Double Bass HOW to try options, given prices?

[MuseChaser]

The cryptic thread title pretty much says it all. I have three very nice fretless electric bases, and have tried various sets of strings on all of them before finding what I liked best on each. Some trial sets I bought used from various kind forum members, some were new, and the prices ranged from $20 to $75 per set. I think I sent through maybe 12 sets of strings and a couple hundred bucks before settling on final choices and buying new sets of those choices.

Primarily, though (other than piano), I play an Azola BugBass II EUB (41.5" scale, but shorter total string length compared to a real acoustic string bass due to tailpiece design). I bought it used a year or so ago and I'm not sure what strings are on it, nor how old they are. I'd like to gain some more sustain and a bit more "growl" down low without losing any warmth up top, and have done as much as I can with setup and EQ adjustments towards that goal, leading to the unavoidable string quest.

How in the world do you guys deal with the cost of the process? I can't bring myself to lay out $200 or more per set to find out if the sound and feel is what I'm looking for, if the strings will actually fit on this bass, and if I'll ruin them cutting them if they don't.

Any hints to help me get over my analysis paralysis and financial hesitancy?

 

[AGCurry]

I play an Azola BugBass II EUB (41.5" scale, but shorter total string length compared to a real acoustic string bass due to tailpiece design). I bought it used a year or so ago and I'm not sure what strings are on it, nor how old they are. I'd like to gain some more sustain and a bit more "growl" down low without losing any warmth up top, and have done as much as I can with setup and EQ adjustments towards that goal, leading to the unavoidable string quest.

How in the world do you guys deal with the cost of the process? I can't bring myself to lay out $200 or more per set to find out if the sound and feel is what I'm looking for, if the strings will actually fit on this bass, and if I'll ruin them cutting them if they don't.

Any hints to help me get over my analysis paralysis and financial hesitancy?

It sounds like you want Spirocores (3885, for 3/4 size bass), and good things about them are a) you're safe to buy them used, b) they can be cut without damage, and c) they're okay for just about any kind of playing (except maybe rockabilly) Live with them until you like them.

 

[MuseChaser]

Thanks for the response. VERY good to know the Spiros can be trimmed without harming them! A very good friend of mine and wonderful jazz bassist, still playing his butt off at over 80 years of age, plays Spiro solo tuning strings, Weich, tubes down to standard tuning, and sounds great on them. I've played his bass and like the way the strings feel, but am not sure how that approach (light solo strings tuned down) would work on the Azola EUB? His bass has a 42.5" scale, IIRC...

 

[AGCurry]

Thanks for the response. VERY good to know the Spiros can be trimmed without harming them! A very good friend of mine and wonderful jazz bassist, still playing his butt off at over 80 years of age, plays Spiro solo tuning strings, Weich, tubes down to standard tuning, and sounds great on them. I've played his bass and like the way the strings feel, but am not sure how that approach (light solo strings tuned down) would work on the Azola EUB? His bass has a 42.5" scale, IIRC...

I wouldn't start with solo strings, especially with your instrument's shorter mensure. Try the weich gauge.

 

[BobKay]

I play down-tuned Spirocore solos on my Yamaha SLB300. I like the feel, and they sound as good as anything else I've tried. No trimming needed on the Yamaha.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

I wouldn't start with solo strings, especially with your instrument's shorter mensure. Try the weich gauge.

The scale is normal, only underlengths are short. For 3/4 which have higher tension than 4/4 on the same scale and a solid body EUB (I assume) the tuned down 3/4 solos should be better than the 3/4 Weich.

 

[utzb]

Do you know String Matrix - Hervé Jeanne ? It might give you some starting point or narrow down your options (please consider supporting him if his effort saves you a few bucks)

 

[AGCurry]

The scale is normal, only underlengths are short. For 3/4 which have higher tension than 4/4 on the same scale and a solid body EUB (I assume) the tuned down 3/4 solos should be better than the 3/4 Weich.

The OP stated "41.5" scale, but shorter total string length compared to a real acoustic string bass due to tailpiece design," and that his 80-year-old friend used solos on his 42.5" scale bass. If I'm not totally confused, a shorter mensure calls for heavier strings. ??

 

[avant_chard]

This issue is exactly why these string threads get so long, nobody wants to spend a fortune trying everything out so we’re all here trying to describe them with weird adjectives.

That said, sometimes “growl” can come more from how your fingerboard has been planed or shaped, a luthier can help with this.

 

[bherman]

Not the same bass but similar - Eminence EUB w/41.5" scale length and overall string length similar to my Shen, but much stiffer feel due to short and rigid tailpiece design. What I have found over time through experimentation is that the same strings on the Eminence vs Shen feel stiffer/higher tension than on the Shen. For a while I was using Perpetuals on both - standard gauge on the Shen and solos on the Eminence, and they felt and sounded very similar. Now using Spiro solos on the Eminence and they work out very well. I had Weichs on it for a while but they were too stiff for me. @MuseChaser I have an older set of Perpetual solos that I'd be happy to send you, if you cover the cost of postage. That would give you a chance to try out solo gauge and see if it works for you. PM me if interested.

 

[Mark_T]

I never cut my strings, and I don't think most other bassists do either. If I'm curious about a set, I try to find them used first. It's still not cheap, but it's cheaper.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

The OP stated "41.5" scale, but shorter total string length compared to a real acoustic string bass due to tailpiece design," and that his 80-year-old friend used solos on his 42.5" scale bass. If I'm not totally confused, a shorter mensure calls for heavier strings. ??

Two things:

1. 3/4 Spiros are heavier than 4/4 Spiros of the same kind. It looks like they are the same, but only on different scale lengths.
They are designed for having the same tension on a typical 3/4 and 4/4 scale.
This is a special Spiro thing, but a different tension on the same scale length might also be true for 5/4 vs. 3/4 Flexocore.
You can find recalculated string tensions to the same scale length in the Excel file in my Dropbox (link in string sticky).

2. EUBs (and specially solid body EUBs) have a rather rigid top compared to an acoustic DB which makes the strings feel harder. The typical solution for this is taking a softer string. Therefor a typical solution is using solo strings downtuned to orchestra tuning. Specially Spiros are popular for this. Another one is using a bit lower tension synthetic core strings like Obligato.
As a rule of thumb choose at least one step down, so light instead of medium or solo instead of light.
Or use a lower tension string like Perpetuals.

 

[logdrum]

I wouldn't start with solo strings, especially with your instrument's shorter mensure. Try the weich gauge.

It depends on the EUB. Very common with Ampeg baby bass to use SOLO Spiro for that Tumbao thump. I certainly did that with my BSX. The Evah Weich felt stiffer, certainly stiffer than Obligatos or Bel Cantos which are not weichs per se IME

 

[MuseChaser]

FWIW, here's two pics, tailpiece and scroll, of what's on there now. That might help clear up my description of the distances at the tailpiece end.... plus, I'd love to know what these strings are if anyone recognizes them; based upon the identification page on the Gollihur site, they look like D'Addario Helicore Hybrids?

I did take @bherman up on his VERY kind offer, and am excited to check out the solo strings. Just played on this bass for another hour or two, through both a Genzler Acoustic Array Pro, and then the Magellan 350/BA10-2 combo. Such a pleasure to play and hear... just wish I could coax a little more sustain out of it across the board, and a little more life/upper harmonics out of the bottom end.

 

[Endlesssolo]

Those do look like helicore hybrids, which are actually pretty good kind of ‘down the middle’ strings. Those look like medium tension, you might try light tension, if you like the basic sound of the strings but want them to feel softer.

Spirocore Weichs will definitely be softer feeling and brighter sounding, if that appeals to you. But they’re also quite a bit more expensive.

In general, the way I have tried to not go broke trying strings is a combination of buying used on this forum, or buying (new) individual strings to try, then if I don’t like them they’re pretty easy to sell on this forum and recoup some of your money.

 

[MuseChaser]

A quick followup...

@bherman was kind enough to send me the Solo Perpetual strings and I put them on the Azola a few hours ago...and played for an hour and a half or so. Here's an excerpt of a message I just sent him...

"Holy crap, do they sound and feel nice! I had to lower the fingerboard some (equivalent to raising the action), but they are so easy to play that it opened up a much wider range of articulation and tone with the higher action. At least THREE times the sustain of my other strings, maybe more, tenths and chords sound full and rich, the right amount of that growly sustain down low I was looking for. Just an amazing improvement all around."

End of paste...

So...next question...is that huge a difference to be expected, or were the D'Addario Helicores on my bass just really old and dead...or both?

 

[MuseChaser]

Thinking that maybe a new set of Spirocore solo strings would be another incremental increase towards "perfect," I looked around and see most prices for a set around $275-$300, except for one outlier, String Emporium, at $219.50 ....

Spiros on sale

Any red flags?

 

[AGCurry]

Thinking that maybe a new set of Spirocore solo strings would be another incremental increase towards "perfect," I looked around and see most prices for a set around $275-$300, except for one outlier, String Emporium, at $219.50 ....

Spiros on sale

Any red flags?

So...next question...is that huge a difference to be expected, or were the D'Addario Helicores on my bass just really old and dead...or both?

1. No red (or yellow) flags. String Emporium is a reputable shop and great to do business with. I've bought quite a few items, including strings, from them.

2. Probably both. The Helicores were likely old and dead. Just how old and dead, we don't know. But the Perpetuals are better strings. Just how much better is hard to quantify except in price.

 

[Earl]

Thinking that maybe a new set of Spirocore solo strings would be another incremental increase towards "perfect," I looked around and see most prices for a set around $275-$300, except for one outlier, String Emporium, at $219.50 ....

Spiros on sale

Any red flags?

Spiro solos used pop up often in the Classifieds.

 

[bassmanbrent]

String Emporium, at $219.50

String Emporium is is a really good company. You may not get much direct interaction from Steve, depending on how busy he is, but if you're just getting strings that shouldn't be an issue...