Is there really a big difference between Squire vs Fender

[zon6c-f]

When my wife gave me my Squier, first thoughts were ,"It's just a beater-bass". I could envision: upgraded tuners, bridge, pups. When I actually began playing it and remembering only subtle differences between my bass and far more costly MM active 5 on day of purchase..and the beauty of fit and finish on my Squier...Then I added up parts costs to "upgrade"..could have bought a more expensive bass and made no mods.

All I had to do was a typical set-up; to my taste...well..I did trash the battery that came with it...LOL...

Tuners are not so deficient as needing to be replaced or upgraded. Pups are fine. Rough fret ends? Not worth cost of having frets crowned,or having the bass PLEK-ed, etc.

Long story short...Only thing I am changing on my Squier is strings and battery...as needed.

 

[boristhespider9]

Borris.... I disagree with your auto analogy. First of all BMW does not make Ford..although Ford owned Jaguar at one time.... Squier IS a subsidiary of Fender. A clearer analogy would be Lincoln vs Ford; Cadillac vs Chevy.

I own a Rickenbacker also and I would never compare any Squier to any Rickenbacker, nor would I compare my ZON to Squier.

OK..So you drive a BMW..I used to own a VW Bus, which was pure GERMAN crap; "Hitlers revenge". Now that would be a more fair anaolgy than BMW to Ford. So what kind of bass[ es] do you own..Better be better than Zon, ACE.

Again.. BMW is more for the illusion of prestige when compared
with other autos of like heritage; FERARRI...or Corvette, from a driving perspective; check used prices or collectibility of either over BMW.

END OF DEBATE! [ And I thought I would never lower myself and enter a flame war..JEEZE...]

Not to prolong this (ok, maybe a little) but the orginal question is whether there is a significant difference between Squiers and Fenders. Obviously that's not a very precise question because there are a few different levels of Squiers and myriad of different levels of Fenders. Then, we started talking about the American Standard, which most consider the flagship of the Fender line. Then, you said this:

"If a new American Standard 4 string Precision is @ $1,149 and a new 4 string Squier Precision is @ $179 then the main difference between the two is @ $970.

Functional differences are minimal other than difficulty spelling Squier..LOL..."

I just don't see the accuracy of that statment. So, flippantly, I mentioned the Ford v. BMW analogy. You can claim the only difference is price since they will both get you where you want to go, but the reality is there is a reason that one is more expensive than the other including features, build quality, fit and finish, reliability, and yes - even "brand name," etc. (don't really want to debate specific car brands, it was just a simple analogy and I'm not much of a car guy). From a purely academic standpoint, if the only difference between an Am. Std. Fender and a Squier was the price, we would have all figured it out by now and Fender wouldn't be successful selling the higher-end models.

So, to answer the original question, yes, there are differences. There are more differences as you move up to the Am. Std. than the lower end Fenders. And there is a psychological component to owning a Fender over a Squier (yea, I know some of you like to proclaim you don't care what name is on the headstock, but I feel no shame in admitting that I do and that it's a fact of the music world). I also take pride in saving up for things I know deep down I really want and not feeling like I compromised.

Two final things. First I wasn't comparing the Squier to my Lakland USA Joe Osborn or Glaub which are superior in every way to even my American Standards. I was answering the orignal question.

Second, I don't own a BMW!

 

[Batmensch]

I'd bet 9/10 of Squiers sold are never modified at all.

Agreed. The only mods I haver made are strictly aesthetic, the functional parts (pickups, electronics, tuners bridge ....) are all dead stock, because they are perfectly fine, there was absolutely no need whatsoever to swap them out . And I know of many fellow TB'ers who had intentions of modding their Squiers who changed their minds once they got the bass in their hands and decided to kepp it stock. Modding a Squier is NOT a given, NOT something that HAS to be done.

 

[miles'tone]

If you come across a lightweight Squier classic vibe Precision, buy it! Great basses ( I've tried a few) and the light ones I've played resonate beautifully.

 

[stratovani]

I think a lot of people commenting on here are not familiar with the newer CV or VM Squiers. That's not a diss to anyone in particular. They're right if you're judging a base Squier, not one from those series...they're not that great. However, I would put my CV Jazz at probably around the level of the American Specials. The pickups are amazing, the stock bridge, IMO, is better than the stock Fender bent plate, and I haven't had any problems with tuners. You asked for opinions, so I'm going to give you mine: Buy the Squier. If you're looking for a P, I recommend the butterscotch finished VM P. The money that you save that would be the difference, I would invest in a better quality amp. I think that's going to make more of a difference for you right off the bat in your sound. Again, all just IMHO.

I'll second that emotion! I tried the Squier 60s CV Jazz at GC last year, and I was, as the British would say, gobsmacked! The fit and finish was first class, the tone was exactly like what a Jazz Bass should sound like, and the action and intonation was perfect. The only thing I regretted was not having the money to buy it right then and there. $265!! I'll pick one up someday! IMO no other bass has so much bang for the buck as the Squier CV series!

 

[ulynch]

This exact thread shows up every couple months here, and every time the same vague and unsubstantiated claims are made. Fender users "better" wood, pickups, electronics, tuners. And every time I wonder, what makes this tone cap better than that one? And in exactly what way is this potentiometer "better" than the other? How is this wood "better" than that wood?

If you want to claim you like the sound of these pickups over the sound of those, great! But don't try to claim they're somehow "better". That's just BS and arrogance. Same with wood. :scowl:

On the other hand, if you want to point to specific, quantifiable features of the instruments, I'd like to hear what you have to say. Points about fret finishing are well taken, for example. Tuner stability too. I personally dislike basswood because it tends to be soft and frequently fails to hold screws securely. I have a basswood instrument that I *really* like otherwise.

But if you can't quantify it, you're just stating your personal preference. You're welcome to it, but don't try telling us that your preference is "better" than anyone else's.

 

[Sam Evans]

I love when people state things like this as if they were fact. I owned an American made precision deluxe that I bought new and was a complete piece of crap on multiple levels. My active squier tuners tuned way better, the bass was more solidly assembled, it sounded better, had better buzz free action, and didn't have a handful of issues that my p bass came with.

I didn't say it was a fact; I said it was "the conventional wisdom," with all that entails, to summarize for the OP what he's going to read in the millions of threads here on the subject.

It's also obvious that we're talking in generalities here. Of course any particular instrument might be better or worse than any other particular instrument, as was the case with your experience.

Please don't go out of your way to interpret what I'm saying in the worst possible way. Thanks.

 

[Joe Nerve]

Please don't go out of your way to interpret what I'm saying in the worst possible way. Thanks.

OK.

 

[zon6c-f]

Borris.. my brother-in-bass...we're good..LOL.. If talking / debating basses is my greatest issue of the day, then I am having a great day.

If you are ever in Atlanta, send me a PM..I'll buy the first round and I'll take you to Atlanta Bass Gallery [where there are NO Squiers] .

Porsche is building their Southeastern HQ near Atlanta/ Hartsfield/ Jackson Airport..I'll show you the site..they are just breaking ground for now..

So....Can we be " FRIENDS", now?

 

[boristhespider9]

Borris.. my brother-in-bass...we're good..LOL.. If talking / debating basses is my greatest issue of the day, then I am having a great day.

If you are ever in Atlanta, send me a PM..I'll buy the first round and I'll take you to Atlanta Bass Gallery [where there are NO Squiers] .

Porsche is building their Southeastern HQ near Atlanta/ Hartsfield/ Jackson Airport..I'll show you the site..they are just breaking ground for now..

So....Can we be " FRIENDS", now?

Only if part of this package includes me sampling the Zon!

 

[JoeVictim]

First, you are going to get pros and cons from both sides.

***I will tell you this, it doesn't matter***

I've played great Squiers and horrible Squiers. I've played great Fenders and horrible Fenders. Get the one that feels/sounds good to you. The quality control varies too greatly for any of us to give you information that you will actually use.

I would suggest going and playing everything in the store. Then try a different store. Play basses until you find "the one". You will find it, be patient. Once you find it, it really doesn't matter what name is on the headstock.

The name of my "one" Jazz bass says Carvin on it. This is the best advice I can give to someone starting out.

 

[MakoMan]

The only real difference is the name on the headstock...

 

[David Jayne]

"If a new American Standard 4 string Precision is @ $1,149 and a new 4 string Squier Precision is @ $179 then the main difference between the two is @ $970.

Functional differences are minimal other than difficulty spelling Squier..LOL..."

I just don't see the accuracy of that statment. So, flippantly, I mentioned the Ford v. BMW analogy.

The car analogy fails because cars are made from thousands of parts, each of which is engineered to work properly(or not), and then engineering is done to make them all work properly together(or not). The level of 'or not' in a given car is generally inversely proportional to the price of the car. There are many, many opportunities for failure.

A Fender style bass guitar, on the other hand, is made from maybe twenty or thirty parts, depending on how far you want to break it down. There is no ground-breaking engineering. Not many opportunities for failure. Two pieces of wood, and a few metal bits. The quality, or lack of it, is mostly in the assembly.

 

[Not yet]

In my experience....

have a CV Precision I keep in Chicago. Love it for that application and am thinking of bringing it home, great bass.

However as stated the parts are not of the same quality (however those Duncan designed P/Us are awesome) and the neck and body do feel noticeably less substantial than my American P.

For the $200 I paid for it new at GC it is the best buy I've ever made on an instrument, but the American P is the #1

 

[aborgman]

Agreed. The only mods I haver made are strictly aesthetic, the functional parts (pickups, electronics, tuners bridge ....) are all dead stock, because they are perfectly fine, there was absolutely no need whatsoever to swap them out . And I know of many fellow TB'ers who had intentions of modding their Squiers who changed their minds once they got the bass in their hands and decided to kepp it stock. Modding a Squier is NOT a given, NOT something that HAS to be done.

I'd be willing to bet that close to 8/10 basses (of all brands and costs) never see more than a couple hours of playing time by the original owner, much less any modification.

 

[ulynch]

Not to pick on you, but ...

However as stated the parts are not of the same quality

Just what exactly does that mean? What parts? What quality? And in exactly what way?

the neck and body do feel noticeably less substantial than my American P.

What's "substantial" mean? Do you mean that the instrument weighs less? If you put them on a scale, what's the difference in weight? Do you just prefer a heavier instrument?

 

[PikeoftheLake]

I spent the $1200 in 2008 on an American Standard as a graduation present to myself. All I can remember about that bass is the constant feeling of disappointment every time I picked it up. I kept thinking I paid $1200 for this? I ended up selling it and bought one of the Squier classic vibe basses. It was the exact same thing for one third of the price.

Some of the Fender praise gets a little preachy around here for my tastes. Makes me wonder if folks spend big buck on these pieces of mass manufactured wood and then praise the instruments to justify the purchase.

 

[tastybasslines]

then praise the instruments to justify the purchase.

This is why don't don't trust online reviews that much unless there is A LOT of them with high praise for the same product.

I happen to really love my Fender HWY One P, and its neck is the best I've ever felt, but tend to agree that despite a few things...the price is not a direct reflection of the quality.

 

[pacojas]

The only real difference is the name on the headstock...

a man who see's the bigger picture!!! i salute you, MakoMan...

 

[bassbenj]

@Joe Nerve - Can't believe you had that many issues with fender American made basses. Whoa....

@drummer - Nice!

@Joe Nerve - I CAN believe he had that many issue with Fender American. When I was looking of a Jazz bass I looked at a LOT of Fenders and Squiers.

The truth is simple. ON AVERAGE, the Fender Americans will tend to be better than the Fender Mexico, which will tend to be better than Squiers. But that is ON AVERAGE. I played some absolutely HORRIBLE American Fenders that they were asking over a grand for. I mean amazingly disgusting basses! Now at that time I played some pretty good Squiers and also some pretty bad ones. What did I end up with? [Note this was ALL about the basses as cost was not a factor in my choice] It was a $300 used (but like new) MIM Fender Jazz. Eventually it needed a "final tweak" which was SCN pickups, but it's an astounding bass.

And now I have a Squier P/J 5er. Sure it has been modded with new pickups, but you can't even compare it to a Fender because Fender doesn't even sell one! (except custom shop, I suppose) Again an absolutely amazing bass that I prefer to my "real" Fender Jazz. The only downside is that while it has a Fender-shaped headstock, it still says "Squier" on it.

So rules that apply "on average" may be useful, the only truly effective way to insure your bass is great is to play them all and pick the one that speaks your language. I did and I couldn't be happier.

@ Drummer - And speaking of the above did everyone notice that the Squier bass has cooler wood grain than the real Fender? Just the sort of thing I'm talking about!