Help with IEM’s

[skyline_01]

I have been using the Phenyx Pro PTM-22 IEM system for the past 3 years and over 100+ gigs. No issues whatsoever – just the occasional need to change a channel's frequency. Battery life is excellent. They now offer the PTM-33, which has (4) mono units in a single 1U rack. Stock earbuds are lame, so I prefer to use CCA C12 buds instead.

I've been using the Phenyx Pro PTM-10 for about a year now with almost no issues. Pretty nice piece for the money.

It's a stereo-capable unit, but I run mono. You can run two receivers off one transmitter with this model & get two discretre mono mixes (pan one receiver pack left, the other pack to the right).

 

[s0c9]

I ask because it's a somewhat common misconception that wireless IEMs are the only option or that they're inherently superior to wired when it's not necessarily the case that going that route would actually be a benefit on an individual basis.

I think that it can be most helpful to frame the various aspects of IEMs in terms relative advantages (in the value-free sense) and benefits (and their personal value) rather that absolute statements of superiority that usually involve personal preference. When someone is searching for information and hasn't fully considered their needs, wants and preferences or simply doesn't know what they are, it can lead to taking what this person or that person says it "the best" as gospel when it's really an opinion that has equally valid competing opinions.

With wireless versus wired IEMs, the primary advantages of wireless include freedom of movement and ease of setup from gig to gig (assuming rack-mounting). The primary advantages of wired include cost and relative immunity from interference. For someone running their bass wired, there is little to no benefit from the freedom of movement advantage. Obviously if cost is no object, then the cost advantage of wired is of no benefit. The robustness advantage of wired is generally mitigated by spending more money on wireless. Weighing the benefits to make a decision on balance is logical.

Similarly, with stereo vs mono, stereo has the advantage of allowing panning and mono has the advantages of simplicity in setup and use and less use of limited resources (i.e., each stereo mix requires two aux channels). Whether these are benefits (or absolute limitations in the case of number of aux outs) are individual matters.

I've used wireless and wired bass setups, wireless and wired IEMs, and mono and stereo IEM mixes, and I prefer my bass and IEMs wired and, although I have stereo IEM setups, I prefer not to do any panning. I generally only only plug in one aux channel or where I have a stereo mix, I just don't pan.

For me, I'm perfectly happy with wired setups, and on balance, the benefits outweigh the benefits of wireless. In terms of stereo versus mono, I personally am not challenged by trying to locate sound sources or feel that mixes are crowded to begin with, but I also find that panning either does nothing versus centered or I can actually finding distracting in a way where I find the imbalance unpleasant, as if something were wrong with the sound.

Of course, if you're set on going wireless with your bass, it'd be difficult for any weighing to come out on the side of wired IEMs

Here's a video I've shared before

Again, +100%
The CHEAPEST - but 100% usable setup for IEM's is - long XLR cable, Behringer P2 and KZ buds!

 

[Engle]

Just a heads up: if you do get wireless for your IEMs, don't plug the transmitters directly into a mixer that uses wifi for control with a tablet

 

[trevcda]

1. If you can swing it cost and equipment-wise, stereo can be a much more pleasant experience. You have two ears for a reason.
2. Stay out of the Wi-fi bands. They are way too overcrowded even on a good night. It's like swimming in a pool full of turds. There may be room enough for you, but is that really where you want to swim?
3. Don't cheap out on your IEM monitors. Especially playing bass. Spend the money on custom molds and good monitors for a consistent and full sound and a comfortable fit every time.
4. I personally will not use rechargeable receivers. Not say that I won't use rechargeable batteries, but if you or who ever is responsible for charging a receiver with a built in battery forgets or it doesn't get done (for whatever reason) you are just plain S.O.L. With replaceable battery (rechargeable or standard) you can get a battery at almost any store and be back in business in no time. There's a reason why most of my smoke detectors do not have batteries in them!

 

[--Vissinger --]

one point related to wired vs. wireless -- since running to me was two cables and not very much fun I created a cable carrying both the bass signal and the return to the IEMs to make things easier. Just to be nice the return was stereo, too, even though it wasn't really needed or very helpful.

 

[SLO Surfer]

I use stereo iems in two bands, and mono iems in another band. It’s not necessary, but I really enjoy stereo much more when available. It creates a more realistic stage soundscape and builds more isolation between instruments when used effectively.

If you aren’t running wireless for your bass, I would NOT run wireless for your iems. One main reason is that wired just has better sound quality, and another reason is wired avoids any static/noise/interference/drop outs that are too common with wireless systems. Finally, wired is exponentially cheaper, so for me wired is a no-brainer unless I ever decide to run my bass wireless. I followed the same path as @drpepper and built my own cable/snake that had a 1/4” cable for my bass paired with a 1/8” headphone extension cable. I’ve since bought an Ernie ball iem/guitar cable as it’s even more robust and my personally built cable is now a backup. I run the behringer P-1 as my pack. I mostly run it stereo, but I can just plug in one aux send and push the stereo/mono button to switch to mono. The pack is mounted to my effects pedal board and runs 9v power off my pedal board power supply. Super simple and reliable. If you don’t have a pedal board you could set the pack on your cab or amp, or wherever you plug your bass in.

Unless you are running your bass wireless, I HIGHLY recommend this type of wired iem setup. It feels just like running bass with a normal cable.

Here’s what my system would cost you today;

Ernie Ball iem/guitar cable; $75
Behringer P1 headphone amp/pack; $50
Whatever ear buds you want; $50-1,500


Here’s a view of the front of my pedal board. My iem pack is mounted to the front of the board. My Ernie ball bass/iem cable is plugged into the pack and tuner.

 

[s0c9]

One main reason is that wired just has better sound quality, and another reason is wired avoids any static/noise/interference/drop outs that are too common with wireless systems. Finally, wired is exponentially cheaper.

I've heard those reasons before, but usually from folks who play wired. Back in the day that might have been true with analog companding etc. but not true with today's digital wireless units. Plus, I'd bet the average gigging bassist wouldn't be able to tell the difference in a double-blind test today.

True, wired CAN avoid "static/noise/interference/drop outs", but those should [generally] not happen when the user knows what they are doing and picks the appropriate device + frequencies. Yes, if they happen, they usually occur in the cluttered 2.4G band - a range one should avoid with wireless.

But true - yes, wired IS exponentially cheaper.

What you need to know about wireless systems for guitar and bass

A guide on how to unplug and stay amplified

www.guitarworld.com

 

[Jeff Hughes]

The Xvive is a nice expandable setup to get your feet wet in the IEM world. You can add receivers and transmitters easily. It may not be the most pro setup, but it is affordable to see if you even like IEMs.

I have used these at gigs and rehearsals and only had problems when the receiver and or transmitters weren’t totally charged.

Each band member does not need a separate mix, but having two mixes or aux sends on your board is useful. I have even plugged the transmitter into the back of a powered speaker to get a house mix. Worked fine.

 

[erayser]

I use stereo iems in two bands, and mono iems in another band. It’s not necessary, but I really enjoy stereo much more when available. It creates a more realistic stage soundscape and builds more isolation between instruments when used effectively.

If you aren’t running wireless for your bass, I would NOT run wireless for your iems. One main reason is that wired just has better sound quality, and another reason is wired avoids any static/noise/interference/drop outs that are too common with wireless systems. Finally, wired is exponentially cheaper, so for me wired is a no-brainer unless I ever decide to run my bass wireless. I followed the same path as @drpepper and built my own cable/snake that had a 1/4” cable for my bass paired with a 1/8” headphone extension cable. I’ve since bought an Ernie ball iem/guitar cable as it’s even more robust and my personally built cable is now a backup. I run the behringer P-1 as my pack. I mostly run it stereo, but I can just plug in one aux send and push the stereo/mono button to switch to mono. The pack is mounted to my effects pedal board and runs 9v power off my pedal board power supply. Super simple and reliable. If you don’t have a pedal board you could set the pack on your cab or amp, or wherever you plug your bass in.

Unless you are running your bass wireless, I HIGHLY recommend this type of wired iem setup. It feels just like running bass with a normal cable.

Here’s what my system would cost you today;

Ernie Ball iem/guitar cable; $75
Behringer P1 headphone amp/pack; $50
Whatever ear buds you want; $50-1,500


Here’s a view of the front of my pedal board. My iem pack is mounted to the front of the board. My Ernie ball bass/iem cable is plugged into the pack and tuner.

View attachment 7011362

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you. I play with several churches... some wireless, and some wired. As far as stereo and mono... there is a reason why I love playing with the one church that provides a stereo personal mix. I hear myself easier, individual instruments, and singers clearer. The stereo pan is from the FOH perspective, so I have to look the opposite direction when singers turns to talk to the band... LOL... but a stereo mix is much better experience. My mix is mono at my home church, but I recently bought a digital rack mixer, so I'll have a stereo mix for 1/2 the churches I play at.

I'm wireless most of the time, with my own wireless system (Senn EW G4 IEM). I've tried dongles and pedalboard wireless systems... I've had a good experiences with them... but it wasn't perfect. I have a much better experience with the G4. Some complain of the noise floor hiss with the G4, but since I use a rack that I plug into good power conditioner, I don't hear or notice any hiss, and sounds clean when not playing... if there was a hiss, it's a non-issue when we start playing. I wish I did more research, and come to this sub-forum before spending my money. The "buy once cry once" method would have saved me money, even if it cost more... but all the other cheaper wireless systems I've purchased just increased my expenses. Higher end wireless may not be worth it for most, but I really like my rack, and the freedom of cables in my playing space.

As for wired, I still carry cables to plug in as a backup... but never once had to use them... except the one and only time when my bodypack battery door wasn't fully closed, and the batteries fell out right before playing. I've used to the Behringer P1... still do at one church. That is a great unit... a little heavy after connecting XLR cable(s). I always leave it on the floor, but I love where you mounted it to your pedalboard. Great idea!!!

 

[SLO Surfer]

my bodypack battery door wasn't fully closed, and the batteries fell out right before playing.

Ah yes! Thanks for reminding me. Another reason I suggest using my method of one cable wired iems, for those not running their bass wireless, is BATTERIES.

If I ever join a band where I need to run around further than a 20ft radius from my pedal board, I’d be buying the best wireless systems for both my bass and iems.

 

[drpepper]

If I ever join a band where I need to run around further than a 20ft radius from my pedal board, I’d be buying the best wireless systems for both my bass and iems.

And you can probably velcro your Altoids to the wireless pack without adding very much weight

 

[jdthaddeus]

I'm using a Phoenix Pro stereo IEM setup ($215) with KZ10 ear monitors($45) and a Lekato 5.8 wireless bass system ($50). All are available from Amazon for low prices and they work extremely well. The stereo Phoenix Pro is only like $30 more than mono.... Get the stereo.

That's how I got started. If I feel the need to upgrade I will but I'm very happy with this gear. I have no problem spending big money on top quality but this gear works great.

You can share a transmitter with two receivers but they will get the same mix. That's not so bad. For example, the drummer and I can easily share the same mix because I don't mind if the drums are a little loud in my ear and he doesn't mind that my bass is a little loud in his ear.... Because we play as a team.
On the other hand I would probably not want to share a transmitter with the singer because he'll be too loud in my ears and I'll be too loud in his.

 

[skyline_01]

You can share a transmitter with two receivers but they will get the same mix. That's not so bad. For example, the drummer and I can easily share the same mix because I don't mind if the drums are a little loud in my ear and he doesn't mind that my bass is a little loud in his ear.... Because we play as a team.
On the other hand I would probably not want to share a transmitter with the singer because he'll be too loud in my ears and I'll be too loud in his.

I'm using the Phenyx Pro stereo IEM set as well (I assume the same model, PTM-10) and it is capable of getting two discrete mixes.

Run one mix into the left input jack of transmitter and the other mix to the right input. Set the transmitter to MONO mode.

Then set one receiver pack's FOCUS to the left in its settings menu, and the other pack to the right. Then choose MONO in each pack's settings and you'll hear your respective mix in both ears.

 

[jdthaddeus]

I'm using the Phenyx Pro stereo IEM set as well (I assume the same model, PTM-10) and it is capable of getting two discrete mixes.

Run one mix into the left input jack of transmitter and the other mix to the right input. Set the transmitter to MONO mode.

Then set one receiver pack's FOCUS to the left in its settings menu, and the other pack to the right. Then choose MONO in each pack's settings and you'll hear your respective mix in both ears.

Excellent tip, thank you!

 

[skyline_01]

Excellent tip, thank you!

Of course

 

[doubleohnodj]

Wow that ernie ball cable is cool! But I think for $75 I'm gonna get a headphone extension cable and some heat shrink tubing to make my own

 

[NYgiant]

OK, well I think I’ve narrowed down to what I might get. I’ve looked at that Xvive… But I don’t know if I’m feeling it for a long-term and I don’t wanna drop $250 just to do it and get something else within the next year or so.

I think the Shure PSM300 will be it. Trying to work out a pricing offer on Reverb for an open box unit.

With regard to the monitors themselves, I probably read reviews for three hours straight. Seems these are pretty decent, especially for the price. KZ ZAS

KZ ZAS 7BA+1DD in Ear Earphone, 16Unit Hybrid Drivers Earbuds HiFi Bass Earphone in-Ear Monitor Headphones 8Core Cable Music Sport Earphone (Without Mic, Black)
https://a.co/d/eveNfxD

 

[NYgiant]

Ooops…..sorry. I just saw all the other replies about using a wired system and how to do it. When I just responded with the Shure system, I did not see all the other replies.

 

[erayser]

OK, well I think I’ve narrowed down to what I might get. I’ve looked at that Xvive… But I don’t know if I’m feeling it for a long-term and I don’t wanna drop $250 just to do it and get something else within the next year or so.

I think the Shure PSM300 will be it. Trying to work out a pricing offer on Reverb for an open box unit.

With regard to the monitors themselves, I probably read reviews for three hours straight. Seems these are pretty decent, especially for the price. KZ ZAS

KZ ZAS 7BA+1DD in Ear Earphone, 16Unit Hybrid Drivers Earbuds HiFi Bass Earphone in-Ear Monitor Headphones 8Core Cable Music Sport Earphone (Without Mic, Black)
Amazon.com

It would be a good idea to take a look at @s0c9 "Wireless Frequency Finder" links in his sig before buying the Shure PSM300 on Reverb. This should give you an idea of the frequency range you get in your location for the PSM300 frequency band unit you're purchasing. I used his links when I was shopping for my wireless unit, and it really help me find the best frequency band that works best for my location. He was very helpful, and answered all my questions.

 

[skyline_01]

OK, well I think I’ve narrowed down to what I might get. I’ve looked at that Xvive… But I don’t know if I’m feeling it for a long-term and I don’t wanna drop $250 just to do it and get something else within the next year or so.

I think the Shure PSM300 will be it. Trying to work out a pricing offer on Reverb for an open box unit.

With regard to the monitors themselves, I probably read reviews for three hours straight. Seems these are pretty decent, especially for the price. KZ ZAS

KZ ZAS 7BA+1DD in Ear Earphone, 16Unit Hybrid Drivers Earbuds HiFi Bass Earphone in-Ear Monitor Headphones 8Core Cable Music Sport Earphone (Without Mic, Black)
Amazon.com

I think that's a solid move with the Shure. As mentioned, using a local frequency finder would be a good move.

I'm still using KZ buds after a couple years and they're holding up just fine. Definitely one of the better budget choices out there. You might consider an upgraded cable - the ones included are generally not very robust IME.