Unless I see something special, I will just put my money in my pocket (bank account.) I guess my departed parents would be shocked that for once, I plan to not let money burn a hole in my pocket!
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I'm Cheap!
- Thread starter Dr. Cheese
- Start date
Unless I see something special, I will just put my money in my pocket (bank account.) I guess my departed parents would be shocked that for once, I plan to not let money burn a hole in my pocket!
I agree with your thinking doc. That said, I also like that you can get a carvin going for a few hundred now and save up the balance which will not be that much. They are top notch basses and a great value. My SB5000 is my main electric.
I may sound like a hypocrite, but if I did order a Carvin, I would feel like I am still keeping my word and not let money burn a hole in my pocket because the initial payment is low and I can save up for the purchase in an orderly fashion. What I am more concerned about is that not giving in to the rush or running out and buying or ordering something the moment the money is in my hot hands!
Wilbyman, you endorsing Carvin means a lot to me because I have seen some of the fine Foderas and other basses you have had in the past. I also know you are a mean Jazz player who knows his way around a bass too.
I may sound like a hypocrite, but if I did order a Carvin, I would feel like I am still keeping my word and not let money burn a hole in my pocket because the initial payment is low and I can save up for the purchase in an orderly fashion. What I am more concerned about is that not giving in to the rush or running out and buying or ordering something the moment the money is in my hot hands!
Wilbyman, you endorsing Carvin means a lot to me because I have seen some of the fine Foderas and other basses you have had in the past. I also know you are a mean Jazz player who knows his way around a bass too.
No offense to Carvin but if I were in the market for an SB I'd be patient and look at used ones. The drop in resale value is pretty eye-opening. A friend of mine recently loaded one to the hilt, changed his mind after a few weeks and sold it for about 1/3 what he paid for it. Yes, people do stuff like that and if you're really bent on spending the money on a bass, this might be a smart way to do it. Heck, there was also a Marleaux six string in the classified for under a grand.
For an amp there is currently a flat out ridiculous deal at Hello Music in the Hot Deals forum for new Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 amps. I just ordered one, along with a guitar polishing kit for $425 delivered. Not sure how many they have left. That is not a typo.
No, I didn't need it, far from it. But it's a flat out ridiculous deal IMO. Pair that with a $200 used cab and you have a rig that will take you anywhere. For relative peanuts.
Yo doc...Im with you.
I spent 300$ on my rig used (new it was a grand)
and bought a l2000 used for less than half price.
I love the GNL more everyday and I always get compliments on my tone so I have no need for a new bass and keep putting my cash in the bank!
I spent 300$ on my rig used (new it was a grand)
and bought a l2000 used for less than half price.
I love the GNL more everyday and I always get compliments on my tone so I have no need for a new bass and keep putting my cash in the bank!
No offense to Carvin but if I were in the market for an SB I'd be patient and look at used ones. The drop in resale value is pretty eye-opening. A friend of mine recently loaded one to the hilt, changed his mind after a few weeks and sold it for about 1/3 what he paid for it. Yes, people do stuff like that and if you're really bent on spending the money on a bass, this might be a smart way to do it. Heck, there was also a Marleaux six string in the classified for under a grand.
For an amp there is currently a flat out ridiculous deal at Hello Music in the Hot Deals forum for new Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 amps. I just ordered one, along with a guitar polishing kit for $425 delivered. Not sure how many they have left. That is not a typo.
No, I didn't need it, far from it. But it's a flat out ridiculous deal IMO. Pair that with a $200 used cab and you have a rig that will take you anywhere. For relative peanuts.
I undersand that used Carvins are great deals. There is one I am considering in the For Sale Forum. I am also considering ordering a new one simply because it is nice to sometimes get exactly what you want. If I go new, it will be a B50, they run about $200 cheaper than a SB5000 and I like their body shape better.
I am going to check out the amp deal too.
I don't see you as being cheap, just sensible. I would advise holding out for the one bass that you can't get out of your head. It took me over 20 years since I began my bass playing journey and a number of basses (G & L, Ibanez, Alembic and Warwick) to get my dream bass (Ken Smith Black Tiger 5), but I got it. I have never spent as much as I did for my Smith-and I never will again. Eventhough there are other basses that catch my ear (my Cirrus being one), I really don't have the urge to get another bass. That could of course change, but for now, I cool.
A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!
A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!
I don't see you as being cheap, just sensible. I would advise holding out for the one bass that you can't get out of your head. It took me over 20 years since I began my bass playing journey and a number of basses (G & L, Ibanez, Alembic and Warwick) to get my dream bass (Ken Smith Black Tiger 5), but I got it. I have never spent as much as I did for my Smith-and I never will again. Eventhough there are other basses that catch my ear (my Cirrus being one), I really don't have the urge to get another bass. That could of course change, but for now, I cool.
A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!
You know, my TL-5 is very, very close to perfect for me. I love the tone and playability. I love the electronics too. I really love that it is really usable in passive mode as well as active. Another TL-5 or TL-6 would be wonderful for me!
I love lots of basses like Groovelines, LowEnd Jazzes, Ken Smith, Sadowskys, etc. but I genuinely love these old Peaveys!
No offense to your friend, but used SBs are generally going for 70-80% of original retail, so he was pretty silly to sell for 1/3.
Hey, Dr. Cheese, I'd get a nice amp. Best money spent, IMO.
WoodyG3 said:No offense to your friend, but used SBs are generally going for 70-80% of original retail, so he was pretty silly to sell for 1/3.
Hey, Dr. Cheese, I'd get a nice amp. Best money spent, IMO.
I'm certain I will get some sort of G-K Ultralight amp since I am going to make my current very loud but heavy main amp my permanent church amp. I will get some sort of bass too, either something very inexpensive new or used, it I will put a down payment on something mid-priced that I can pickup in May.
If I do this, I will still have a nice amount of money for my savings.
There's really no shame in favoring a cheap bass over an expensive one. not all expensive basses are that great. some of them are like the high-end Ibanez soundgear basses and the musicman stringray basses. but there are affordable bass guitars that sound just as good as high-priced basses. and some of them could sound better than high-price basses. when it comes to buying a bass, it really doesn't matter how much it costs. it's all about personal taste in sound quality. so don't feel too bad about favoring a cheap bass over an expensive one.
I've had the chance to gig all 4 of my current stable over the past few days. I am surprised at what sounded and felt the best:
Squier VM Jaguar <$300 new -sounds authoritative for what I use it for, and has paid for itself twice over; bought to be a "bar gig beater," but everyone seems to like it.
Squier CV 60's Jazz <$400 new -a representative J-bass, but I want more out of it (a candidate for a pickup upgrade, at some point); it still does what I need it to do, but I could be happy without it. This one sits on a stand in my music room, plugged in, and ready to noodle, and is also used for acoustic trio gigs.
G&L USA JB2 $1200 new -a worthwhile investment, and I love my sound with it (has Quarter Pounders in it; another $100); indispensable high-end passive gig bass for corporate and casino work.
Warwick FNA Jazzman 2002 LTD $2500 new -it's gone up in value, and has its' uses. It's a once-in a lifetime instrument, but I could also be happy without it, at least in my current situations. This instrument can amaze, when I need it to, in a studio environment, and is my only bass with active electronics.
Squier VM Jaguar <$300 new -sounds authoritative for what I use it for, and has paid for itself twice over; bought to be a "bar gig beater," but everyone seems to like it.
Squier CV 60's Jazz <$400 new -a representative J-bass, but I want more out of it (a candidate for a pickup upgrade, at some point); it still does what I need it to do, but I could be happy without it. This one sits on a stand in my music room, plugged in, and ready to noodle, and is also used for acoustic trio gigs.
G&L USA JB2 $1200 new -a worthwhile investment, and I love my sound with it (has Quarter Pounders in it; another $100); indispensable high-end passive gig bass for corporate and casino work.
Warwick FNA Jazzman 2002 LTD $2500 new -it's gone up in value, and has its' uses. It's a once-in a lifetime instrument, but I could also be happy without it, at least in my current situations. This instrument can amaze, when I need it to, in a studio environment, and is my only bass with active electronics.
You remind me of the guy who posted a clip of himself playing a Squier Jaguar while playing with Anthony Hamilton on Jay Leno. It's funny to think that the Tonight Show's band director is a Sadowsky guy while Hamilton's bassist is using a Squier, and both sound just fine.
I think I have spent so much time loving gear, that a part of me wants to spend big money even if I am perfectly happy using much less expensive equipment.
As has been said many times on TB, we all need to listen with our ears and not our eyes.
it's true what you say!
i've been in & out of the markets long enough to know the risks. sometimes a bit of research can pocket some decent returns. my tiny investment was solely done to hopefully enable me to buy new gear. this fund is separate from my retirement fund.
as of today, i'm up another 20% and striding towards a double!
[/hi-jack]
it's true what you say!
i've been in & out of the markets long enough to know the risks. sometimes a bit of research can pocket some decent returns. my tiny investment was solely done to hopefully enable me to buy new gear. this fund is separate from my retirement fund.
as of today, i'm up another 20% and striding towards a double!
[/hi-jack]
Serious business, I need to PM with you for some pointers!
If you would have asked me 2 years ago how much I would spend on a bass I would have told you however much I want. I was in a mindset that the best bass for me was an expensive bass. I have now realized that the key to life is balance. Yes, I want a dependable bass with quality components that sounds and plays well. I have learned that I don't have to spend $5000.00 to get that though. I now try to find the best basses that I can for as little money as I can.
- Jun 3, 2009
- 3,330
- 398
- Disclosures
- Bassgearu, Music Industry Consulting and Sales. Tech 21, NBE Corp, Sonosphere.
If you're going to get the Carvin hold out for the SB. They are the real deal and truly the best thing Carvins ever done. Most of their basses in the past either had real sterile sounding generic electronics or felt unbearably stiff. And while there were some good values out there, they never were great. The SB's on the other hand are probably the best super-J alternative for the money. The five stringers really nailed the neck profile too.
- Jun 3, 2009
- 3,330
- 398
- Disclosures
- Bassgearu, Music Industry Consulting and Sales. Tech 21, NBE Corp, Sonosphere.
I think the argument over bass and price point is always interesting.
In 1979, when I purchased my first SB-600 Aria Pro II and my Hondo Longhorn, both together cost me less then a new P Bass and way less then a new Ric. The P Bass in both quality and sound was WAY WORSE then either or the two Japanese basses. As I've said in other threads and on other forums, the Japanese were trying to eliminate the MIJ as crap impression, and the Matsumoku factory turned out what we all would call high end today. That was a calculated move, and Ariia didn't make tons of money, as they sold them to flood the market and raise reputation, which in the long run actually worked. For a while.
Today you cannot say the same. MIC is often nearly identical to anything immediately post WWII from Japan. Now, in the past two years quality for those instruments is way up, but still not what other countries, Japan, Korea, Czechoslovakia are making.
Having said that, you can find extremely giggable and recordable basses in the cheaper import lines. A lot of that has to do with actual bass design and attention by the company to QC after they arrive in the US. Often times the instruments come straight from the factory to a warehouse and then dealer without any US human interaction. That is why you occasionally see threads here that a new bass came in with a dead pickup, or that the necks are bad, or that nuts are too high, yada yada. That isn't to say its a bad thing, just an explanation of how it goes.
In my 30 years what I have found is that the higher the price point, the more options you get, more versatility in sound you get, and overall more comfort. My Brute has killer giggability, and several sound guys have told me they like doing the sound from it through the DI. It records nicely as well.
My old custom Sadowsky, which, sadly, I no longer have, I could dial in a ton of live tones, and it gave me some interesting choices when recording. Did that make it better then say my Brute? Not in every situation.
They real key is what is YOUR sound. Will Lee gets paid huge money to sound like every bassist on the planet, so he uses and owns a range of instruments depending on the gig. He has a Ric and Hofner for his Fab Faux gigs, plays his signature Sadowsky on the Letterman Show, drags a whole lot into the studio with him.
Contrast that with say Pino Paladino. He has A signature sound. Just listen to "Every Time You Gp Away" by Paul Young. That is the Pino sound. He needs three things to get that sound. 1) A fretless fingerboard, 2) a P pickup config and 3) an amp or preamp that he can mold the tone a bit. So, in a pinch, Pino can walk into any shop and pick up say a Squier VM P bass with a fretless board, plug it into his rig, and he can get Pino sound out of it. Will he get Jaco sound out of it? Probably not.
Cost and value of bass only matter in the long run if you plan on selling them for a profit. If you have a bass you are never going to sell, then it doesn't matter. Lee Sklar has his old, supermodified Yamaha that to this day he still uses regularly. Does he care that back when he first got it it was a cheapo bass by standards? No. Did it do for him what he wanted? You bet!
For me, since I'm getting late in my career, I want to thin the herd and not have so many basses for fewer projects, so having a boutique or custom in my collection solves versatility. Now I only need about three to five basses to cover all my needs, instead of the dozen or so I needed previously.
In 1979, when I purchased my first SB-600 Aria Pro II and my Hondo Longhorn, both together cost me less then a new P Bass and way less then a new Ric. The P Bass in both quality and sound was WAY WORSE then either or the two Japanese basses. As I've said in other threads and on other forums, the Japanese were trying to eliminate the MIJ as crap impression, and the Matsumoku factory turned out what we all would call high end today. That was a calculated move, and Ariia didn't make tons of money, as they sold them to flood the market and raise reputation, which in the long run actually worked. For a while.
Today you cannot say the same. MIC is often nearly identical to anything immediately post WWII from Japan. Now, in the past two years quality for those instruments is way up, but still not what other countries, Japan, Korea, Czechoslovakia are making.
Having said that, you can find extremely giggable and recordable basses in the cheaper import lines. A lot of that has to do with actual bass design and attention by the company to QC after they arrive in the US. Often times the instruments come straight from the factory to a warehouse and then dealer without any US human interaction. That is why you occasionally see threads here that a new bass came in with a dead pickup, or that the necks are bad, or that nuts are too high, yada yada. That isn't to say its a bad thing, just an explanation of how it goes.
In my 30 years what I have found is that the higher the price point, the more options you get, more versatility in sound you get, and overall more comfort. My Brute has killer giggability, and several sound guys have told me they like doing the sound from it through the DI. It records nicely as well.
My old custom Sadowsky, which, sadly, I no longer have, I could dial in a ton of live tones, and it gave me some interesting choices when recording. Did that make it better then say my Brute? Not in every situation.
They real key is what is YOUR sound. Will Lee gets paid huge money to sound like every bassist on the planet, so he uses and owns a range of instruments depending on the gig. He has a Ric and Hofner for his Fab Faux gigs, plays his signature Sadowsky on the Letterman Show, drags a whole lot into the studio with him.
Contrast that with say Pino Paladino. He has A signature sound. Just listen to "Every Time You Gp Away" by Paul Young. That is the Pino sound. He needs three things to get that sound. 1) A fretless fingerboard, 2) a P pickup config and 3) an amp or preamp that he can mold the tone a bit. So, in a pinch, Pino can walk into any shop and pick up say a Squier VM P bass with a fretless board, plug it into his rig, and he can get Pino sound out of it. Will he get Jaco sound out of it? Probably not.
Cost and value of bass only matter in the long run if you plan on selling them for a profit. If you have a bass you are never going to sell, then it doesn't matter. Lee Sklar has his old, supermodified Yamaha that to this day he still uses regularly. Does he care that back when he first got it it was a cheapo bass by standards? No. Did it do for him what he wanted? You bet!
For me, since I'm getting late in my career, I want to thin the herd and not have so many basses for fewer projects, so having a boutique or custom in my collection solves versatility. Now I only need about three to five basses to cover all my needs, instead of the dozen or so I needed previously.
