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"Hypermiling" Now this has just gotten ridiculous.

#61
Trevorus said:
Again, I wonder about what formed the oil in the first place... There has been debate on that front. I mean, scientists are bio-engineering microbial life that metabolize plant matter and create fuel type hydrocarbons. Also, in a lab, scientists also made fuel type hydrocarbons from marble (CaCO3), iron rust (iron oxide), and water. They treated it with heat and pressure, the same thing which is supposedly creating our fuel far beneath our crust. Also, oil has been found deeper than the oldest known fossils, which also begs the question, what caused that oil to be there?

My point is, we don't really know that much about the Earth's oil cycle, if there is one. We know less about the bottom of the ocean than we do our own moon. That being the case, to state an absolute like, "We are running out," is an assumption that cannot be relied upon.
Click to expand...

So your saying it's returning as fast as we are using it?

:eyebrow:

If this isn't happening then we are running out.
 
#62
Regarding the tangent discussion about how much oil we have:

1) There is a finite amount of it and it cannot be replenished
2) World energy demand is constantly increasing
3) 1 + 2 means that at some point in the near future (a few decades or so) oil will be too expensive to use and we must switch to renewable, non CO2 emitting fuels because of economic necessity, if not for environmental reasons.


IMO, the idea of conserving gasoline is a good one. Wasting resources, of any kind, is irresponsible and polluting carelessly is also unwise. Investing in technology that brings us closer to the day when we can switch to renewable, low emissions fuels is beneficial to all, but that's not what "hypermiling" is about. Go to the websites and read some of the comments there. Many posts are rants about other vehicles, particularly SUV's, and how much contempt they have for the drivers of such vehicles. The simple desire to be frugal with a tank of gas is not the primary motivation for many of these people. If it were, they wouldn't be taking their driving techniques to such ridiculous extremes as to be so obnoxious and even dangerous to other motorists.
 
#63
Google sustainable oil... There is quite a bit of interesting research in the field.

That said, I'm all for more efficient cars, alternative fuels that are MORE efficient than the current sources, and keeping our environment clean. I just don't follow blindly whatever egg head tells me that we're all going to die. I like to live with some modicum of hope, and I always support questioning the status quo.
 
#64
hbarcat said:
I've been reading the "hypermiling" websites and it's clear that this is as much an ideological practice as it is about them saving money. Most of them are using it as something of a statement about how their fellow drivers are wasting more gasoline and causing more pollution than is necessary for mere transportation from point A to point B.

They are saying, "You people driving your gas guzzling beasts with no regard to fuel economy or for the consequences of pollution need to see how extreme your behavior is." So they are behaving in an extreme manner in the opposite direction to illustrate the point. They are driving as frugally as they believe others are driving wastefully.

So now we have two extreme sides of a what was a sociological/economical/political debate that has now been transformed into a physical argument on the roadway. And all I want to do is get to work without getting into a car accident.
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They are doing illegal and annoying things and should be executed. I'm only partially kidding. :scowl::rollno:
 
#65
guy n. cognito said:
Personally I have no sympathy for someone who is poor enough to have to choose between eating and driving that has also chosen to spend their money on a Prius. That person is an idiot and doesn't really deserve my consideration.
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Once you are in that type of situation please comment.

Buying a 20,000 and a 12,000 car is only like 80-90 dollars per month difference as far as loans are concerned.

It is basically a wash with car payment and the money they saving on gas, but AT LEAST they are trying.

Please, call every person trying to keep the air clean an "idiot" for helping out, there are a ton of third world countries currently going through what we through over 100 years ago as our industrial revolution and adding more fossil fuel using devices daily at an astronomical rate.

So keep on driving your Cadillac Escalade and condemning those at least trying to make the air a little bit cleaner for our kids when they get older.

You don't have to believe in global warming to agree that we are trashing our environment every day.
 
#66
fenderhutz said:
Once you are in that type of situation please comment.

Buying a 20,000 and a 12,000 car is only like 80-90 dollars per month difference as far as loans are concerned.

It is basically a wash with car payment and the money they saving on gas, but AT LEAST they are trying.

Please, call every person trying to keep the air clean an "idiot" for helping out, there are a ton of third world countries currently going through what we through over 100 years ago as our industrial revolution and adding more fossil fuel using devices daily at an astronomical rate.

So keep on driving your Cadillac Escalade and condemning those at least trying to make the air a little bit cleaner for our kids when they get older.

You don't have to believe in global warming to agree that we are trashing our environment every day.
Click to expand...

Generally speaking, someone who is poor would be irresponsible to buy even a $12,000 car when there are millions of people out there driving beaters worth less than $1,000 :atoz:
 
#67
fenderhutz said:
Once you are in that type of situation please comment.

Buying a 20,000 and a 12,000 car is only like 80-90 dollars per month difference as far as loans are concerned.

It is basically a wash with car payment and the money they saving on gas, but AT LEAST they are trying.

Please, call every person trying to keep the air clean an "idiot" for helping out, there are a ton of third world countries currently going through what we through over 100 years ago as our industrial revolution and adding more fossil fuel using devices daily at an astronomical rate.

So keep on driving your Cadillac Escalade and condemning those at least trying to make the air a little bit cleaner for our kids when they get older.

You don't have to believe in global warming to agree that we are trashing our environment every day.
Click to expand...

Do you know for a fact he drives an Escalade? He could be driving a Corolla, for all you know. No need to get personal.
 
#69
embellisher said:
Do you know for a fact he drives an Escalade? He could be driving a Corolla, for all you know. No need to get personal.
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I own and use two cars with small 4 cylinder engines, and I keep them tuned up, tires inflated properly... I think I'm doing quite a bit to help the environment! I recycle packing materials when I ship and buy stuff on TB, I do a ton of correspondence online on a laptop, rather than using a big desktop using 400+ watts of power, I have some CFL's in my home...

And I still think hybrid buying people are fooling themselves if they think they are saving anything... Have you looked into the chemistry of the reserve batteries? Those are horrible, and recycling them takes a lot of processing... Also, the weight differences between a hybrid setup and a singular gas engine is quite different. The electric part is only marginally pulling more than it's own weight.
 
#71
I see stuff like this often... Especially slow driving in Westminster and Fountain Valley (Back me up Maki)

Im really getting worried about my reactions to this... I cant tell you how close i've come to actually ramming somebody intentionally... i drive in rush hour traffic to Hollywood every day, get the morning and evening traffic... My tolerance to BS driving has gone out the window.

It makes me feel uneasy at the amount of anger that leeches out during driving.
 
#73
there's literally scads of organic materials buried away in landfill sites all over the world just waiting to be dug up again and converted into oil and other plastics...

the company which comes up with a cheap method of converting the landfill material into oil will make an absolute mint...
 
#76
Ericman197 said:
Generally speaking, someone who is poor would be irresponsible to buy even a $12,000 car when there are millions of people out there driving beaters worth less than $1,000 :atoz:
Click to expand...

Before Gas tripled in the last 8 years, that car payment would have been acceptable. Before their heating bill tripled in the 8 years, etc. Being retired and on a fixed income doesn't mean you still have to drive a 94 Ford Tempo.
 
#78
fenderhutz said:
Once you are in that type of situation please comment.

Buying a 20,000 and a 12,000 car is only like 80-90 dollars per month difference as far as loans are concerned.

It is basically a wash with car payment and the money they saving on gas, but AT LEAST they are trying.

Please, call every person trying to keep the air clean an "idiot" for helping out, there are a ton of third world countries currently going through what we through over 100 years ago as our industrial revolution and adding more fossil fuel using devices daily at an astronomical rate.

So keep on driving your Cadillac Escalade and condemning those at least trying to make the air a little bit cleaner for our kids when they get older.

You don't have to believe in global warming to agree that we are trashing our environment every day.
Click to expand...

Actually, the difference between a $20,000 car and a $12,000 car (60 months, 6.5%, 100% financed) is $156.23, which is several weeks groceries for a poor person. Tell me the person that makes that decision isn't an idiot. Bear in mind, I don't consider all hybrid drivers idiots, just someone in the situation you claim (which, in my mind, is highly unlikely).

I've been in that situation, and, at the time, I chose to act responsibly and drove a $2500 POS Honda Civic. Looked like crap, but ran great and got me where I needed to go. Plus, I was able to feed myself. So, AGAIN, I have no sympathy for someone that ignorant.

I don't drive an Escalade, but I do drive a SUV. It is qualified as a ULEV and gets pretty good gas mileage.
 
#79
fenderhutz said:
Just making a point, I have no idea what he drives but on the same token calling everyone else an idiot in a post that is at least trying to make a difference is just as bad. :atoz:
Click to expand...

Please bear in mind, again, that I didn't call "everyone else" an idiot, just someone who would choose to purchase a relatively expensive hybrid car as opposed to feeding themselves. There are clearly better options for poor people (like $2500 POS Honda Civics) that are still relatively environmentally friendly.

Actually, when you think about the long term implications of disposing of a battery-laden hybrid, a regular 4-banger is probably the MORE environmentally-friendly choice.
 
#80
I don't criticize anyone's choice in vehicles. If they want to drive a windup car, or an expedition.......I don't care, they are the ones paying the bill.

However, regardless what you drive, you must be able to operate that vehicle safely. I drive a ulev as well, and get mid to high 30's mpg. I also have to drive up to 12 hours a day at times for work. Someone going 40mph to save 2 ounces of fuel on their commute is just a freaking idiot, causing dangerous situations, and screwing up other peoples schedules. Just an extremely selfish action.
 

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