I appreciate all of the constructive feedback and comments guys. Seems there's a clear consensus of opinion on this topic.
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How do you pay a STAND-OUT front man?
- Thread starter Rich O'Hanlon
- Start date
DiabolusInMusic
Functionless Art is Merely Tolerated Vandalism
Of course you get more feedback on a singer... that is how it works. Your frontman represents the band, hence the face gets the recognition. Everyday people watch American Idol and can appreciate a good singer, most people do not appreciate good musicians as they all appear talented to them.
If the singer gets a bigger cut you are just opening up a can of worms. The person who books the gigs will need a bigger cut. The person with the P.A. will need a bigger cut. The person hauling the trailer of gear will need a bigger cut. I think you see where I am going.
If the singer gets a bigger cut you are just opening up a can of worms. The person who books the gigs will need a bigger cut. The person with the P.A. will need a bigger cut. The person hauling the trailer of gear will need a bigger cut. I think you see where I am going.
Whether you know it or not, you just painted yourself into an awful corner. Good luck with that.
You know how to solve the problem? Make sure that you and the other guys in the band are so valuable on and off stage that the discrepancy in pay is not even an issue. Play with great performers, hard workers, and with superior business savvy. IMHO, that is the real issue. If your new singer is so sh!t hot, and carrying you guys along for the ride, I have news for you: he will eventually get snapped up for the BBD (bigger better deal) that is always lurking around the corner. Unless your singer is a rare breed who is well-grounded and a team player (they exist, and when you find one, start playing the lottery), you'll need to think really hard and plan ahead...and possibly brace yourself. I've seen this stuff happen even amongst the best of friends, btw.
Another different, likely unpopular, but ballsy move would be to have a frank discussion with the singer and then the rest of the band. Essentially, you, as the business muscle of the band, form an agreement with the singer, and making the band your band - just the two of you - and that due to his onstage prowess and your offstage business efforts, that you two will essentially make the calls and get the heavy portion of the pay. The other guys take a fair, but lesser amount. (Btw, this can only really work if it is demonstrable that the other "role" musicians are not the commodity.) The other guys won't like it, will probably tell you to screw, and if they're friends now, they won't be for long. You'll also need to manage the revolving door of musicians who won't make a long-term commitment to such an arrangement, but will be happy to gig for a while playing to nice crowds. Surprisingly, if the money is good enough, you may even find musicians who are happy to show up, play, get paid, and then not have to deal with any business bullsh!t. It's not always such a bad thing.
The upside is that you are putting the money where the money "deserves" to go, and you may profit handsomely (as would the singer) for making this type of deal. The downside is maintaining a steady band, especially if your area has a thin talent support pool. The rest is just business, and you can love it or leave it as far as that goes. If you draw numbers, the clubs will pay you and book you, regardless of who is in the band as long as the "golden boy" singer is on his game. If you don't, then it's back to the drawing board, back where you were before. Generally, these days, clubs really don't give a crap about inside band business...just turn the numbers, baby!
Another different, likely unpopular, but ballsy move would be to have a frank discussion with the singer and then the rest of the band. Essentially, you, as the business muscle of the band, form an agreement with the singer, and making the band your band - just the two of you - and that due to his onstage prowess and your offstage business efforts, that you two will essentially make the calls and get the heavy portion of the pay. The other guys take a fair, but lesser amount. (Btw, this can only really work if it is demonstrable that the other "role" musicians are not the commodity.) The other guys won't like it, will probably tell you to screw, and if they're friends now, they won't be for long. You'll also need to manage the revolving door of musicians who won't make a long-term commitment to such an arrangement, but will be happy to gig for a while playing to nice crowds. Surprisingly, if the money is good enough, you may even find musicians who are happy to show up, play, get paid, and then not have to deal with any business bullsh!t. It's not always such a bad thing.
The upside is that you are putting the money where the money "deserves" to go, and you may profit handsomely (as would the singer) for making this type of deal. The downside is maintaining a steady band, especially if your area has a thin talent support pool. The rest is just business, and you can love it or leave it as far as that goes. If you draw numbers, the clubs will pay you and book you, regardless of who is in the band as long as the "golden boy" singer is on his game. If you don't, then it's back to the drawing board, back where you were before. Generally, these days, clubs really don't give a crap about inside band business...just turn the numbers, baby!
If I found out I was making half of the guy I rub shoulders with for the whole gig but was expected to deliver the same 100% effort I'd not be very happy. If I was an auxiliary support player in the background it'd be a different story. It's great that this guy has raised your game and gotten better gigs but don't discount the importance and contributions of the other members.
Equal pay, if you feel that he's the stand out then everyone else should up their game and make the band even better. If he formed the band, then he would justifiably get a large cut. Without a band, he's just a singer with a karaoke machine. He may get more attention, but it's still a team effort.
Equal pay for now.
If he is that good, other bands are going to be approaching him and shooting him offers. I would sure as heck be. It will be up to him whether he stays or if he goes. IF he asks for a bigger cut, consider giving it to him.
Around here, good singers and front people are rare and in demand. And they know it. Good players are common.
If he is that good, other bands are going to be approaching him and shooting him offers. I would sure as heck be. It will be up to him whether he stays or if he goes. IF he asks for a bigger cut, consider giving it to him.
Around here, good singers and front people are rare and in demand. And they know it. Good players are common.
One of my previous female singers once commented that without her there'd be no show. I said well without us driving, unloading, setting up and soundchecking there'd be no show. You could still sing of course, into your hairbrush and your mirror. We could also play blues all night without a singer too. She never brought it up again.
Whoa brother...
Quantification ????
Now that's just plain silly talk round these here parts.
Just remember, that frontman needs a solid band behind him. Equal pay.
IMO, if your singer's only singing & not helping with anything else, her pay should get docked (or she should be docked)One of my previous female singers once commented that without her there'd be no show. I said well without us driving, unloading, setting up and soundchecking there'd be no show. You could still sing of course, into your hairbrush and your mirror. We could also play blues all night without a singer too. She never brought it up again.
I agree with equal cut for equal work
If someone does something more than show up and play their best (booking/promotion comes to mind) they should get something for that too
If you have to pay him more to keep him in the band, your call. Just make absolutely sure it's fine with everyone else.
If someone does something more than show up and play their best (booking/promotion comes to mind) they should get something for that too
If you have to pay him more to keep him in the band, your call. Just make absolutely sure it's fine with everyone else.
Does he set up the PA? Run it? Load up at the end of the night? Who gets the gigs? Supplies the rehearsal space? The van? Better yet, how would he do without a band behind him?
Equal split. If he doesn't like it, he can form his own band, call it "His Name and the Blame Game", supply all the gigs, PA and transportation, set it up, run it, tear it down, choose the songs and pay the rest of you guys $130 each a night just to show up and play.
Enjoy your success at choosing the right guy.
Gavin Rossdale on Howard Stern. You can bet your ass he doesn't do that anymore since none of the members of Bush now were there when he started.
For now I'd keep it an even split unless new singer guy complains.
Congratulations on the success. Usually you hear about things falling apart more than anything around here.
I was thinking that you are asking whether extra pay will keep the singer happy and around for a good long time. Depends on the person. What they are looking to get out of the band. You should ask him that. There are probably a few bands around that would offer the extra money for him to sing for them.
What are you looking to get out of the band? Most of the musicians I've known that have found cover success start doing originals. Spending the extra income on studio time, lights, pa, and lessons(and those are the last people you would think needed them....). Starting to introduce songs to the audience slowly, one a set to start. This seems to keep good members together. Why waste an opportunity to make great music together. Sounds like you have all the ingredients in place. All you need is your own song to sing!
I was thinking that you are asking whether extra pay will keep the singer happy and around for a good long time. Depends on the person. What they are looking to get out of the band. You should ask him that. There are probably a few bands around that would offer the extra money for him to sing for them.
What are you looking to get out of the band? Most of the musicians I've known that have found cover success start doing originals. Spending the extra income on studio time, lights, pa, and lessons(and those are the last people you would think needed them....). Starting to introduce songs to the audience slowly, one a set to start. This seems to keep good members together. Why waste an opportunity to make great music together. Sounds like you have all the ingredients in place. All you need is your own song to sing!
Not gonna disagree but her and the BL are a couple and you know how that goes...IMO, if your singer's only singing & not helping with anything else, her pay should get docked (or she should be docked)
Definitely equal cut. If anything, you...the BL, should be getting more for all of the work you put in.
