Home Schooling any thoughts???

[BartmanPDX]

The generalizations in this thread about home school kids being "socially ********", or having social problems are disturbing.

-Mike

As are the generalizations in the post by SBassman, who provides "facts" that he fails to support with any objective evidence other than his own experience.

To home school or not is a choice each parent needs to make on the basis of their individual situation with respect to the local schools, their own resources and abilities, etc.

To the OP: you're probably discovering that home schooling is a highly contentious issue. Do some research on it, and remember that nearly everything written about it is biased in some way or another. Take some time to do some serious thinking and have a long discussion with your wife. Make the best choice you can for you and for your family, and don't be afraid down the road to admit that you might have made a mistake in choosing one over the other. Good luck.

 

[Bob Lee (QSC)]

There is a wide variety of responses, and IMHO there is an equally wide variety of possible outcomes from your choice. I don't think there's one answer that anyone can confidently say will fit perfectly.

Homeschooling takes a great deal of work and preparation to do well. OTOH, sending a child off to school but not engaging with him or her in learning or getting involved with the school takes little work or preparation, but probably won't yield good results. Those are two extremes of your choice, and I think only you and your wife can really answer the question of what's better.

 

[Dash Rantic]

The generalizations in this thread about home school kids being "socially ********", or having social problems are disturbing.

-Mike

Agreed. People need to realize that there's more than one type of parent out there, just like there are many kinds of schools. If you force your kid to stay indoors and don't teach them well, it'll turn out badly. Sounds like those homeschoolers are the only ones most people on this thread have had experience with.

It's very likely that the few people on this thread that say "The only homeschoolers I've met are socially ********" have actually met many other homeschoolers that weren't, just didnt know it.

Please learn something about what you're talking about before you flame against it, people

-Dash

 

[Mole]

If you force your kid to stay indoors and don't teach them well, it'll turn out badly. Sounds like those homeschoolers are the only ones most people on this thread have had experience with.

That's because that's how most of them are. I'd probably have a lot less of a problem with homeschooling if everyone would actually homeschool them, not "here's a math problem go have a snack."

It's very likely that the few people on this thread that say "The only homeschoolers I've met are socially ********" have actually met many other homeschoolers that weren't, just didnt know it.

Please learn something about what you're talking about before you flame against it, people

-Dash

I don't know about most people, but if I've met someone (by met I mean not just we say hi and then never see each other again, I mean actually talked to them) 9 out of 10 times I know if they're in public school/private school/homeschooled...

 

[SBassman]

As are the generalizations in the post by SBassman, who provides "facts" that he fails to support with any objective evidence other than his own experience.

Interesting.

I just typed a long reply, but really, these dialogs are so meaningless at TB, with 90% of the exchange being oral diarrhea.

I'll refrain from further participation in this masterpiece of informed dialog.

 

[jady]

Interesting.

I just typed a long reply, but really, these dialogs are so meaningless at TB, with 90% of the exchange being oral diarrhea.

I'll refrain from further participation in this masterpiece of informed dialog.

SBassman, I understand you not wanting to participate in a thread that might degrade in to a flame war but given your experience with homeschooling and your wifes experience in the public school system, I would really be interested in the long reply you didnt post, perhaps in a PM, Thanks, John

 

[jady]

Thanks for all your replies, It is certainly a hard choice but from what i have gathered here, if we are to homeschool, this is what we need to focus on.

1) consistant and healthy social interaction with other kids.

2) a sound and complete curriculum unbiased by our personal agenda

3) a level of discipline to avoid the whole "heres a math problem, go have a cookie" thing

I will keep researching this and take what I read on the internet with a grain of salt because i agree it is all biased in one way or another.

 

[Marcus]

For the kid's sake, I would suggest against home schooling. There are some things that your parents just can't teach you...

 

[Mole]

Well, from your last post it seems that if you are going to homeschool him after all, then you're definitely on the right track. Then you'll just have to stick with it, heh.

 

[jiant.]

Thanks for all your replies, It is certainly a hard choice but from what i have gathered here, if we are to homeschool, this is what we need to focus on.

1) consistant and healthy social interaction with other kids.

2) a sound and complete curriculum unbiased by our personal agenda

3) a level of discipline to avoid the whole "heres a math problem, go have a cookie" thing

I will keep researching this and take what I read on the internet with a grain of salt because i agree it is all biased in one way or another.

As far as #2 goes, my mom would use some curriculum that she would purchase from somewhere, and sometimes she would just go to local schools and ask for certain books that she needs. Also, I think #3 is the hardest, as it can be hard for a child to view you as their instructor, rather than their parent, you just have to establish that from day one.

 

[Musiclogic]

As long as the child is involved in activities outside the home with others his/ or her age, home schooling is the way to go. The child will learn a full curriculum, not circumvented crap they teach as standard in schools today, the child will most likely get a much broader education than that of public schools, and if active outside the home, should have very little trouble with social interaction.

 

[BartmanPDX]

Interesting.

I just typed a long reply, but really, these dialogs are so meaningless at TB, with 90% of the exchange being oral diarrhea.

I'll refrain from further participation in this masterpiece of informed dialog.

SBassman, I don't mean to offend. I have no doubt that your experience is valid, and that homeschooling is often an excellent choice for families to make.

I DO dispute people on either side of the argument claiming that their generalizations are "facts." People on both sides of this issue are making some pretty broad, unsubstantiated claims. You are by no means alone in doing this, but I guess the title "The facts" in your post is what made me focus on you, albeit unfairly.

Just as each child is unique, so is each person's school experience. I hardly think it is either useful or valid for people on either side of the debate to claim that one method is superior to the other. Just as there are excellent examples of home schooling, so there are excellent examples of public schooling. There are also horrific examples on both sides, including some that are certainly bordering on criminal with respect to how the affected children are impacted.

It sounds like jady has a good plan for making an informed choice one way or the other. Best of luck to you and your family.

 

[Joe Gress]

Ok, I have been home schooled since the fifth grade, and even though it is more of a online private school, it still is the same thing. In my own words, homeschooling is a great way to go. I find that I have no problems with socialization, even though I find at little easier to talk with adults and older kids because of maturity levels.

I find it hard to believe that all home schooled people that some of you guys have meet are what you say they are. I can only think of one family that I know out of the thirty or forty families that are in our group that only partially match this description.

I know of many home schooled kids that have grown up to be very successful in their lives. One of my good friend’s brother started and owns one of the fastest growing online Catholic book stores. Another mother that I know has been helping home schooled kids in our area get into the Air force Academy for years.

One of the biggest reasons my mom pulled us from public schools is that we weren’t leaning anything. The program that we are enrolled in now is a much higher level of education than offered in any public school. I can back that.

On a side note, how do you guys define social interaction?

Is it just something to say that a kid has friends, or is it something more on the lines of life lessons and human interaction?

If it the case of subject A, what do you define as friend?
I define a friend as someone that will be there for you, someone that will stand up for you when you need help, someone that will stand up for you when you fall and make mistakes, someone that will stand up with you when you stand your ground. I don’t define a friend as someone that you call every once in awhile, hang out at their house, or go to the movies with. I define them as someone that I know. I would rather have one true good friend than a whole army of people that I know.

If the case is subject B, I get plenty of social interaction.
Sure a many not see hundreds of people a day, but I also don’t get threatened with my life or offered drugs where I go to school. Sure this may be generalizing and stereotyping, but the majority of kids that I have talked to that go to public school are good kids that really could give a rats #$$ less about what they are a learning or even doing in school. Sure there are many exceptions to this, but from what I have heard and seen first hand, I do not want to have any part of what our governments learning institutional penitentiaries have to offer. I can proudly say that I can stand up for I believe in, and refuse to do what I think is morally wrong.

 

[msquared]

This has got to be one of the most bizarre threads I've ever seen on Talkbass.

Anyone here who was actually home schooled or home schooling thier kids now?

I am. My five year old daughter was due to start kindergarten late last month. She won't be. Neither will my one year old son.

My daughter has many more actual friends than I did when I was her age, is reading books with four syllable words in them on her own, can do simple arithmetic, loves to paint, and is so social and outgoing that if I take her into a store she will have even the most introverted computer nerd talking at length about whatever she wants inside of five minutes.

A lot of the homeschooling nightmare stories are because of parents who are less interested in actual education than they are shielding their children from what they consider to be the evils of the world. I know several children who are actively being homeschooled or were previously homeschooled. The children are polite, well spoken, and confident. Out of the adults, one of them is an editor at Wired and one of them is a former developer at Microsoft. None of them are boring, shallow, or emotionally crippled as far as I can tell.

Jady, feel free to PM me if you have any questions or want to discuss it with someone who has been doing it for a while now.

 

[Philbiker]

I had an unbelievably good time in High School. I was kind of a nerdy geeky guy, but made some friends. I was in rock and roll bands that played at parties. I met up with friends for hikes and games and stuff. There were pretty girls everywhere in my school that piqued my interest. I went to football games, made friends, and we recently had a 20th year class reunion that was an absolute blast. It was so great to see all those clowns again!

I wouldn't consider denying my children that.

 

[threshar]

msquared - I think you hit the nail on the head. It is the folks who home school to shield kids from "the world" that produce the whackjobs that are what you think of when you think "home schooled".

Just like with public (or private) schools, it depends on your teachers and whatnot. You can have bad teachers and good teachers. One thing that can be interesting is the different viewpoints from different teachers over the years. One teacher may "speak" to you in a way that just clicks, others may make some sort of sound that you are incapable of processing.

My daughter is 4, she'll be attending public school next year. My wife and I want her out there in the world. Neither of us are qualified to teach her everything, but we do plan on taking an active interest in what she's learning over there (and offer to augment where applicable). I don't try to sheild my children from "life". When my wife's grandmother had a stroke and passed away I didn't sugar coat it at all. I actually gave her the truthful explanation of what happend (and explained what a stroke was... of course.. then she went around explaining it to everyone she saw.. which was cute in a morbid sort of way).

But, most of us live in this glorious country called the USA and it is our freedom to go to public school, private school or to teach our children in the way we see. Doesn't matter what others think.

If you go the HS route, good luck!

 

[Kosko]

You know, not to change the direction of this, but isn't when your kids go to school when YOU get a minute to yourself as well. Like, parents serve hand and foot for 5 years to finally get the chance to kick back for 4 hours. I'm not putting the parents ahead of the children, that topics been beaten to death for a while now. But for the parents, its like a second honeymoon, no? Time to take care of, um, personal matters (sex). <-- remember that thing before kids.

 

[BlacksHole]

While I have no doubt that there are many home-schooled success stories, I disagree with it in principal. One of life's most important lessons is learning to deal with people with much different value systems. These people are probably not in YMCA, after school sports programs, or other places where home-schoolers get to associate with their peers. I may be making an unfair generalization here, but I really do not believe that many welfare children are home schooled or in such programs (to use one example). I do tend to distrust the opinions of those who have been to only the best schools or home-schooled. I think they are culturally weak and actually help foster the mistrust that is rampant between people of different cultures or even just different cultural strata. For those of you who were home-schooled or even private schooled - have you ever had a friend who was on welfare? How about knowing someone who has served jail time? On the other hand, there are also those who only know people in the disadvantaged subcultures, and they are also missing out. Finally, those in strict or even fairly strict religious upbringing are also disadvantaged. One would not expect an orthodox Jewish child to be friends with a devout Muslim child; but I have a suspicion that the world would be a better place if more of them did have this experience. Of course the same holds for Christioan, Buddhist, Sikh, etc.

 

[TreeChild]

i am 16 years old and have been homeschooled since 5th grade.
i am suprised by the number of people who have had positive things to say about public schooling. im not going to try and rebut any of the issues brought up, im just going to point out some positive things about my homeschooling experience.

- the friends that i have, and have had, are really great, wonderful people that are actually good friends.
- homeschooling provides a more realistic experience of "real" life as a child and teenager. i get to have real, and varied interactions with people of all ages and persuasions in the real world. not just hundreds of other people my age, and thus, i am much more mature than most my age.
- most of my friends go to public school. everyday i hear them talk about their school day, and every day i feel more and more sorry for them and lucky to be in the situation i am.
- i have TIME. i feel this is the most important part. with the free time and mental space i have that would other wise been filled up with worries about school assignments or the strange, unatural stress of peer pressure, i have a job (i build basses while my "peers" are locked in a classroom), i play music, i make art, and i develope myself personally and spiritualy, all on top of my normal acedemic curriculum. i have so much time to do and be what i want. i am actually a human being.

in short, if you want your child to LIVE you will homeschool him.

 

[msquared]

1) It assumes the parent is more qualified to teach than someone who actually is. Will there be instances where the parent actually is a better teacher than those available in the school system?

Your statement assumes that the parent is teaching a class with 20+ kids in it. The difference in number of children changes the game quite a bit. How much of an education major in college is centered on educating a child and how much of it is centered on dealing with large groups of children? Can you even compare a public school teacher with a parent who is acting in an in-home tutor role?

I had a problem with learning when I was in school and constantly having to shift my focus from learning something to passing the time while waiting for everyone else to get it explained to them a third and fourth time. When you have the whole day to sit down with a child and explain things in ways you know they'll understand at a pace that they are comfortable with, it's pretty effective.

As far as how comprehensive that education is, if you go the homeschooling route there are several places to obtain the same materials that professional schoolteachers use when teaching a class full of kids. In reality it doesn't take a lot of effort to sit down with a kid and explain verb conjugation or multiplication, especially if you have a body of material to work from.

2) It is not the positive aspect of socialization that I would be concerned about (ie the child making friends, playing sports, whatever), but the negative that does the most good (imo). Learning to fend for one's self in a negative environment is so important it is beyond description. Raising a child in such a controlled environment (as home schooling is) scares the heck out of me. And this from someone who, at least thru Junior High School, was one of the smallest and frailest in his class.

What makes you think that activities outside the home don't teach this? And along the same lines of thinking, is the parent who puts their child into an upscale school with small classes doing their child a disservice because they didn't put him/her into a rough inner-city school?

You can't have everything with education whether you homeschool or outsource your kid's schooling. You can nitpick about socialization or quality of education all you want but the fact of the matter is that you can't pin "bad" on homeschooling or "good" on public schooling (or vice versa). There are positive and negative stories associated with both. As has been mentioned a few times already, it really depends on the child and the environment.