Is my bass the limiting factor?

[MassacreBass]

I've been trying for several years to get a nice growling modern metal bass tone. I've used various preamps, from Bass Pod Pro, to Eden Navigator, and currently a Helix-LT. I've tried numerous EQ setting suggestions from online forums and instructional videos. Nothing comes close to the sound that others seem to get effortlessly. I'm starting to think my Ibanez SDGR basses, and their electronics might be the limiting factor here. Is that the problem? Any advice is appreciated.

 

[Elusive1]

What strings are you using and how old are they?

 

[RattleSnack]

Also, what model and pickups config are you using?
Growl is high mids content. Steel roundwound strings, normal setup, bridge pickup favoured or soloed get you close. Maybe a bit of EQ shaping: cut low mids, boost high mids (1-3.2kHz). Add or remove bass and treble according to taste.
How are you amplifying sound? Maybe cab is dull.

 

[Chris Chong]

I've been trying for several years to get a nice growling modern metal bass tone. I've used various preamps, from Bass Pod Pro, to Eden Navigator, and currently a Helix-LT. I've tried numerous EQ setting suggestions from online forums and instructional videos. Nothing comes close to the sound that others seem to get effortlessly. I'm starting to think my Ibanez SDGR basses, and their electronics might be the limiting factor here. Is that the problem? Any advice is appreciated.

Are you referring to this modern metal bass tone? You can try heavy compressed lows, and blend in highly distorted mids and highs.

 

[MassacreBass]

What strings are you using and how old are they?

New Ernie Ball Elixirs

 

[Rdore2000]

Just get a Darkglass pedal. It makes every bass sound the same, but some people seem to enjoy the tone.

 

[MartinB]

Could you give an example of what you think is "a nice growling modern metal bass tone"?

 

[XLunacy]

"metal bass tone" is in large part technique and setup, make sure you have those in check before anything else.

Nothing comes close to the sound that others seem to get effortlessly

It takes years to make it seem effortless

Could you give an example of what you think is "a nice growling modern metal bass tone"?

This. And a short sample of you playing might be helpful too.

 

[Malak the Mad]

New Ernie Ball Elixirs

Aren't Ernie Ball and Elixirs two, different brands?

EDIT: I don't know your exact situation or how you play, but this is something worth considering. Last year, I witnessed a true "'tone' is in the fingers" situation when I let a friend try out my Fender Blacktop Jazz. Between the two of us, there was a noticeable difference in the sound it produced. In her hands, it sounded like a regular bass, which was very different to the aggressive sound I get out of it.

After a while, I figured out it was due to the considerable difference in our hand strength. I'm much taller and work with my hands all day long, so my "normal" lands harder on the strings than hers. That's not to say she can't get great sound. I've seen and heard her do it with other basses, but to get the most out of mine, it would seem you really have to dig in.

John Taylor of Duran Duran said something similar during a rig-rundown interview. He said, if he wanted to get the most out of the vintage Stingray given to him by Bernard Edwards, it took some real effort.

With all that in mind, maybe try altering your attack on the strings, or even changing the strings themselves, to see if you get any closer to the sound in your head? Exhaust all possibilities before dropping tons of money on pickups or a different bass.

 

[iTzPrime]

I've been trying for several years to get a nice growling modern metal bass tone. I've used various preamps, from Bass Pod Pro, to Eden Navigator, and currently a Helix-LT. I've tried numerous EQ setting suggestions from online forums and instructional videos. Nothing comes close to the sound that others seem to get effortlessly. I'm starting to think my Ibanez SDGR basses, and their electronics might be the limiting factor here. Is that the problem? Any advice is appreciated.

What do you understand under modern metal bass tone? Nolly sound? There are tons of presets for the Helix. Helix has an included B7k. If you use that and built a chain similar to what Nolly builds in a DAW, you can get extremely close. What strings do you use (gauge, brands etc). Do you play with a pick or fingers?

The electronics in the Ibanez aren't great and IMO a bit noisy, but you should get the tone relatively easy

 

[Drifter8230]

I would say; I didn't start nailing down the modern metal tone I was looking for before I included compression at the beginning, and end, of my pedal chain. Slow Release, Fast Attack, 4:1 ratio (worked for me).

My pedal chain is simple: tuner > MXR Bass Compressor > DG Harmonic Booster (mids ) > DG X7 (with a "mids" bump ) > DG Hyper Luminal Booster (compression) > DG Microtubes500v2 running clean. I didn't set out to become a Darkglass fanboy...but their stuff slowly started taking over my signal chain . I play 3 finger style exclusively but a pick is great for getting a good, strong Attack

Type of bass makes a difference but as long as you favor the bridge pickup, tone down the bass and favor the mids/treble, any bass, especially an Ibanez, should get you there.

If your cabinet has a tweeter/highs control, dial in a little more highs in the cabinet. I worked on the mids/highs in my whole signal chain until I found the right sound, then I slowly added back (compressed) lows to "flavor."

I'm no expert or anything, but I'm OCD with my sound and it took a long time before I was finally able to stand back and say "there it is, I'm done tweaking knobs." So I get it. Don't forget that just because you like your tone in your practice space solo/alone, it doesn't mean your tone will sound appropriate in a band setting. I am not in a band currently so my settings make me happy while jamming out to Cannibal Corpse and Slayer in my basement.

f it helps here are pictures of the levels of some of the important parts of my chain:

 

[hondo4life]

Just get a Darkglass pedal. It makes every bass sound the same, but some people seem to enjoy the tone.

I would have a Darkglass if I was still in a metal band. I actually have the ripoff version, Joyo Double Thruster and think it’s nice for the price.
Also use a heavy pick closer to the bridge with new roundwounds.

 

[mcnach]

New Ernie Ball Elixirs

? That's two different brands, and it still doesn't give us any idea what strings you use

 

[chris_b]

Are there any metal bassists not using a bank of pedals?

Seems to me that pedals will get you there and the bass and strings are a smaller part of the equation.

 

[Drifter8230]

Are there any metal bassists not using a bank of pedals?

Seems to me that pedals will get you there and the bass and strings are a smaller part of the equation.

No, man....that's crazy . You NEED pedals...(I'm kidding). For years back in my gigging days in a hard rock/metal band I just played my Ibanez Soundgear straight into my SWR Workingmans 400 and 2 SWR Workingmans 2x10 cabinets and it worked just fine. It wasn't until years later that I joined TALKBASS that I started to add, or experiment with, pedals.

At a very basic level, steel roundwounds with a P or P/J style bass with the right settings and technique, will get the job done. That's the important part; most everything else is just "nice to have"

 

[poochiecheeks]

@MassacreBass ,
I have been through this and I know your pain. You dont have to buy any more outboard gear, what you have should work.
-Go get a set of bright stainless steel strings in your preferred gauge. I like to lean on the lighter side than heavier, so maybe DR hi beams or something
-Put on the strings and set your neck to be as straight as possible without the first few frets fretting out. Youll know where the right spot is. Sdgr necks can move a bit on their own which may fight your setup down the road w humidity changes
-With the neck flat set your strings as low as theyll go. I have one of those metal d'addario string measurement cards, start with 4/64" measured at the 17th fret for all 4 strings. If you have a B set that to 6-7/64" to start. Once you get these starting points, lower each string slowly and listen to how the growl changes. Too low is when the string chokes out, there is a sweet spot you have to find
-After this raise the pickups to be much closer to the strings. I set them as close as possible with the neck pickup slightly lower but you just have to mess with it
-finally, play striking down into the string and not pulling parallel to the body. you want the strings smacking into the fretboard. Im sure you already know this but its important

Just doing that I guarantee something with your sound will improve. After that, try boosting 1.5-2k to accentuate that. If you need to buy something the older sansamps are incredible for this sound. The darkglass pedals too but a lot of that sound you hear is from the dingwall bass itself and not the pedal. You should be 80% there with your setup and technique alone.

If you want to get closer electronics wise, the darkglass tone capsule is a great step towards that with some awesome eq points. Though this setup will work passive, a lot of times better than any active setup. Try one thing at a time, the tone capsule should drop into your bass if it has the 3 knob layout.

Do you have a picture of your bass for reference?

let me know if any of that works for you

 

[Gervais Cote]

Growling ?

When I play in jam sessions, a P or a PJ bass with rounds is ALWAYS the one that growls the most.

It’s a good sound test IMO because between each bass player getting on the stage, we don’t have time to change the EQ which remains flat all the way.

 

[Drifter8230]

@MassacreBass ,
I have been through this and I know your pain. You dont have to buy any more outboard gear, what you have should work.
-Go get a set of bright stainless steel strings in your preferred gauge. I like to lean on the lighter side than heavier, so maybe DR hi beams or something
-Put on the strings and set your neck to be as straight as possible without the first few frets fretting out. Youll know where the right spot is. Sdgr necks can move a bit on their own which may fight your setup down the road w humidity changes
-With the neck flat set your strings as low as theyll go. I have one of those metal d'addario string measurement cards, start with 4/64" measured at the 17th fret for all 4 strings. If you have a B set that to 6-7/64" to start. Once you get these starting points, lower each string slowly and listen to how the growl changes. Too low is when the string chokes out, there is a sweet spot you have to find
-After this raise the pickups to be much closer to the strings. I set them as close as possible with the neck pickup slightly lower but you just have to mess with it
-finally, play striking down into the string and not pulling parallel to the body. you want the strings smacking into the fretboard. Im sure you already know this but its important

Just doing that I guarantee something with your sound will improve. After that, try boosting 1.5-2k to accentuate that. If you need to buy something the older sansamps are incredible for this sound. The darkglass pedals too but a lot of that sound you hear is from the dingwall bass itself and not the pedal. You should be 80% there with your setup and technique alone.

If you want to get closer electronics wise, the darkglass tone capsule is a great step towards that with some awesome eq points. Though this setup will work passive, a lot of times better than any active setup. Try one thing at a time, the tone capsule should drop into your bass if it has the 3 knob layout.

Do you have a picture of your bass for reference?

let me know if any of that works for you

As someone who also feels the OPs pain, that is great advice and I second the use of the DR Hi-Beams; those are great strings for an aggressive tone

 

[KevInDaBassment]

@MassacreBass ,
I have been through this and I know your pain. You dont have to buy any more outboard gear, what you have should work.
-Go get a set of bright stainless steel strings in your preferred gauge. I like to lean on the lighter side than heavier, so maybe DR hi beams or something
-Put on the strings and set your neck to be as straight as possible without the first few frets fretting out. Youll know where the right spot is. Sdgr necks can move a bit on their own which may fight your setup down the road w humidity changes
-With the neck flat set your strings as low as theyll go. I have one of those metal d'addario string measurement cards, start with 4/64" measured at the 17th fret for all 4 strings. If you have a B set that to 6-7/64" to start. Once you get these starting points, lower each string slowly and listen to how the growl changes. Too low is when the string chokes out, there is a sweet spot you have to find
-After this raise the pickups to be much closer to the strings. I set them as close as possible with the neck pickup slightly lower but you just have to mess with it
-finally, play striking down into the string and not pulling parallel to the body. you want the strings smacking into the fretboard. Im sure you already know this but its important

Just doing that I guarantee something with your sound will improve. After that, try boosting 1.5-2k to accentuate that. If you need to buy something the older sansamps are incredible for this sound. The darkglass pedals too but a lot of that sound you hear is from the dingwall bass itself and not the pedal. You should be 80% there with your setup and technique alone.

If you want to get closer electronics wise, the darkglass tone capsule is a great step towards that with some awesome eq points. Though this setup will work passive, a lot of times better than any active setup. Try one thing at a time, the tone capsule should drop into your bass if it has the 3 knob layout.

Do you have a picture of your bass for reference?

let me know if any of that works for you

All of this ^
(Especially the part about DR Hi Beams )

Ibanez SDGR basses are typically great for this type of tone, but a lot of it is in the strings and technique too.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

I've been trying for several years to get a nice growling modern metal bass tone. I've used various preamps, from Bass Pod Pro, to Eden Navigator, and currently a Helix-LT. I've tried numerous EQ setting suggestions from online forums and instructional videos. Nothing comes close to the sound that others seem to get effortlessly. I'm starting to think my Ibanez SDGR basses, and their electronics might be the limiting factor here. Is that the problem? Any advice is appreciated.

As much as I love my Navi, I can’t imagine how you would get a good metal sound out of it without some sort of effects pedal in the side the side chain.