Graphite bars or Quartersawn? Which is better?

[Runlikegregg]

Not trying to spam, but we use one piece necks with a ratio of 10% carbon fiber to 90% maple - no trussrod, no issues. Ever. It's glorious. Tonally, it's great, too - more sustain, absolutely no dead spots ever, more even response from string to string...

I left my bass in our van the last two weeks (temps hovering around 1F certain nights), got on stage on Saturday still in tune.

Hey! what's up man! we played with you in Brooklyn at Hank's.

 

[Runlikegregg]

my 2 cents:
I have a G&L that I've played with no issues for close to 15 years.
no dead spots, great action, stable as can be.
I try to keep it in a case. to keep it that way.

 

[Gilmourisgod]

A timely thread, as I'll be cutting slots for graphite rods into my Rick bass 4001 clone build this weekend, and I'm a little concerned about making the neck TOO stiff. It's a hard rock maple neck through design per the original, but I'm using a modern double action trussrod and (2) 1/8" x 1/4" graphite bars, one each side of the trussrod. The neck is a two-piece lamination with the grain oriented so it's effectively quarter-sawn. I've always read that a Rick bass neck should be as close to dead flat as possible, but am I going to get into trouble if it's so stiff I can't introduce some relief?

The MIM Cabronita neck on my PJ has served me well. It's required very few adjustments over the years and I'm happy with it.

But the obsessive compuslive in me is concerned about long term stability. 20 or 30 years down the line long term. I've been looking at Warmoth necks with either graphite or steel (I'm not concerned about weight). I've been looking at buying an American Standard Fender and selling the body and keeping the neck.

But aren't all graphite necks the winners of the stability game?

I think so, my Steinberger composite neck is impervious, or as near as matters to impervious, to changes in temperature and humidity, with no dead spots. It's just exactly the same every time I pick it up. The only rap against the Modulus necks I've heard is the weight, which can introduce neck dive, which obviously isn't an issue with headless designs.

 

[bholder]

I may have exaggerated a little. I counted them once years ago, but don't remember the number. Still it is a bit unusual looking. Not mine, but:

I counted 36, but might've skipped or double counted one either way...

 

[Hopkins]

I've been involved in several tests on this - quarter sawn wood is significantly stronger than flat sawn. And a properly made quarter sawn neck will be less likely to twist than the same flat sawn neck. But, selecting the wood for proper grain orientation (which leads to stability) is indeed an important part of the job of building a good neck. That said, the same piece of wood, properly selected for stability, will be stronger and more stable quarter sawn than flat, 100 times out of 100.

You're entitled to your opinion on the graphite reinforcement, but I'll take it over not having it - better to have and not need than to need and not have.

Strong and stable are two different things. I've built plenty of necks, the only two that I have had problems with were quarter sawn maple, both times they developed a twist as the humidity dropped. Both of these neck blanks had a very straight and vertical grain orientation, both were stable until carved. Flat sawn maple may need a little more truss rod adjustment to counter string tension, but it is not more prone to movement under weather changes than quarter sawn, and by my own personal experience is less likely to twist. Also, personally I think it looks better.

But I would like to know the details of the test you were involved in on this subject matter.

 

[Bob_Ross]

we use one piece necks with a ratio of 10% carbon fiber to 90% maple

The Semantics Police in me wants to know how a neck made from two completely different materials can still be referred to as a "one piece neck"

...but seriously: are you saying you put carbon reinforcing bars in a neck carved from a single piece of maple?

 

[Nedmundo]

Op here - yea multi lam plus bars would be great but I have limited choices. I an debating btwn Fender am std P bass and g&l LB100. The fender is flat sawn with bars, the G&L quarter sawn with no bars.

So for me it is an "or" not an "and".

I have four and five string American Standard Fender Jazz basses with the graphite bars, and previously owned two Precisions with the bars. I also have recent G&L M-2500 and JB basses with quartersawn necks, and a relatively recent G&L SB-2 with a flatsawn neck. For tuning stability, my 2003 Fender Jazz four is probably the best, but the quartersawn G&L's are close. The G&L quartersawn necks feel very solid, and my M-2500's quartersawn neck is notably more solid and stable than my 2008 Fender Jazz V's neck. The quartersawn necks seem to resonate a little differently in a manner that's difficult to describe, which I can feel while playing, but I'm not sure whether it affects the tone.

So, I think both Fender's graphite reinforced necks and G&L's quartersawn are exellent, and you can't go wrong either way. On average I'm not sure what the differences would be, but for G&L I'd be inclined to get the quartersawn option, especially on fivers where the additional solidity might matter a little more.

 

[giglawyer]

One person's great tone induces another's gag reflex.

Well said.

 

[bholder]

The Semantics Police in me wants to know how a neck made from two completely different materials can still be referred to as a "one piece neck"

...but seriously: are you saying you put carbon reinforcing bars in a neck carved from a single piece of maple?

Not sure this qualifies, but I've read that some cut a single piece lengthwise, route the pieces for reinforcements, then glue it back together & call it "one piece" - kind of true, kind of not. Whether or not that technique is good, regardless of what it's called, I don't really know.

 

[interp]

I may have exaggerated a little. I counted them once years ago, but don't remember the number. Still it is a bit unusual looking. Not mine, but:

I had a Kubicki many years ago with one of these necks. Never had a more unstable neck in my life. I got rid of it after about a year.

 

[awilkie84]

More info. I've had Warmoth necks. Stable, lack of dead spots but unfortunately, with the steel bars and double expanding truss rod, rather bright sounding. I want a more traditional sound but don't want a vintage neck with an icky single-action truss rod.

So I'm looking at G&L (double-actioin truss rod, no bars, quartersawn) vs. Fender (graphite bars, flatsawn). I'm thinking G&L.

That would likely be less on the rods and more on the wood/finish/electronics. -_- I'm sorry but steel/graphite bars really don't play into the tone enough to make that kind of difference.

 

[orange joe]

My Togar is a 5 piece with graphite rods and double action truss rod.Coulnt be happier with it

 

[MR PC]

I had a quarter sawn one piece maple neck. Didn't even have to tune the bass after days of not touching the bass at all.

This is the Holy Grail. At least for me!

 

[MR PC]

No, that neck is made from Stratabond, Martin uses the same stuff on some of their guitar necks. Its definitely a multi lam, high quality ply.

A friend of mine calls this "Propeller Wood". I believe the Phillip Kubuki basses are made this way. I've owned instruments from Teisco using this construction method..right now I own A Kawai shortscale hollowbody built this way. It's a huge neck, sounds wonderful. So stable that the truss rod is only tight enough to keep it from rattling. Some Renaisanace era necks, lutes, viols, ect used this kind of construction. Very stable necks.

 

[awilkie84]

The Semantics Police in me wants to know how a neck made from two completely different materials can still be referred to as a "one piece neck"

...but seriously: are you saying you put carbon reinforcing bars in a neck carved from a single piece of maple?

I don't quite understand how you'd get them in there...

 

[awilkie84]

I had a quarter sawn one piece maple neck. Didn't even have to tune the bass after days of not touching the bass at all.

I had a MIM Fender Classic 50's P with this...and stupidly sold it...
Also had a Fender MP Jazz Satin Black with this...and stupidly sold it, too!!

 

[Hidesert]

I think using well selected, properly cured wood to build a neck is more important than any other variable. That said, I would personally prefer a used, "seasoned" neck that is straight, to a new instrument that might change in the first year or two.

 

[wvbass]

That looks like a single quartersawn/riffsawn piece to me. Look at the grain on the end of the heel.

You are clearly someone who has never seen a Kubicki before.

I had a Kubicki many years ago with one of these necks. Never had a more unstable neck in my life. I got rid of it after about a year.

Huh. I guess that just goes to show that, when you are working with wood, there are no absolute guarantees.

 

[tminus10]

I have a bass for sale with a quartersawn AND graphite rod neck. I live in one of the most humid climates in the USA. Never given me any problems. What say you now? Wanna buy it?

But as far as stability goes, you cant beat all graphite necks like Zon or Modulus. But you have to dig the tone I guess. Wish I still had my Zon

 

[Gaolee]

I may have exaggerated a little. I counted them once years ago, but don't remember the number. Still it is a bit unusual looking. Not mine, but:

I have a 1960s Japanese hollow body, I think it is a Canora, but who really knows. Its neck is made of veneers like that, and it doesn't move at all. It sounds great, too. It's as close to an upright bass sound as I have heard from a BG (yeah, I know, nothing is the same, yadda, yadda...) I don't know why more aren't built that way. I live in a place that's got a reasonably stable climate, so neck movement isn't that big an issue after the wood ages a bit and settles down. My experience has been that a neck will move around for a year or two, but then it will move less and less over time.

The P has a bit of a dead spot, but the odd thing is that the Ric has a worse dead spot, and in a weird place: on the D string mostly, around the 7th and 8th frets. G is a little thumpy, but the D string is where it doesn't ring out as much. And here's the oddest thing - the dead spot seems to be fading. How does that work, anyway? It must be all in my head.