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Hadrien Feraud is approaching G.O.A.T. status.

#42
Sparkl said:
Hadrien Feraud is an instituton and a powerhouse. There is literally nobody on this planet atm with such wide musical vocabulary and such precision and masterful execution. On top of that all of his lines, no matter how crazy, always sound sweet.
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As much as I like Hadrien Ferraud (Spirit Fingers first album is a masterpiece), there are many other players I'd put on par with him. Damian Erskine, Janek Gwizdala (check his records), Richard Bona, Etienne MBappe, John Patitucci, to name a few.
EDIT : actually the whole list he called on his post.
 
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#43
knight of ni said:
As much as I like Hadrien Ferraud (Spirit Fingers first album is a masterpiece), there are many other players I'd put on par with him. Damian Erskine, Janek Gwizdala (check his records), Richard Bona, Etienne MBappe, John Patitucci, to name a few.
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Yeah, you can, vocabulary-wise, but they cannot match his technique. It's just ridiculous what he does. Go check out his solo on Friday Night at the Cadillac Club. It's ********.

But yeah, there is no definitive way to rank a musician, so of course, they all reach for the top, no doubt.
 
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#44
Sparkl said:
Go check out his solo on Friday Night at the Cadillac Club.
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Yes, that's impressive. My bass teacher regularly came across HF when his was young and told me he wasn't especially gifted and certainly worked a lot to reach his current musical level. This is a lesson for those who think apparent lack of natural skill is an excuse for not practising. One could even go further and say natural gift can be an impairment because when everything is so easy the day you need to really work and practice (which always happens) then you're in trouble. Just a thought.
 
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#45
Chickenwheels said:
He sounds like Jaco.
For once, I’d love to hear a bassist solo without using horn phrasing and harmonics. It’s been my mission to avoid those things when soloing lately. Actually, it’s been my mission to avoid soloing period. I grudgingly did one on Saturday, at a wedding. Gritted my teeth. So lame, and no one fills my shoes while I take time out from being the bass player. Aaarghh!
(Actually I don’t really care. HF has worked hard and I applaud that).
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I feel like this is somewhat a lazy description of what's going on here. And I do realise that this is not a conversation where there can be right or wrong when we discuss if something resembles another thing. To you it might, to me it might not or vice versa, feeling of resemblance is subjective I can handle that.

But to begin with: the harmonics actually represent a very insignificant part of his solo (only 2 times in a single fragment). He plays chords more than he does harmonics which tells you he was checking other soloists than horns. And even if you transcribe other instrumentalists, they probably studied horn players themselves at some point so we're at the point where it's kind of hard to tell who copied who.

Do I hear some Jaco? Sure, now and then. But I also hear Matt Garrisson or modern gospel and r'n'b bassists or Kurt Rosenwinkel or Michael Brecker. The way he rhythmically phrases most of what he plays is super laid back and Jaco was usually in the middle or slightly in front. Than there's his technique - he's using his thumb a lot. Even his in his sound I don't hear this excessive bump in the mids that Jaco was known for which Richard Bona still uses to this day.

This is a very well balanced solo in my opinion.

knight of ni said:
As much as I like Hadrien Ferraud (Spirit Fingers first album is a masterpiece), there are many other players I'd put on par with him. Damian Erskine, Janek Gwizdala (check his records), Richard Bona, Etienne MBappe, John Patitucci, to name a few.
EDIT : actually the whole list he called on his post.
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I honestly believe Richard Bona doesn't belong in this same group when it comes to vocabulary. As far as his abilities go he's hard to match. Great timing, super fast right hand. He's a great singer too and he's a prolific bandleader but his jazz vocabulary is not good.

He literally keeps spamming the same lick combined with some pentatonic / blues ideas (and I mean this in a most basic way, not where you superimpose pentatonic scale over a chord to get another color) combined with one of his percussive / slide things. I know this because I've transcribed some of his solos (I can't play them, because obviously he's an amazing musician and I'm not).
 
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#46
knight of ni said:
Yes, that's impressive. My bass teacher regularly came across HF when his was young and told me he wasn't especially gifted and certainly worked a lot to reach his current musical level. This is a lesson for those who think apparent lack of natural skill is an excuse for not practising. One could even go further and say natural gift can be an impairment because when everything is so easy the day you need to really work and practice (which always happens) then you're in trouble. Just a thought.
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This! There is no such thing as "naturally gifted" (minus the perfect pitch dudes, what I'd do to have that lol). One does indeed become gifted though, as you said, by hard practice and long term investment :)
 
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#48
doran.dragic said:
I honestly believe Richard Bona doesn't belong in this same group when it comes to vocabulary. As far as his abilities go he's hard to match. Great timing, super fast right hand. He's a great singer too and he's a prolific bandleader but his jazz vocabulary is not good.
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That may be true but I wasn't especially discussing jazz vocabulary, rather interesting bass players in a broad sense. Bona played with the Zawinul Syndicate so he certainly has a lot of vocabulary... of some sort.
 
#50
knight of ni said:
That may be true but I wasn't especially discussing jazz vocabulary, rather interesting bass players in a broad sense. Bona played with the Zawinul Syndicate so he certainly has a lot of vocabulary... of some sort.
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I get what you're trying to say. You're right, Richard Bona played with a lot of jazz musicians like Pat Metheny or Steps Ahead. I think he's an amazing musician and maybe the most successful bandleader of all the bassists mentioned in that post.
 
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#51
knight of ni said:
Yes, that's impressive. My bass teacher regularly came across HF when his was young and told me he wasn't especially gifted and certainly worked a lot to reach his current musical level. This is a lesson for those who think apparent lack of natural skill is an excuse for not practising. One could even go further and say natural gift can be an impairment because when everything is so easy the day you need to really work and practice (which always happens) then you're in trouble. Just a thought.
Click to expand...

I know from academic experience that it can be hard to buckle down when things come easy.
 
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#55
doran.dragic said:
I feel like this is somewhat a lazy description of what's going on here. And I do realise that this is not a conversation where there can be right or wrong when we discuss if something resembles another thing. To you it might, to me it might not or vice versa, feeling of resemblance is subjective I can handle that.

But to begin with: the harmonics actually represent a very insignificant part of his solo (only 2 times in a single fragment). He plays chords more than he does harmonics which tells you he was checking other soloists than horns. And even if you transcribe other instrumentalists, they probably studied horn players themselves at some point so we're at the point where it's kind of hard to tell who copied who.

Do I hear some Jaco? Sure, now and then. But I also hear Matt Garrisson or modern gospel and r'n'b bassists or Kurt Rosenwinkel or Michael Brecker. The way he rhythmically phrases most of what he plays is super laid back and Jaco was usually in the middle or slightly in front. Than there's his technique - he's using his thumb a lot. Even his in his sound I don't hear this excessive bump in the mids that Jaco was known for which Richard Bona still uses to this day.

This is a very well balanced solo in my opinion.


I honestly believe Richard Bona doesn't belong in this same group when it comes to vocabulary. As far as his abilities go he's hard to match. Great timing, super fast right hand. He's a great singer too and he's a prolific bandleader but his jazz vocabulary is not good.

He literally keeps spamming the same lick combined with some pentatonic / blues ideas (and I mean this in a most basic way, not where you superimpose pentatonic scale over a chord to get another color) combined with one of his percussive / slide things. I know this because I've transcribed some of his solos (I can't play them, because obviously he's an amazing musician and I'm not).
Click to expand...

I wish I could use the idea over and over again as well as Richard Bona.:bassist:
 
#56
When I think goat I don’t just think of a singular greatest but of what people in that particular field of interest pushed the boundaries further than they previously were.
Even that is subjective to a degree but if you think of a GOAT in that respect you can make an easier time of differentiating between being good and being unique.
 
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#57
I have a theory, or observation, that I'll never be able to share here or anywhere, about some people rushing ahead of the beat while some naturally lay back, even playing a little behind the beat, which I find much more pleasant. Don't most people?
 
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#58
Dr. Cheese said:
I wish I could use the idea over and over again as well as Richard Bona.:bassist:
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There was a time when I absolutely hated it because he'd usually normally use it at a fast tempo setting and just throw it in or maybe at a double time speed of the tempo was slower but a couple of weeks ago I came across one of his newer flamenco videos and he actually plays it over a 6/8 rhythm in a different harmonic context and it actually sounds great. 4:15

I know, obviously it makes me seem bitter being here and taking my time to poopie on Richard Bona for having a poor jazz vocabulary but it's not really the reason why people listen to Bona's music anyway, right. Also I realise fully he comes from an environment where he needed to perform from an early age to earn his living and learning a jazz vocabulary wasn't a priority. Still, I get a bit triggered when people name him as this amazing jazz bassist. An amazing bassist or amazing musician, sure.

EDIT: funny thing happened - I was reading the other old HF thread that got locked at some point and came across this video where Etienne Mbappe abuses this same lick over and over again. I think somebody will have to do a thorough research on this lick at some point and hopefully compile it in a video.
 
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#59
He's way better than I'll ever be if I practice every hour of every day from here on, but he's doing that style that I quickly become fatigued listening to when played on bass. Do something similar on guitar and I'll listen perpetually. Charlie Hunter on his self-titled debut for example, is something I enjoy listening to. A lot of notes and chords on bass gets muddy and jumbled and I quickly check out. They just aren't the strengths of the instrument, IMHO.
 
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