Never been sold on the whole tube amp thing for bass... maybe I'm wrong, but to my ears I don't hear a huge difference with bass... guitar it's more apparent, but with bass I feel like it's more important to have a good pre and reliable power.
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have the D's toppled the SVT's?
- Thread starter MJ_Sotti
- Start date
I hate this forum. You guys and all your comments in this thread make me wanna go out and buy more amps. Yet I can't stop reading it. 
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Buy whatever you prefer. If your a gigging musician who does it to make money though, save your back. Everyone should give the D stuff a chance, after all, most music is listened to via mp3 on an iphone and earbuds. Not to mention, many times the bass is run direct when recording or playing live, so nobody will ever know the awesome power yielded by your prized rig. Each to his/her own.
You guys make me feel like pulling my CL out of the classifieds
Probably will
Probably will
I once put a concrete brick in a box and put my Subway 800 in with just cause I felt I was getting weak and whiny
Lol. I don't disagree with your statements but You just made the average bass player sound like a metrosexual wussy afraid of doing a little work.
Driving around in a smart car with a pocket amp. I'm not intending to dis anyone here but you just painted a bleak future in my mind.
And for the record my home rig is a D class head with a 210 +212. It sounds decent. I'm open to them as If a rig sounds good I won't discriminate. But at the end of the day my svt 4 pro blows it away.........I know it's not a true tube amp but it's a night and day difference from the D class. I'll take doing a little more work and hauling some heavy gear over settling on a sub standard tone. But that is just my opinion.
On that note I do understand that not every gig requires an 810 either....
BASS = POWER!!!
Don't just hear it! Feel it!
That wasn't really my intention, but the "hit and run" future of the musician is sort of written on the wall. Nearly all of the clubs I play don't have parking for their bands, and there tend to be 4-5 bands playing a night. Parking in a city like LA is tough, so a long walk carrying a tube head and making a second trip for a big 8x10, and then maybe a third for your basses\pedals\etc isn't fun. The whole "band van" thing doesn't really pan out for local musicians, and people are moving to smaller and smaller cars for a lot of reasons.
There's working harder and then there is working smarter. This isn't a strong man contest and I'd call moving 300lbs of gear more than a "little" work. If the pay is barely enough to pay for gas (if there is pay) then the pay certainly isn't enough for spinal surgery.
As far as I'm concerned SS is SS. The class D amps are just smaller SS. My Shuttle was plenty loud, but was a little light in the low end department. The D-800 I just got more than capable.
When ever I'm supplied a SVT in the back line I always disconnect it and plug my class d amp into the cab.
I'm not saying the SVT's sound bad, it's just easier for me to make adjustments on the fly with an amp I'm more familiar with. I also much prefer a mid sweep pot to a 5 position rotary switch like on the SVT
I'm not saying the SVT's sound bad, it's just easier for me to make adjustments on the fly with an amp I'm more familiar with. I also much prefer a mid sweep pot to a 5 position rotary switch like on the SVT
I haven't, but have played both separately and extensively during the same time period; and I would confidently do any gig with that combination.
In fact, that is an interesting combination to me personally and to this discussion; because at the time that I went strongly Class D, I was gigging the NV610, a cab I still adore, with a Trace Hexavalve on top, while rehearsing with the Peg CL. I liked the Trace equally; but, it was a more manageable schlepp. That was when I acquired a Shuttle 9.0; which I mainly intended to use for smaller in and out gigs; until one day I put the Shuttle 9 on top of the NV610. Which seemed laughable until I heard it. That was when I realized that I had been comparing apples and artichokes until I used the same cab. Really opened up my eyes. I still have the Shuttle, except it is more or less a practice amp, since there are significantly more potent CLASS D amps available now.
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When they finally come out with a Class Double D amp, then we'll see the tubes disappear.
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I do. It only leaves the studio about once a month for gigs. Not really a big deal to move. I also have the new Darkglass amp and am waiting for an AudioKinesis Hathor 212. This will most likely become my new gigging rig and the SVT and Berg will stay in the studio. We have FOH support for all our gigs so I'm pretty sure this new set up will be fine.
I think you're right and it's often overlooked I think, because many players, especially younger ones, don't have any direct or extended experience with tube heads, let alone having the chance to play one at volume with a real live, actual band. They (tubes and SS) can't genuinely be compared to each other and evaluated for their merits anywhere else but in a live playing or intimate studio context, IMO. Spending a few minutes comparing a 70lb tube head to a 2lb Class D in a music store and weighing the sonic pros and cons in that environment can be overshadowed by the D's sheer ease of transport and available volume at a very reachable price point. Class D becomes a more and more tempting proposition out of practicality, while tube becomes a seductress that is hard to resist once it's heard and felt in all its glory. Price is also a huge factor and tube amps and the costs associated with their transport and upkeep are increasingly becoming something reserved strictly for touring professional acts and/or those with enough disposable income to justify it.
I plug in a class D and use my own cab whenever I'm supplied an SVT rig as backline. I liked the SVT rig back in the 70's and didn't own one back then either. There are more options now.
You guys may not believe me, but I really don't care... I hooked up my Mesa D-800 to an SVT 810 cab and it sounded bigger than the SVT all tube head...wrap your head around that
Yep. I primarily use SVTs but have Class D amps I use too. I also have a Mesa Scout that I love to use.
Only in the looks department
Heritages do come with a higher grade of tubes (JJ's vs Sovtek) and they definitely look cooler, but the regular CL's are still very much SVT's.
The mass migration to Class D had already started several years back. First came the initial skepticism, then having them used by more musicians on stage. It was a non-argument, really-- two 40 pound cabs and an 8 pound head could now fill a large nightclub with Class D power and Neo cabs at roughly half the price.
SVT's were always the top of the food chain and back in the 80's when every little town had a half a dozen nightclubs and you could still make a decent wage-- in any band worth its salt, the bass player had one. I loved mine but hated moving it even when I was a whippersnapper. Then the advent of hip-hop, drone dance, and "dee-jays" put a large knife in the back of live music. Suddenly it wasn't so justifiable to buy a beautiful tuber and humongous cab to work when single act dee-jays made almost as much in one night and were taking your gigs.
Many here on TB are lucky enough to work year around in an area that supports bass players with a decent salary and stages that can handle an SVT. I'm very happy for them and hope the clubs and opportunities will always be there. But don't believe for a minute the excellent SVT will go away anytime in the near future. They are still professional backline because when your life career depends on it and the stakes are high, there will be a monster tuber there. And the cab too will always be there. There is NO SUBSTITUTE for the SVT/810 cab. PERIOD.
Ironically Ampeg is one of the manufacturers contributing to the SVT's decline in popularity because it's growing and evolving with the times. Ampeg has introduced many excellent alternatives to the SVT/810 yet still retain that "Ampeg tone" that everyone recognizes. They may not have that sweet all-tube tone but they are still Ampeg at heart and give the best convincing SVT style performance in smaller smarter packages.
Did Class D topple the SVT? No. Even from the assault of Class D, cheap nightclub owners, and DJ's, the SVT is alive and well at the top of the heap. SVT will always be king.
SVT's were always the top of the food chain and back in the 80's when every little town had a half a dozen nightclubs and you could still make a decent wage-- in any band worth its salt, the bass player had one. I loved mine but hated moving it even when I was a whippersnapper. Then the advent of hip-hop, drone dance, and "dee-jays" put a large knife in the back of live music. Suddenly it wasn't so justifiable to buy a beautiful tuber and humongous cab to work when single act dee-jays made almost as much in one night and were taking your gigs.
Many here on TB are lucky enough to work year around in an area that supports bass players with a decent salary and stages that can handle an SVT. I'm very happy for them and hope the clubs and opportunities will always be there. But don't believe for a minute the excellent SVT will go away anytime in the near future. They are still professional backline because when your life career depends on it and the stakes are high, there will be a monster tuber there. And the cab too will always be there. There is NO SUBSTITUTE for the SVT/810 cab. PERIOD.
Ironically Ampeg is one of the manufacturers contributing to the SVT's decline in popularity because it's growing and evolving with the times. Ampeg has introduced many excellent alternatives to the SVT/810 yet still retain that "Ampeg tone" that everyone recognizes. They may not have that sweet all-tube tone but they are still Ampeg at heart and give the best convincing SVT style performance in smaller smarter packages.
Did Class D topple the SVT? No. Even from the assault of Class D, cheap nightclub owners, and DJ's, the SVT is alive and well at the top of the heap. SVT will always be king.
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- Feb 12, 2006
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- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
I think that those who say you never see the larger bands or acts using class D amps have not been exposed to enough touring acts or genres to recognize the changes that are indeed happening at the higher levels too.
Here are a couple of examples from our players that might surprise the neigh-sayers, and every major manufacturer has artists playing their class D offerings as well:
Les Claypool – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
Bootsy Collins – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
James Lascu – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
In fact, I think it would be a great resource and reality check to see who other manufacturers have playing their class D amps. I think you all might be surprised, or "shocked".
Here are a couple of examples from our players that might surprise the neigh-sayers, and every major manufacturer has artists playing their class D offerings as well:
Les Claypool – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
Bootsy Collins – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
James Lascu – Artist | MESA/Boogie®
In fact, I think it would be a great resource and reality check to see who other manufacturers have playing their class D amps. I think you all might be surprised, or "shocked".
If I'm gigging and lugging my own gear to small bars, class d with neo cabs all the way. If I have a roadie crew or a recording studio it's going to be tubes and traditional cabs.
Seriously one is not better than the other, it comes down to personal sonic taste, and in many cases convenience.
I'm a tube man but many people aren't.
Even in my apartment though I'm happy with Pod Farm emulating the SVT while jamming through headphones.
The SS vs tube debates have been going on in the guitar world for a long time. Even some of the tube purists will admit they love many artists that use solid state.
Seriously one is not better than the other, it comes down to personal sonic taste, and in many cases convenience.
I'm a tube man but many people aren't.
Even in my apartment though I'm happy with Pod Farm emulating the SVT while jamming through headphones.
The SS vs tube debates have been going on in the guitar world for a long time. Even some of the tube purists will admit they love many artists that use solid state.
