• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Is 100 watts enough to play out? ... mmmmmmnope.

#321
madfiddler said:
all

just a quesiton or thought to ponder...I haven;t read the whole thread so sorry if someone already asked this.

I play in an indie rock band...not as loud as some full on metal or hardcore rock but loud enough imo!

I use a 300w Laney RBG500 1x15 combo which for smaller gigs (e.g. pubs) is fine. But I find I really need to add my 4x10 cab for the larger venues. (both have switchable horns)

Prior to this I had a 100w Trace Elliot Commando, which was woeful even in smaller venues. I tried all sorts of things, tilted it back, put it on a stool etc etc. but could hardly ever hear myself regardless of what was going on foh. I digged the tone, but it was wasted most of the time.

So for me I think its not so much about volume but the air that you can shift. I'm not aware that even with my cab I turn up the volume that much more (ok, maybe a bit then). There feels like there is plenty of headroom over the fender 2x10 and marshall tube amps the guitarists use (though they don't crank them to 11 fortuantely!)....what I mean is its about "feeling" the sound as much as "hearing" the sound...I like to feel my trouser material flap a little!

Maybe someone can explain this scientifically.....I can't!....is it total speaker surface area or something?

cheers
Chris
Click to expand...

So much has to do with:

1) The honesty of the wattage rating by the manufacturer, which varies hugely! Also, the distortion/quality of the amp.... i.e. is it 100 watts at 5% THD, or 100 watts at 1%THD. Finally, regarding wattage, that level of low end roll-off impacts things (i.e., is the amp reproducing frequencies down to 30hz, or rolled off at 40hz or whatever).

2) The quality of the speaker (the whole xmax thing... SPL, etc.). One 15" speaker can be loud as heck through the midrange, and then totally break up when pushed, another 15" driver can THUNDER, but possibly require more wattage to get there.

3) Related to the above... appropriate tuning of the cabinet, which can really impact how a speaker punches versus booms, which is directly related to perceived volume.


I'm not qualified to explain things technically, but I've tried so many 'equally rated' cabs (SPL, tuning) and heads (wattage) that perform TOTALLY different, that I'm pretty comfortable saying that looking at published specs unfortunately doesn't tell you much.

IMO and lots of IME!
 
#322
madfiddler said:
all

just a quesiton or thought to ponder...I haven;t read the whole thread so sorry if someone already asked this.

I play in an indie rock band...not as loud as some full on metal or hardcore rock but loud enough imo!

I use a 300w Laney RBG500 1x15 combo which for smaller gigs (e.g. pubs) is fine - the cabinet this is in is on the large (and heavy!) side for a 1x15 combo so that probbaly has something to do with its success. But I find I really need to add my 4x10 cab for the larger venues. (both cab and combo have switchable horns)

Prior to this I had a 100w Trace Elliot Commando, which was woeful even in smaller venues. I tried all sorts of things, tilted it back, put it on a stool etc etc. but could hardly ever hear myself regardless of what was going on foh. I digged the tone, but it was wasted most of the time.

So for me I think its not so much about volume but the air that you can shift. I'm not aware that even with my cab I turn up the volume that much more (ok, maybe a bit then). There feels like there is plenty of headroom over the fender 2x10 and marshall tube amps the guitarists use (though they don't crank them to 11 fortuantely!)....what I mean is its about "feeling" the sound as much as "hearing" the sound...I like to feel my trouser material flap a little!

Maybe someone can explain this scientifically.....I can't!....is it total speaker surface area or something?

At end of the day though if you are really playing together as a band I think you can make pretty much any variety of amps work together (with PA the more so!) if you have the musicianship and play for the success of the song rather than play as a selfish a-hole that wants to impress the girls - LOL!

cheers
Chris
Click to expand...

I've gigged a Trace Elliot Commando 100w combo, 1 x 15, for 13 years and it's always done the job. At pubs and clubs etc with a live drummer it's cut through fine. On larger stages it's performed fine as a stage monitor.
 
#323
KJung said:
So much has to do with:

1) The honesty of the wattage rating by the manufacturer, which varies hugely! Also, the distortion/quality of the amp.... i.e. is it 100 watts at 5% THD, or 100 watts at 1%THD. Finally, regarding wattage, that level of low end roll-off impacts things (i.e., is the amp reproducing frequencies down to 30hz, or rolled off at 40hz or whatever).

2) The quality of the speaker (the whole xmax thing... SPL, etc.). One 15" speaker can be loud as heck through the midrange, and then totally break up when pushed, another 15" driver can THUNDER, but possibly require more wattage to get there.

3) Related to the above... appropriate tuning of the cabinet, which can really impact how a speaker punches versus booms, which is directly related to perceived volume.


I'm not qualified to explain things technically, but I've tried so many 'equally rated' cabs (SPL, tuning) and heads (wattage) that perform TOTALLY different, that I'm pretty comfortable saying that looking at published specs unfortunately doesn't tell you much.

IMO and lots of IME!
Click to expand...

So true. There are so many different variables.
 
#324
the low one said:
I've gigged a Trace Elliot Commando 100w combo, 1 x 15, for 13 years and it's always done the job. At pubs and clubs etc with a live drummer it's cut through fine. On larger stages it's performed fine as a stage monitor.
Click to expand...

+1

Put 100watts through a couple of Fitzmaurice designed cabs with higher efficiency ratings and you'll move plenty of air to be heard, even on larger stages.
 
#330
:cool:

My simple gigging wattage rule.
What ever guitarist is using for wattage.
Bass must be at least, 4 times guitar wattage.
Example, 50 watt guitar amp= 200 watt bass amp. (or more)

I've used 100 watt Bass amp (Ampeg V4BH) with 15-20 watt guitar amps. And it sounded great.
 
#331
Munjibunga said:
Wow. I started this thread almost 11 years ago. My views haven't changed, either, except that I think 300 watts is a little puny.
Click to expand...
Nonsense. I run an 800RB into a 4x10 and I can't turn it up even halfway, nearly ever. Stupid loud, 300 watts. Or how 'bout an SVT into 8 10"s? Not enough? Really?
That little kickback? I've used them, they work fine, as long as you don't crank the Bass knob.
You say they would have sounded better if the bassist had a bigger/better rig. You know what would have happened? The guitards would have turned up even more, then the drummer, until everyone's ears started bleeding.
:D
 
#333
I've played small to medium clubs with a yamaha 100 watt combo that I got in the 80's many times. I still use it for rehearsal in a garage with two guitars and drums. Someone called the cops on us a couple of weeks ago. Clean, loud and 90lbs.

Not all 100 watts are created equal. There's an ampeg b115 and behringer 180w combo at church that I wouldn't attempt to gig with unless it was with acoustic guitars.
 
#334
Make sure your moving more air with a larger cabinet. And you can mic the cab through P A or use the D I when performing. The cabinet is your personal monitor. Place it high by your ears. 100 watts is good. Just tell the diva guitarist to turn down. That's the real challenge. Lol
 
#335
#336
wow, major zombie thread!

yeah, it's all about the cab, really.

i've seen loud-ass post-punk bands with the bass player using an old GK200rb to put a whopping 100 watts into an old SVT cab; when cranked up to the edge of grindy, it was plenty loud.
 
#338
Yep, it all depends on whose 100 watts it is. I played through my new Trace GP11 preamp/ Crest LA601 set- up tonight. A/B'd with a mesa 1x15" against a GK 1001RB/ Mesa 2x10 cab. Now this 601 has 120 watts into 8 ohms/ per channel. The GK must be at least 300 watts into 8 ohms. The LA601 sounded MUCH louder and cleaner than the GK head even with just 120 watts. The GK was a ball of mush while the Trace/ Crest set- up was cleaner, punchier and much 'fuller' sounding. Go figure.
 
#340
As I've said earlier in this thread, I gig regularly with 180 watts, and it's more than enough. I've used a single 15" speaker, too. No problems. I've gigged with much less and had it work fine, too.

It really depends on the gig.

The idea that everyone needs huge wattage to play any gig is just silly.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back