passive series pups are pretty loud usually. Active really depends on the pickup/circuit combo. some are very loud others not so much. MM is paralell active and is much lower than a pbass until you really boost the tones.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Hey, I thought active basses were louder than passive basses???
- Thread starter shaginwagin
- Start date
Some active basses have a adjustable volume pot. This can be adjusted so the passive and active volumes are not miles apart. On the other hand some passive basses really crank!
Man this is all great information, thanks to all!
I have learned a very important lesson. Well, a couple actually...
1) do not assume a bass with active electronics will have a greater output than a passive.
2) do not assume a bass with active electronics will have a greater ability to change its tone.
This doesn't really apply to this thread but...
3) do not assume a bass that your friend finds in his shed and gives to you will be a piece of junk you will never use or want but keep around anyway so he doesn't think you appreciate the gesture, will sound better (to me) than a bass you just paid actual money for!!!
I have learned a very important lesson. Well, a couple actually...
1) do not assume a bass with active electronics will have a greater output than a passive.
2) do not assume a bass with active electronics will have a greater ability to change its tone.
This doesn't really apply to this thread but...
3) do not assume a bass that your friend finds in his shed and gives to you will be a piece of junk you will never use or want but keep around anyway so he doesn't think you appreciate the gesture, will sound better (to me) than a bass you just paid actual money for!!!
As has been said an active bass probably will be less affected by cable length than a passive bass because it probably has a lower output impedance but this will affect tone more than level. Noise pickup is less cut and dried than tone loss due to cable capacitance but an active bass's lower output impedance will generally lower the noise pickup.
Ken
Ken
By noise do you mean hiss and hum?
Also how long would the instrument cable have to be to even hear a difference between the long and short one? And even if it was possible to get encounter such a problem, what would /what could be done about it? Especially if you only wanted to use a passive P?
I've always considered active bass circuitry to be used primarily to provide more tone control: a passive bass typically has a variable resistance that is used in conjunction with a capacitor to produce a low pass filter ( i.e. only provides a cut for highs). Active tone controls often provide boost and cut for 2-4 frequency bands. Of course this does not apply to all active bass designs, but many...
FWIW,
Jim
FWIW,
Jim
Well then, in a real world situation, I would assume it would be very unlikely to have a problem with tone coloration because of the length of the cable being used... correct?
Also, the real benefit of active electronics would be for tone shaping, right? Assuming you are using a quality product.
Man, I assume alot...
Also, the real benefit of active electronics would be for tone shaping, right? Assuming you are using a quality product.
Man, I assume alot...
They can be, but there's a lot of variation out there of different pickup types and brands/models of each type. Not to mention humbucking pickups or single coils run together tend to have a lower output than a single coil run passive. The point of active electronics isn't really more volume, it's an active tone circuit to boost frequencies instead of a passive high roll off tone knob. When my Carvin SB4000 is in active mode set flat it's pretty much the same out put level as passive (maybe a wee bit louder). My Dimarzio model P loaded bass is a WAY hotter pickup though. Considerably louder than just the front pickup any of my other basses solo.
I think you guys are making this a bit more complicated than it really is.
Remember, an active bass is just a passive bass with a preamp in it (although there are 'active pickups', but they are just passive pickups with an active circuit in their casing).
Just like any preamp, the output level of an onboard preamp can be set hot or not hot. Many actually have output level controls in the control cavity.
So, while an active on-board circuit has the potential to provide a super hot signal, most don't. The best ones, IMO, are set at unity with the passive bypass sound, so you can switch from one to another without turning any knobs.
The 'active/passive' input labels on some amps is unfortunate, and is a throwback to an earlier day. It makes little sense today. Just think of the active input as one that is padded down a bit for either a particularly hot instrumet (active or otherwise) or a player with extremely aggressive technique who might overdrive the input gain stage with even a moderate output bass. (edit: there are a few amps that have input impedance differences, but that is rare, and makes no difference once the input signal is buffered by an active on-board preamp anyway).
Remember, an active bass is just a passive bass with a preamp in it (although there are 'active pickups', but they are just passive pickups with an active circuit in their casing).
Just like any preamp, the output level of an onboard preamp can be set hot or not hot. Many actually have output level controls in the control cavity.
So, while an active on-board circuit has the potential to provide a super hot signal, most don't. The best ones, IMO, are set at unity with the passive bypass sound, so you can switch from one to another without turning any knobs.
The 'active/passive' input labels on some amps is unfortunate, and is a throwback to an earlier day. It makes little sense today. Just think of the active input as one that is padded down a bit for either a particularly hot instrumet (active or otherwise) or a player with extremely aggressive technique who might overdrive the input gain stage with even a moderate output bass. (edit: there are a few amps that have input impedance differences, but that is rare, and makes no difference once the input signal is buffered by an active on-board preamp anyway).
Ken,
I totally agree, if I change from active to passive on my Nordy there is no volume sacrifice at all, I think my streamer is the same as well.....
Ian
I totally agree, if I change from active to passive on my Nordy there is no volume sacrifice at all, I think my streamer is the same as well.....
Ian
1. True. An active preamp can be made with any gain the designer chooses. Often the gain is set by the design, but some actually have a control (tiny pot) to set the gain. Usually that control is used to match the output in passive mode to the output level in active mode (if it has both). Hence an active bass can have any output level the designer picked.
Usually the output level of basses (both passive and active" are set to be within a certain range of voltages that most amps are designed to work with. The dual (active-passive) input thing on modern amps is a way to extend the range of accepted voltages just a bit. (Hot basses of either type are "padded" down a bit to stay within operating ranges in "active" input)
1b. Also true that passive basses can have a fairly wide range of output levels as well. In that case it depends on the pickup design, number of turns on coils, strength of magnets, and wiring (series/parallel) For example G&L MFD pickups are pretty hot even in passive mode.
Bottom line: Plug hot basses into "active" input and weaker ones into "passive". Does not matter if bass is actually active or passive. It's all about keeping inputs within range of amp preamp.
2. Usually false. Generally speaking an active bass will have active EQ which will give you more control over tone than a passive bass which typically has only a "toy" tone control which only function is to roll off highs. Active EQ will usually both boost and cut either lows or highs and some have three bands that let you also adjust mid frequencies as well.
There are a couple of exceptions such as "Leo's last circuit" which has both bass and treble controls in passive mode and certain "active" basses that only have a cable-driving buffer and no EQ circuits.
3. When it comes to basses you shouldn't assume. That junk bass may or may not be junk. Depends on how much "mojo" lucked into that bass and what you are willing to fix on it. If the basics are there and you lucked out on materials, it just might end up a "keeper". (He says working on my latest $10 bass acquisition. Jury is still out on the Junk-keeper decision until I get it all back together.)
Which part of that did we overcomplicate? I think we covered it all pretty clearly...
You shoudlve gone used and bought a B-204. The jump in quality and sound is worth every penny. They are a steal at the price you can find them for, and if my active EMGs are an 11, they can get up to probably a 7 or 8.
Recorded at 30% volume if I remember correctly
Recorded at 30% volume if I remember correctly
Most people find the outputs on these pickups to be weak. Switch them to active EMGs then you'll see a world of difference. Also factor in the space between the pickup and strings. The pickups on your esp could be pretty close. I believe they have a pretty low magnetic field, maybe why they are so quiet. The pbass pickups should have quite the room, they have a strong magnetic field.
Bassbenj, thanks for your input. I should have specified that I was referring/comparing my two basses. Although the esp will give me more tonal options, I am finding that I don't really care for them. Not the guitars fault, I was not in tune with what I was looking for.
Porkbun, its cool man. I didn't buy the esp new. CL score for 125 bucks.
Locisbrelm, thank for the info but I have a feeling she won't be staying around long enough to mod. Pretty sure a Squier P is in my near future.
Porkbun, its cool man. I didn't buy the esp new. CL score for 125 bucks.
Locisbrelm, thank for the info but I have a feeling she won't be staying around long enough to mod. Pretty sure a Squier P is in my near future.
Some high output passive pups can equal many active preamp loaded basses with the tone controls near flat. Load those same active preamp basses with hotter pups and they will play louder. The esp ltds to me are very nice but are also medium to med high output to me. Pups like dimarzio's hotter P pups can about equal them output volume wise.
When I added basslines blackout 2band preamp to dimarzio P pup bass I mainly got extended bass and treble and more detail in the sound, rather then any real jump in outout volume. Just small increase with bass & mid control boosted about 1/3 or little less.
When I added basslines blackout 2band preamp to dimarzio P pup bass I mainly got extended bass and treble and more detail in the sound, rather then any real jump in outout volume. Just small increase with bass & mid control boosted about 1/3 or little less.
Noise is anything you don't want to hear. Noise pickup in cables is more common in places like churches where the instruments are on stage and the mixing panel and amplifiers are 100 feet away or so at the back of the auditorium. Better cables can help, lower drive impedances can help, balanced cable drivers can help. On the other hand if you have a very strong local noise source even short cables can pick up too much noise.
Ken
