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Help with Schroeder Cabs

#21
The last two posts get right to the heart of the matter. +1 to both.

I know Ken uses his AE410 these days for gigs where he needs the backline push. I am similarly quite satisfied with the NV610.

The next question, then, is what about those other gigs; and there are a bunch of different situations.

Andy is totally correct that there are a lot of gigs where the load in/out aspects and cut matter the most. And, it doesn't make too much sense to spend gazillions sorting that out.

Also, Ken is correct that there are gigs where tone in a smaller footprint can be a big deal.

I can't tell right now if there is overlap in these specs; still trying to sort that out.

Andy, I can't tell you how I would rank those particular 212 cabs, because I haven't heard them all. The AK and Barefaced cabs seem really interesting. Are they the last 212 you would ever need to buy? I don't know. I will say right now the 1212BMF is my favorite Schroeder cab for what I do with it.

IMO, basses are sort of worked out. Each of us can figure out what works best from plenty of choices out there. I believe with the revolution in the Micro heads, the amp situation seems to be settling down into pick what you like. Cabs are a different deal. They may or may not matter too much, depending on your situation; but there do seem to be more significant technical advances coming on line at the moment. So, the situation is a little confusing; at least to me. GL2A
 
#22
All good points here, from everyone. it's like trying to hit a moving target - your tone going into the cab matters in terms of it's ability to do what it does and produce a desirable sound, garbage in = garbage out. and vice versa. The litmus test for me has been playing back my raw (DI) bass tracks in the studio, unedited, and a/b to the exact setup but with cab/s. True test of coloration, high & low spots, etc , IMHO

Less coloration, light, loud, punchy. I never played the 1212 but I had the 412 it was awesome, and my 215's are sick.
Back again to reality, the venerable human factor = I love chocolate you love vanilla ; )

de gustibus, non disputandum est ; there is no arguing taste.

We can all pretty much agree that quality and value is always appreciated and Schroe, Berg, Bag End, etc all do that very well. many others fall way short.
 
#23
First of all, thanks for all of the good information here! I don't have enough time to read through it all -got a show tonight in Chicago.

Lately, every show I have been playing has a PA system. As a band, we don't want to waste our time at bars without a PA system. My tonal goals are to get a clean pick tone, distorted pick tone, and thick finger style tone. I want to achieve the edgy string attack of my Spector/bridge pickup/stainless string sound through the cabinet on stage. It does not have to be perfect, just want to be able to hear that part of my sound clearly and loud. I want the low mids to come through nicely - that is how I cut through with my fingers. Some low end around 80hz would be nice and extending down to 40hz is cool, but not truly necessary. I use the Radial Big Shot MIX (blend pedal) with my Tech 21 XXL to get an edgy and distorted pick tone. I also use an EQ pedal on the XXL to filter out everything above 3khz and a small boost between 700 and 1khz. Helps a lot for the distortion sounds. I don't need much more in terms of tones, I mainly use my hands to change the tone I am after on my bass before I even touch the EQ. It would be nice to not carry my 96lb Mesa cab to every show, when a simple and high powered 212 would be plenty. Whatever cab I go with, I probably will get another one and run both for festivals and bigger stages.

I will read over everything else written here in the next few days. Thanks everyone.
 
#24
Finally had a chance to read through - definitely going to check out some of the recordings and look at the other 212's out there.

I wanted to add: for shows, I generally send the soundguy a pre-EQ signal of my bass which also contains my blend pedal, distortion, and EQ pedal. I have a footswitch for just my bass tone or the effects chain. Since most sound guys do not want to mic me, I just give them everything at once. Most are cool with it while some sound guys are freaked out with a signal like that. I have my own mic and it's only SOMETIMES that I get a chance to use it. I actually rather have a midrange crazy cab so when the cab is miced, the sound guy will get a growly/mean/punchy tone and use the DI box for the low end. As I mentioned earlier, my on stage tone is just meant to cut through, not sound "pretty". I remove low end out of my Mesa cabs live to compensate for the subwoofers and drummer's monitor from being so close to me. It works nice that way.
 
#25
bucephylus said:
I am playing the 1212BMF's and have the following observations to offer:

Cabs are VERY smooth from lower mids through the highs; they have plenty of bark and growl. They do NOT have the lower end "pillow." At all.

I am still trying to figure out how the lack of "pillow" affects live tonal performance. Solo, it can be somewhat unsatisfying; but tone at home is not where the money is. On stage, and particularly with FOH support, the lack of low "pillow" below the lower mids may actually be an advantage, because it keeps the bass out of the mics more effectively. At least, that is what I am finding.

Anyhow, I've been gigging them for about a year now, and am still trying to figure out the realities of the situation. Sorry for the less than clear message. Back in the days of vox only through the mains, I would not have chosen this cab. With FOH, I find the situation a little confusing. Seems like this cab works really well with FOH, but I would (and do) keep an alternate rig for times when you don't have that.

Unrelated to your tonal question, but the cabs at 38 pounds are crazy easy to load in and out, a not insignificant factor to me. Nearly any cab that can push the same presence is going to weigh more. There are some interesting cabs from Audio Kinesis and Barefaced that could fill a similar role, but with more low end. However, again, I am undecided where the low end fits into a busy FOH mix. YMMV GL
Click to expand...

I recently went to hear a friend's band and he plays an FBass BN5 through a MarkBass LMIII (or maybe an LMII -- same diff) through a Schroeder 212BMF.
He was running through the FOH and it sounded really good.
I went up in front of the stage at one point to check out the stage sound and it sounded even better.

As long as you aren't playing Reggae (or want a similar really BIG low end), then I think that cab would work for a lot of venues (even more so with FOH support).

I disagree with the poster who said that Schroeders have a wicked deep low end -- at least not the ones that I've heard -- which is 6 different models (I owned a 410R for over a year). And I'd add that for most bassists situations that is a positive attribute, not a negative one.
 
#27
Hey Gearhead,

e-mail or call (the best choice) Jorg and ask his advice.

I did this prior to purchasing my third Schroe and I'm happy with my 410L, which he asked me to consider. I needed more swat on stage and he told me 21012L or 410L and asked my gigging set-up and the 410L is in the mix on louder, larger gigs!

Hope this helps, Kirk
 
#28
KJung said:
I have a buddy in town (TBer Matrok) who plays a Schroeder 1212L (the small baffle cab) and has a more 'rock oriented' grindy tone goal (he playes P basses and Reverend J's and uses a VT pedal or a Trace 'V Type' amp), and it sounds pretty killer.... punchy with decent grind. The 1212BMF should get you there also with that tone.
Click to expand...

That quote makes me want to get the 1212R (the light version is really not worth it).

I have already e-mailed Jorg and he recommended the 210PL. But I face the age old problem - I can't try out the cab before buying. At least with the 1212R I have a clue of what it sounds like. As well as several descriptions of what the 1212BMF sounds like.

Jorg loves his 210PL, but I am little hesistant on going with two 10's to replace my 410 Mesa. It does seem like a killer cab though. The 1212 is in an angled enclosure (somehow creates a lot of volume in a small box) and I nearly convinced it will kill my Mesa 410 quickly - in portability, overall volume, and being used as a monitor.

The price point is this: 210PL is $600 and the 1212R is $739 at Bass Central. So it's a fair fight, just don't know what to do. I might have to buy both of them and return one of them.
 
#31
Hey all. Again, thanks for all of the information. I just found a "place" that is selling a used 1212 Schroeder with a "return policy". I think I am going to go that route and try out the cab for a show or two. I will also have some time to crank it by myself. If I don't like it, it's 100% money back to me!

I would tell you the "place", but my selfish side does not want anyone else to buy them! LOL!:D:bassist:

UPDATE:

It's Guitard Center in Baton Rouge. At least I have 30 days with the gear. There is only one speaker, so no worries about you talkbass guys grabbing the other one! LOL!
 
#36
Gearhead17 said:
www.Basscentral.com is the only place that has it for sale. It's REALLY new according to Jorg.
Click to expand...

I played the new PL cabs and I REALLY like the PL18 and PL410. either or sound great alone or together. They both have that tight focused schroeder tone. I really like the metal grills... but the new cloth grills look good so its really up in the air I guess... I would just prefer a metal grill.
 
#37
I own the 1212L. Can't speak for other models.

Whenever I practice at home, I am underwhelmed. I have seriously considered selling it several times because of this.

But played in context, it sits really nicely. Right on top of the kick. FWIW I play soul, blues, rock and go for a smooth sound.

Also, it is loud! I've never been able to go past halfway with my LMII into this thing. And that includes an outdoor show with no PA support.
 
#38
I use a Schroeder 310212, and at first I didn't like it ,but it was the head I was using the SWR WorkingPro 700 just wouldn't give me the lows I wanted. I was going to sell it then a friend played is Orange tube head on it and it sounded good. He is a 40yr pro bassist from Calif, now playing in Austin. He said some of the SWRs are just to sterile. Anyway I really like mine,and its built like a tank.
 
#40
gary mitchell said:
I use a Schroeder 310212, and at first I didn't like it ,but it was the head I was using the SWR WorkingPro 700 just wouldn't give me the lows I wanted. I was going to sell it then a friend played is Orange tube head on it and it sounded good. He is a 40yr pro bassist from Calif, now playing in Austin. He said some of the SWRs are just to sterile. Anyway I really like mine,and its built like a tank.
Click to expand...

I can't say much for the new versions of the Schroeders or even the WM SWR series, but my SWR Bass 750 through my original Schroeder Mini 12 and 1212 kick serious low end with a great mid-high end that cuts through my 3 guitarists. I get so many compliments on my 1212 (8 Ohm). It is a fantasic phat cab!
 

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