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How do we discuss music without breaking the forum rules?

Big Hoss

Big Hoss

Up note, down note, blue note, brown note...
Sep 5, 2014
5,455
4,234
In body. Texas. In spirit on the road.
daves-workshop.blogspot.com
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#1
We all know that discussion of religion and politics is verboten on this, and most other forums. I can respect that as I am an admin on another forums and we have the same rules for the same reason. It keeps a better climate of civility to keep those issues being kept away.

There have been a couple of very active threads recently that have quite obviously not simply slipped over the line, but ran headlong over it.

However this IS a music forum, and a great deal of music is about both of those subjects. as is the overwhelming bulk of post hunter gatherer art expression.

So my question is this, without getting all political or religious about it, but how do we discuss a subject that has as such a large part of it religion and politics, without allowing religion and politics to come into the conversation?
 
#3
I get what you're saying. Can you acknowledge and discuss political/religious elements of music without crossing the line? I guess you could talk about, say, Dylan's protest songs in the climate of the 60s without endorsing his politics. But I dunnoh. Does that cross the line? Am I about to get in trouble?
 
#6
Just use discretion when speaking about political tunes. For example, we could discuss the musical work on Zappa's "Louisianna Hooker with Herpes" all day long (a version of "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" poking fun at Jimmy Swaggart, a televangelist caught getting some trim on the side) without delving into the lyrics too deeply. After all, isn't it great to discuss the bass playing of Scott Thunes?
 
#7
Let's say I wanted to learn or discuss how to play and sing N.W.A's F*#$ the Police. Not likely to happen, but lets just use that for argument sake. The inherent political nature, especially in the current climate of that song is political, and very divisive. Pretty much anything the Mentors ever did is un - PC and would slam past the politics rule very quickly. Bob Dylan was through and through political and religious, pretty much anything the P&W players work on is religious in nature...

It seems to me that in the current climate, people are so fast to get butthurt that saying "It's a beautiful sunny day" is going to offend somebody and bring on a political discussion...

Life would be so much easier if folks would just lighten up and enjoy it a bit more...
 
#8
its funny that we cant talk about religion on a music forum. as many bands have become popular or famous because of their religious/anti religious themes. it seems silly as most of today's bands have a powerful message to say via their music and we're not allowed to discuss it. It seems we're doomed to have the same conversation about "what tort guard should i..." or the "my squire is best because"...

Engaging stuff.
 
#9
Here's the problem. We don't get too emotional about tort guards (usually).

But when we ease into discussions about guns, taxes, race, gender, etc. everyone's views are very pwrsonal. It quickly turns to "If you disagree with me you are stupid and I hate you."

The simple fact of the matter is that there a very few of us here who can strongly disagree with each other without it turning into a pissing match. And when people argue about guns on Monday, they will take that same animus to the discussion about tort guards on Thursday.

It's just not worth it.
 
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#10
loveandbass said:
really what the board needs is a forum where politics and religion CAN be discussed. Most other boards have this.
Click to expand...

We had a forum for political topics years ago and it didn't go well. There are too many people that can't discuss topics like that in a civil manner, instead it becomes personal and eventually the anger and hatred spills out into other sections of the board. It happened here and also at a Camaro forum that I'm a Moderator of..... in both cases the political forum was closed.

As far as religious topics, I remember it being allowed in The Lobby (when I had a supporting membership) but I have since given up religion for Lent so I no longer participate in that subject.
 
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#11
Think it comes down to people take their politics and mythologies too seriously to listen to any other viewpoints. Something I acknowledge I also do.

Whereas something like a person's distaste for basses and/or guitars of a certain color or their love/hate for different colored pickguards can be discussed without it getting personal and bringing other elements into it.

To whit, I personally detest black guitars and basses, even though I have a couple that I haven't refinished yet. I have a family member that pretty much only likes black basses and friends that like them. We're still family and friends even though they are completely wrong. And even though I'm not a fan of tort I did put one on a bass I refinished in Burgundy Mist as it just looked right on that bass.

Maybe I'm completely wrong and talking out of my posterior, again.
 
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#12
fjadams said:
Think it comes down to people take their politics and mythologies too seriously to listen to any other viewpoints. Something I acknowledge I also do.

Whereas something like a person's distaste for basses and/or guitars of a certain color or their love/hate for different colored pickguards can be discussed without it getting personal and bringing other elements into it.

To whit, I personally detest black guitars and basses, even though I have a couple that I haven't refinished yet. I have a family member that pretty much only likes black basses and friends that like them. We're still family and friends even though they are completely wrong. And even though I'm not a fan of tort I did put one on a bass I refinished in Burgundy Mist as it just looked right on that bass.

Maybe I'm completely wrong and talking out of my posterior, again.
Click to expand...

What's interesting is that without meaning to, we make statements that have political or religious meaning. Your choice of the word mythologies for example, gives a fairly clear indicator of value judgement you have for religions, so without talking directly about it, you DID indeed make a statement. And your statement clearly puts you in opposition to the views held by other members here certainly, you acknowledge it and that's okay. I do agree that people take things way too personally, and have a terrible tendency to not give folks the benefit of a doubt or two.

Discussions of religion and politics does not have to descend into a childish urination contest however. It just seems like that is the inevitable outcome when people think with their passions and not their brains.
 
#13
I didn't even think of that when I wrote it. I admit, and have done so in other threads my thoughts on what I refer to as mythologies and others refer to as religions. People do get too crazy about their personal beliefs.

But let's just stop here at what it is as I don't want to be the cause of another thread being locked and another little number on my personal message inbox that just begs me to read it.
 
#15
Big Hoss said:
What's interesting is that without meaning to, we make statements that have political or religious meaning. Your choice of the word mythologies for example, gives a fairly clear indicator of value judgement you have for religions, so without talking directly about it, you DID indeed make a statement. And your statement clearly puts you in opposition to the views held by other members here certainly, you acknowledge it and that's okay. I do agree that people take things way too personally, and have a terrible tendency to not give folks the benefit of a doubt or two.

Discussions of religion and politics does not have to descend into a childish urination contest however. It just seems like that is the inevitable outcome when people think with their passions and not their brains.
Click to expand...

lol the ancient religion of the Greeks is regarded as "Greek Mythology" I sense a double standard here....

It's probably better to keep religion and politics out of conversation as much as possible, there are plenty of other forums for those topics if anyone is crazy enough to join them (I am not, it would take up too much of my time and get me too pissed off)
 
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#17
My least favorite thing to mix with music - religion.
My second least favorite thing to mix with music - politics.

TB seems much more tolerant with pro-Christian threads on regular forms if it's under the guise of "praise" or "worship". All of that stuff should be banished to private lobby groups and not seen on the main page.
 
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#19
You can discuss religion - in the Lobby. That restricts it to supporting members which helps impede random people coming on the forum to troll about it. Not so sure about politics, even in the lobby.

You can talk about religious or political music AS MUSIC or gigs involving them AS GIGS. That's different from discussing the religion or the politics themselves, and a little common sense goes a long way. For instance, suppose someone wanted to book your band to play a political rally and you disagreed with the candidate it was for. You could (and TB has) have a thread debating the pros and cons of taking such a gig (and how to conduct yourself if you did) without getting into the candidate and his views and having a debate about what's wrong or right about them. You can discuss how Woodie Guthrie's music reflected his socialism without getting into an argument about socialism. You can talk about how you approach playing style, stage presence, and group dynamics for a worship gig and how it's different from a bar gig, without promoting or slamming faith. It's easy for people to get carried away, of course - some people don't seem to be able to help themselves. If they do, report the post.

This is not all that hard to figure out, people.
 

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