normally start two finger pattern with my middle finger (2). Of course, there are times when syncopations and interval jumps in a line require you start the line with one finger or the other, so my technique is not so limited that I can only play one way.

I have been practicing repeated Thumb (T)321 as well as T123 patterns. Also 123123, 321321, and 12321. I don't really have any goals, so my practice is not very disciplined. I am just sort of seeing if anything breaks loose that I find useful. So far I can easily play faster sustained tempos if I just use 1,2. But it does seem useful to add the three when the are certain syncopations and interval jumps.

I guess there are a lot of different ways to do it. Like you, I often naturally want to start the alternation with M and actually feel comfortable alternating IRIRIR. I think as I try to work my ring finger into the mix I'll figure out ways to do it comfortably without thinking. One of the things that using that third finger can do is sometimes smooth out the articulation.

 

[bassrique]

I came up with a similar solution as a kid. I often lay my pinky on the highest string and ring on next string like some guitarists do. I don't string cross with the ring though. It's mostly for muting. The floating thumb helps. My forearm mutes when playing slap. My left hand handles much of the muting, but I am a muting enthusiast and really make sure everything is tamped down.

Playing at about 50% volume is something I find good for the reasons Willis says.

 

[Joshua Vance]

Can anyone offer some advice on how to use the GW right hand on a minor scale? His instruction for the major, let’s say C starting from 8th fret on the low E, is index on C, mute with middle, middle then plays D, mute with thumb and advance to E with ring as you jump to the A string.. index on F, mute with middle, middle then plays G, etc... but what if I’m playing A minor and initially and want to play the first THREE notes all on the E string from the 5th fret, as opposed to the C major where you’re only play TWO notes on the E string before going up a string. I guess, when DONT I lead a string change with the ring finger?

 

[bass nitro]

i think 3 fingers is good for speed. Other than that, its more simple to keep using two.
3 fingers is trickier for the mind...

Not only speed,believe me and also,you have subconscious,right?

 

[Lackey]

Can anyone offer some advice on how to use the GW right hand on a minor scale? His instruction for the major, let’s say C starting from 8th fret on the low E, is index on C, mute with middle, middle then plays D, mute with thumb and advance to E with ring as you jump to the A string.. index on F, mute with middle, middle then plays G, etc... but what if I’m playing A minor and initially and want to play the first THREE notes all on the E string from the 5th fret, as opposed to the C major where you’re only play TWO notes on the E string before going up a string. I guess, when DONT I lead a string change with the ring finger?

I notice that I often start an ascending line with my middle finger, and my index seems adept at jumping to the next string, my middle a little less so, hence the ring flying up. So this is how I might play it:


I M I
A I M
I M I
M I M
(Bottom up, A is ring)

So now that I kinda write it out, the ring doesn't get used very much in my case, although if I start on index it would get another shout out most likely.

Gary developed this system as it worked for him, I don't know that my version is all that similar but I think that's OK as everyone is different. I use PIMA a lot and my right hand seem to move without me noticing much these days unless I totally flub a note.