How many callback are acceptable?

[SAlcott]

You're now 0 for 2;
I have no doubt you'll wanna make it 0 for 3.
I stated, I thought clearly enough, that a friend of mine after working as a cellist in an orchestra, (Denver) joined another,(San Francisco) and then another without an audition. She was hired in both cases due to her prior experience, an opening in the chair, and her relationship with directors of personnel in those organizations. Yet you say "Not So!"

I'm sure she'll be surprised that it didn't happen.

Major orchestras hire players like baseball teams do, making offers to certain players that they would like to join their group. I studied with Zita Carno, pianist for the LA Phil for many years. She constantly was offered positions in Orchestras around the World, without being asked to audition.

Back to the Original Post- I really don't care if a player wants to subject himself to 2,3, or 10 call-backs for a "serious working band". I hire players for my serious working band; I wouldn't waste their time or mine on even a 2nd audition.
That's how we roll,. and I'll match my calender no problem.
OK you're at bat! Remember, its strike 2!

Relax. This isn't a contest. I never said she didn't get the jobs you cite. She's very lucky to have been able to avoid the process that most applicants have to go through. I simply find it surprising considering the current auditioning/hiring procedures practiced by even small regional orchestras today. The last few pages of the AFM's monthly publication are full of audition announcements for orchestra positions.

I brought up this issue in the first place just to suggest that multiple callbacks do happen in the real world of working bands and musicians and are not something to get all worked up about. If you want the gig, you do what it takes to get the gig.

 

[B-line]

Relax. This isn't a contest. I never said she didn't get the jobs you cite. She's very lucky to have been able to avoid the process that most applicants have to go through. I simply find it surprising considering the current auditioning/hiring procedures practiced by even small regional orchestras today. The last few pages of the AFM's monthly publication are full of audition announcements for orchestra positions.

I brought up this issue in the first place just to suggest that multiple callbacks do happen in the real world of working bands and musicians and are not something to get all worked up about. If you want the gig, you do what it takes to get the gig.

Yes, but you seemed to question the veracity of what I stated, as well as not acknowledge the fact that there ARE musicians that Orchestras would love to hire, and to ask them to audition would be redundant and a waste of time.

I am fully aware of the process you detailed correctly, inc. "Blind" auditions and such. Its SOP for the "band" for hiring someone from among the throngs of new graduates from Colleges every year who want to play in the Symphony. There are as you know, a lot of symphony orchestras, small and large throughout the World. Zita made a small fortune playing with the LA Phil-They are six-figure salaries, top of the heap, PLUS- being in LA, she did movie soundtrack session work, and had $$ to burn. That's top-tier. My friend Charlene is not quite at that level, but has a very good job, including full benefits and travel, along with playing Music she loves.

Multiple call-backs for Corporate or "other" bands- IME, IMO only happen when that particular unit or B/L thinks a little bit too much of themselves. Otherwise, a Project with engagements on the board simply has neither the time nor need to go thru a selection process of this nature.

Since I'm on a roll here, let me recount if I may, my most recent experience of this type.

Regular Keyboard player n/a for a string of gigs. I was referred to a local (Red Rock) player, whose "regular job' is as a solo pianist for Norwegian Cruise lines. BIG $$$, travel the world, the "Cruisers" love him.
He's off 3 months a year, I called per referral.
He was interested; I wasn't sure if he was- Funky enough TBH, of course we needed to run through tunes for both our behalves.

Long story short- he was awesome, a real pro, nailed what we needed, was ready/willing/able to do our gigs.
This is a Family Forum! I would not repeat what he might have told me IF I told him, "Let me think about it, you may have to come back a 2nd time!"

That type of experience is what is 2nd nature to me.

 

[electracoyote]

I agree with two max. If a band can't assess my skill set and make a relative comparison with the other candidates after two auditions, too bad. That's not a good reflection on the band IMHO.

 

[B-line]

I agree with two max. If a band can't assess my skill set and make a relative comparison with the other candidates after two auditions, too bad. That's not a good reflection on the band IMHO.

I s'pose I could go for 2, but THAT'S IT!!
Any more the:

is being yanked!

 

[electracoyote]

I s'pose I could go for 2, but THAT'S IT!!
Any more the:

View attachment 1200863

is being yanked!

Exactly.

But don't lead me around and make me jump thru hoops, I call BS.

And if I went back for three or four auditions and didn't get the slot, I would feel like a total schmuck. There are other projects out there where it might be more readily apparent that you are a good fit, why go on an endless audition groveling expedition with one band at the expense of your dignity?

As a BL, I can tell after one song where the candidate sits with me.

 

[B-line]

Exactly.



And if I went back for three or four auditions and didn't get the slot, I would feel like a total schmuck. There are other projects out there where it might be more readily apparent that you are a good fit, why go on an endless audition groveling expedition with one band at the expense of your dignity?

Exacta-mundo. I've done MORE than my share of auditions, some successful; other not. S'cool
But at each session, I've been prepared, I've learned the material, and brought what I had in the way of chops, feel, and even personality (Which in my case, could be an issue!)

But seriously folks- I know what I bring to the table, and I do not need any more than MAYBE (1) call-back, I can allow some time to decide who might be best, but THASSIT!
Play me or trade me, use me, but do not abuse me! If their time is available to diddle with, that does not mean that mine is!

 

[electracoyote]

But seriously folks- I know what I bring to the table, and I do not need any more than MAYBE (1) call-back, I can allow some time to decide who might be best, but THASSIT!

And, if you're like me, you'd probably be doing it more as a sign of solidarity and dependability, and only for a project that you are seriously interested in joining. When you prepare properly for an audition and give it 100%, they're certainly not going to see anything different the second time than they saw the first.

 

[B-line]

And, if you're like me, you'd probably be doing it more as a sign of solidarity and dependability, and only for a project that you are seriously interested in joining. When you prepare properly for an audition and give it 100%, they're certainly not going to see anything different the second time than they saw the first.

...Maybe they might be interested in seeing the variety and the extent of my wardrobe, or if I had my hair bobbed, something of that sort!

 

[QORC]

I would say it depends on 1) how badly you want the gig. If it's a really great gig, and a hard gig to find, then you do whatever they ask as long as you are in the running. If it's a mediocre band, or a startup, I would say 2 max and if I feel the least bit jerked around, I bow out anyway (did this several times last year. Douchebaggery at the audition stage is a red flag). A really great opportunity is worth the time and effort. At least you're in the running.

And, 2) can your ego handle feeling slightly jerked around and the possibility of many auditions and not get the gig?

Only you can answer those questions.

 

[buldog5151bass]

It's their band, it's their choice. More than two seems odd, but you say they have good gigs. Sounds like they have good candidates, and want the best.

Do you have anything better?

 

[Downunderwonder]

At some point it gets ridiculous but I don't think you've got there yet.

When they haven't given you the job but get on with rehearsal, instead of checking out vocals, you know you're the placeholder.

 

[Robroy]

Two max. After that, you're dealing with indecisive and irrational people.

My take is that when you audition, you are also auditioning them. And three auditions does not work in their favor.

i.e. I agree with you.

 

[B-line]

Great idea! (If I say so myself)

OP needs to talk w/ the BL of said never-ending audition group... If he don't I will!
Why 3 auditions, or even 4, or 5???

Lets...
MAKE IT A REALITY TV SHOW!

We can call it "Making the Cut"

It will feature 5 or so Bassists each week, doing the auditions, America votes, blah, blah, A panel of Judges, "Yo, Dawg, you gotta be feelin' it more, and tighten up those Vocals, otherwise, you got it!"
Or- "I think you have the "IT" factor" etc.

Yes, I know its been done, but 26 shows or whatever a season is, I know the ratings would be off the charts.

Get 'er done!

 

[cman227]

I just skimmed the responses so this may have been said but, maybe they are assessing how everyone improves from audition to audition. Did you take any constructive criticism to heart? Did you remember any things that were discussed about a particular song or arrangement? In other words, auditioning your work ethic, learning capacity and commitment.

I talked to the BL. They said that no one is going to be a perfect fit right off. I think that he was referring to vocal ability. Because there is a horn section they want to keep the songs the old bassist sang that have horns parts. So I think it is probably between me and one or two other guys and they want to see who progresses. I guess that's fair. If it where just a straight audition I probably wouldn't have gotten the gig anyway because my lead vocals on one song wasn't that great. Since then I have hired a vocal coach.

 

[cman227]

Just curious, would you have the same view of a job interview?

Interesting point. It would depend if I really needed the job or it would just be a better job than the one I have. I think I would put up with more pain for an actual job because there is actual money involved. Although this band gets paid well, it's still not enough to make a big difference.

 

[cman227]

This! Happened to me. Auditioned three times and got the gig with an established local band. Drummer was quitting so I introduced them to a good drummer I knew and had worked with.

We both got hired. Played four jobs between Christmas and New Years plus one big bash on New Year's Eve.

The BL said we were off the rest of January and we'd regroup after that.

And that was it. Turns out they had all decided to hang it up earlier that year, but the bass player couldn't stay on till the bitter end (he was relocating for his day job), and the drummer didn't want to stick it out without the bassist.

Problem was they had five jobs they were still contractually committed to - and also didn't want to not get the gig money for. So they sold me and friend drummer a line in order to get some serious players onboard long enough to complete their gig list.

Lesson learned: You're no more in, or in longer, than whatever the BL decides.

Well, now that you mention it, the guitar player is a sub and there replacing a trombone player.

 

[Downunderwonder]

I talked to the BL. They said that no one is going to be a perfect fit right off. I think that he was referring to vocal ability. Because there is a horn section they want to keep the songs the old bassist sang that have horns parts. So I think it is probably between me and one or two other guys and they want to see who progresses. I guess that's fair. If it where just a straight audition I probably wouldn't have gotten the gig anyway because my lead vocals on one song wasn't that great. Since then I have hired a vocal coach.

so the thread title should really be "How many weeks should a band give me to get my vocals to where they need to be to get the lead vocal bassist slot".