Installing new bridge, help!

[jrcorp]

!

I'm in the long-term process of upgrading my '02 SR300DX. I bought a set of used Gotoh GB7's off a forumite as one of the stockers was acting up, and I just paid for a used 201 bridge. I know I'll have to dowel and drill, which though a new job to me doesn't seem too challenging. What I'm afraid of, and I'm probably stupid for buying the bridge, is that I think the string spacing is going to be wrong.

When I did my research, everything pointed to 19 mm spacing on Ibbies and I know it's 19 mm on the Gotoh. But with a ruler, the string spacing on my bass comes out to a hair over 20 mm. Going by each string, it's a tough call around 19-20, but measuring across the strings, it looks to be about 61 mm total.

Should I even try going through with it? My top concern is making sure the strings are over the pickups correctly. I know nearly all aftermarket bridges are built for Fenders. I mean to replace the pickups, hopefully with something like the SD vintage types. Apart from that, there is "playability," and maybe other issues I don't know about... break angles?!

I just thought of maybe filing new slots in the saddles as an option, but I would go to a tech/luthier for that. I won't do any not-easily-reversible work until I've measured everything 3 times. Worst case scenario, I'll hold onto the bridge for if/when I buy a Fender-type.

Thanks, all.

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[Bobster]

I wouldn't replace it unless you're sure what you need.

There are 20mm spaced bridges available, both in Fender-style and others. Here's one: 4 string Chrome Bass Bridge Flip Top Saddles BB004CR | eBay

The main question you need to answer is why you're changing it out.

Best of luck with the search, and try a micrometer on the string spacing.

Bob

 

[hotbass57]

I looked at your previous post. That looks like a good bridge. Why replace it? If you have a luthier close maybe PM him and ask him. He might help, there are a ton of guys here to ask also. +1 on what Bobster said...............

 

[jrcorp]

I wouldn't replace it unless you're sure what you need.

There are 20mm spaced bridges available, both in Fender-style and others. Here's one: 4 string Chrome Bass Bridge Flip Top Saddles BB004CR | eBay

The main question you need to answer is why you're changing it out.

Best of luck with the search, and try a micrometer on the string spacing.

Bob

Much appreciated. I wish I had a micrometer; maybe I'll pick up an affordable caliper sometime. I'm changing the bridge because the stock one is literally bending with the string tension - I know at least one of the holes for the mounting screws in back is stripped. I figure between that and any added benefit is reason enough.

I wasn't aware there were 20 mm spaced bridges commonly available. I guess when I searched I made the mistake of only looking at brand names, what people have reviewed, etc. I would be skeptical of buying a no-name item off eBay, but I'm sure there's no reason not to sometimes.

This is my first and only bass, so I'll keep the bridge if this doesn't work out to try not to lose $5-10.

 

[FunkMetalBass]

Put a strip of masking tape where the new bridge will be. Take a long straight edge, and set it on the side of the fretboard, then trace the line on the tape. Repeat for the other side. Effectively, what you've done is visually extended the fretboard. If you can keep the strings between these two lines (and I'm almost certain you can), you shouldn't have a problem.

 

[jrcorp]

Put a strip of masking tape where the new bridge will be. Take a long straight edge, and set it on the side of the fretboard, then trace the line on the tape. Repeat for the other side. Effectively, what you've done is visually extended the fretboard. If you can keep the strings between these two lines (and I'm almost certain you can), you shouldn't have a problem.

I appreciate the response, but I'm not entirely sure I follow. Someone posted on another forum that I need to be sure I install the bridge on the neck's centerline and so I should measure accordingly. That makes sense to me... what you have said does as well, but I'm pretty confident that the strings will be well on the fretboard. As I think about it more, I'm not too worried about the strings being a millimeter closer to each other.

 

[FunkMetalBass]

I appreciate the response, but I'm not entirely sure I follow. Someone posted on another forum that I need to be sure I install the bridge on the neck's centerline and so I should measure accordingly. That makes sense to me... what you have said does as well, but I'm pretty confident that the strings will be well on the fretboard. As I think about it more, I'm not too worried about the strings being a millimeter closer to each other.

I apologize for my freehand paint skills, but here's the idea:

This way you can see if your strings will even fit on the neck. If they do, you can now use the lines you drew to determine the neck's center line and place your bridge.


Your new bridge has smaller string spacing? I thought it was the other way around. Of course you'll be fine with smaller spacing.

 

[jrcorp]

So I'm having a few issues... I've measured a lot, but I'm worried that my lines may not be perfect. Measuring 17" from the nut puts me at a point towards the headstock on the 12th fret. Measuring from there, I get a 34" line that's not close to where the old bridge or saddles were. I'm hoping that's partly to blame on the bridge bending upward in back, but afraid it's a lot of my fault for setting the bass up entirely wrong. Attaching the old bridge and measuring from the saddles, I got scale lengths of about 34 1/2" on the E string to 34 1/8" or so on the G.

The lines I drew extending from the edges of the neck lead me to believe the old bridge was well off-center. I'm not sure if I should trust this and go forward, as it makes drilling for the new bridge confusing. Could the bass have been manufactured that poorly? The mounting holes look all about 3-5 mm off, and the bridge does look like it angles towards the upper bout or the E string.

I would love to get this done ASAP, as I've already been without bass for a day or two. Thanks for any help.

 

[Rocky McDougall]

So I'm having a few issues... I've measured a lot, but I'm worried that my lines may not be perfect. Measuring 17" from the nut puts me at a point towards the headstock on the 12th fret. Measuring from there, I get a 34" line that's not close to where the old bridge or saddles were. I'm hoping that's partly to blame on the bridge bending upward in back, but afraid it's a lot of my fault for setting the bass up entirely wrong. Attaching the old bridge and measuring from the saddles, I got scale lengths of like 35 1/2" on the E string to 35 1/8" or so on the G.

A quick measurement from the nut to the witness point on the G string saddle, should be 34" +/- 1/32" (If your bass was close to being properly intonnated and IF your bass is a 34" scale)

Whether you draw lines from the edge of the neck or from the centerline of the neck (using the fret markers) Should give you an indication of where the bridge "Plate" was installed. If it's off, the the neck may not be in the pocket straight and it may be canted off center.
Rocky

 

[jrcorp]

A quick measurement from the nut to the witness point on the G string saddle, should be 34" +/- 1/32" (If your bass was close to being properly intonnated and IF your bass is a 34" scale)

Whether you draw lines from the edge of the neck or from the centerline of the neck (using the fret markers) Should give you an indication of where the bridge "Plate" was installed. If it's off, the the neck may not be in the pocket straight and it may be canted off center.
Rocky

I just screwed up in looking at the ruler, as I was starting at the 1" line instead of 0. Sorry about that... guess it wasn't too far off, especially with the way the bridge was lifting and maybe the added string tension. So the G was about 34 1/8", and the E about 34 1/2". Not bad.

 

[Rocky McDougall]

Most bridges have different size/styles of base plates. The important thing is to get the saddles in the correct place.
Rocky

 

[jrcorp]

I drilled out the old holes and filled them with dowels, then drilled out the center 3 holes on the Gotoh as the outer 2 were close enough to a dowel. My drilling wasn't perfect, but this being my first project involving this kind of work I think I did pretty well. The bass was cheap enough that I don't think it was worth paying a shop to do the work. I appreciate the response.

 

[Rocky McDougall]

When you are ready to mark the exact spot for the bridge, be sure the G saddle is extended to about 90% of it's travel and measure 34" from the nut, Or 17" from the 12th fret, and make sure the witness point of the G saddle is exactly over the mark. The other three saddles are not important at this point, only the G saddle.
Rocky

 

[jrcorp]

When you are ready to mark the exact spot for the bridge, be sure the G saddle is extended to about 90% of it's travel and measure 34" from the nut, Or 17" from the 12th fret, and make sure the witness point of the G saddle is exactly over the mark. The other three saddles are not important at this point, only the G saddle.
Rocky

Thanks Rocky! I marked off and started drilling last night, so unfortunately that's already happened. I drilled with the G saddle being at about 75% at the 34" mark. I just finished cleaning everything up after I drilled the last 2 holes... 1 hole seems somewhat stripped out (it was half through a dowel) but 4 are fine. I'll string it up and set it up to the best of my ability tonight.

 

[jrcorp]

So I tried setting the bass up, and everything is for the most part fine. The D and G strings are a little off of where they were over the P pickup, but I'm not concerned about that. I broke two strings at the tuners because when I first strung the bass up I didn't know what I was doing and didn't leave enough string wrapped around the tuners. So I'll buy a new set tomorrow after work, but I have another issue.

With the Gotoh bridge installed, I couldn't get the action low enough. I measured around around 2.5-3 mm on the G string and around 3.5-4 mm on the E string at the 12th fret, which is about 1-1.5 mm higher than suggested by Ibanez in their manual. That was with the saddles lowered flat against the bridge plate. Manufacturers seem to have different methods of measuring relief and action, so I'm not sure how bad that action is. I'm also trying to get the relief just right, but either way I think that action is a little higher than I would like.

I've read that people have swapped the saddles out for stock as it's a difference of 2 mm, but the string spacing on the stock saddles is a little wider and the adjustment screws don't quite sit in the tracks the same. The only other solution I can think of is shimming the neck; I took some time making templates on card and foam but I don't know if the results would be worth all the time and effort.

I'll go pick up strings and give the bass another shot tomorrow, but I'm worried I'll get stuck with this.

 

[96tbird]

A shim will fix you up. Max a half an inch wide piece of business card at the bridge side of the pocket. Try one, if not, add another.

You can also get a cheap set of feeler gauges and cut shims... if you play metal.

But don't use foam!!!!!!!

 

[jrcorp]

I've been working at the bass in between work and other things, and I think I almost have it done to the best of my abilities. I made 3 shims that angled out from the back of the neck pocket, but between that and adjusting the truss rod to get the relief right the fretboard was curving back up towards the strings around the 17th fret up. So I started over and made up a few full-pocket shims, which seem to work slightly better.

I feel the relief is just about right, with maybe some tightening to do but I'm afraid of hitting another snag. With fiddling around with the action, I was adjusting for intonation so many times. Finally I have that right too, but the action is a bit high. I'm still around 2.5-3 mm on the G, and 3.5-4 on the E at the 12th fret. I got the pickup heights down and all, and I want to make witness points but am afraid of tweaking again and having it off.

If and when I get the tools and courage, I might try leveling the frets as I've seen a few walkthroughs and it doesn't look too bad with some caution and patience. I'm pretty sure that's the next step to getting this right; though the upper frets would get ground down more with the neck being off, it would help. Apart from that, I'm not sure how else to improve as there's no heel truss rod adjustment and I'm not paying much to get this worked on. The action is comfortable for me, I know it's high but any lower and I get fret buzz around the 15th fret. Thanks for all the help, and I'd appreciate any more ideas. I should get some pictures up...

 

[96tbird]

Hey brother, if the action is good for you, its good for us. Besides, think of the experience you are gaining.

 

[jrcorp]

It's just a royal PITA to keep trying to get it lower. I used to bring the action up to where I had no buzz, keep a radius, and move on to intonation. Now that I've learned more about neck relief and shimming, I've spent three times as long fiddling with everything. My little brother even poked fun at how long it was taking me.

I wanted to build a ramp next, but now I'm not sure this bass is worth it. It would probably be less stressful than fret work though.