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Is this a bass player and amp thing or....

#21
+1 to what KJung said

there is a lot on new technology in bass amplification but there are also those TB'ers who over fluff the products they endorse. I'm sure the companies they endorse appreciate it but I'm not sure what good it does them.

The only piece of gear I've ever purchased without trying and only going by the feedback of other TB'ers was my Epifani UL-410. I'm very happy I listened to them too...it's a great cab and insanely light! Like stated above, you just have to read between the lines of hype and actual feedback of someone who has been using it in the real world.
 
#22
And there are also those of us who found the gear we endorse long before becoming endorsers, approached the company after already purchasing the vast majority of our gear with no "endorsement discount", and endorse a company because we truly came to believe in the products and the company before we were endorsers. Many of us also go out of our way to be fair, and even recommend trying other gear depending on the player's needs, although we of course still speak positively of the gear we have chosen to represent.

Then we get to be accused of being biased and unethical, get called "fanboys", and generally have our opinions disregarded as though we each get $100 every time someone else buys a product from the company we endorse.

Big fun! :D

p.s. sorry ... I've just been called a "fanboy" one too many times lately.
 
#24
Fretlessboy said:
Promoting gear that works for you only gains you something if you own the company
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Unless the company gives you something for using/promoting thier gear.

Please note, that I have no problem with endorsements, endorseres, folks getting something for playing and promoting a brand, etc. The day comes that I get an endorsement, and I will praise that company to high heavens.

But let's not pretend that their's nothing to be gained by being an endorser of a product. Whether it's gear, swag, discounts, the exposure of being on the manufacturers website, or just the ability to put "endorsing artist" next to their signature, endorsing artists always get something.
 
#26
KJung said:
I think there are two separate issues going on. First, the endorser thing that really makes me tired on Talkbass. I find the few guys who get involved with a single company and then do a 1000 posts recommending that amp or cab to every player with every tone goal and style to be not helpful at all. That does seem to be a Talkbass thing, but thankfully it's limited to a handful of TBers, and most can easily 'read between the lines' regarding what is going on there. Of course, many other endorsers are balanced and helpful.

However, most is a bass player thing to me. If you look at the current 'state of the art' guitar amp, it's either an old Fender or something that looks like an old Fender... open back, 112, 50 watts, tube. Not a whole lot to talk about or get hyped about IMO.

Bass amplification... you've got to be kidding.... 5 pound amps and 50 pound cabinets that are twice as loud and to many of us MUCH better sounding than the 125 pound cabs and 60 pound heads we lugged around back in the day... you better believe there will be a lot of excitement and 'you can't believe this thing'.

If you take the handful of 'endorsee' type posters, or posters who have become 'friends with the manufacturer', etc. out of the mix, there really isn't that much 'artificial hype' going on here IMO. However, there is a lot of true, general excitement regarding truly unique stuff... small, light great sounding super powerful heads, new tube amp executions, lightweight great sounding cabs, internal powered DSP loaded bass amps, etc., etc., etc.

It's a VERY good time to be a bass player IMO, and TB reflects that excitement!

IMO as always.
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I think it's a good opinion....
 
#28
There was something that really cheesed me off a few months ago...I am not even an endorser of Markbass, yet I was repeatedly called a shill because I thought their stuff was great and I said so. I didn't appreciate it, and I remember every single one of you who said it, and I won't forget. :eyebrow:

Hey, here's a novel idea...some people might actually REALLY LIKE the stuff they endorse. If that's a problem for some of you, I would suggest getting over it really quickly, because I, for one, am going to continue to say Markbass is a great product, and many of the endorsers that get categorized as "shills" will, too. It ain't shilling if you believe in it, just remember that.
 
#29
I don't think anyone will forget you either JimmyM. There was more to the story and no point in rehashing it really. So we all can "not forget" and move on. No need for anyone to "get over" anything. We all have the opportunity to post as we see fit as long as it doesn't get to the point of being banned. I have no desire to cross that line.

Besides I thought I read in one of your posts that you thought the horn in a Markbass combo was horrible and disconnected it? I found that to be refreshing and credible. If someone raves on an on and on and on and insists every item offered by a particular brand is killer and way better than what I'm using it becomes very annoying and less than believable.

Point of thread though was that I don't see this on guitar forums or any other forums I visit that aren't owned by the manufacturer. It's a Talkbass thing.;););)
 
#30
I will say this...

I like the TB community feel. I'm a member over at a Christian guitar site and it has a similar feel (though not anywhere close to as busy as here). I've been to a few guitar forums and eventually I just got worn out of "Fender sux, Mesa rulz" threads or a bunch of snooty dudes that blew a stack any time you used the words "Danelectro" and "quality" in the same sentence.
 
#31
well thesteve from your post I must not be visiting the same guitar forums you have visited. I have yet to see a Fender sux post. I guess if that is the nature of most guitar forums I'm glad I haven't run across them yet.
 
#34
USAJO said:
well thesteve from your post I must not be visiting the same guitar forums you have visited. I have yet to see a Fender sux post. I guess if that is the nature of most guitar forums I'm glad I haven't run across them yet.
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I won't say it's the nature of most...I will say that there are things with the ones I've read through that eventually started to drive me nuts.
 
#35
you know I have been pondering ths all day long...well not really. If you endorse a product why does it make your opinion null and void? If I get my tone out of a piece of gear with no grief and I love it I am only allowed to say it before I sing an endorsement? Is this correct? Becaus after I sign it, I may save a few bucks buying it (ps I am still buying it). What about the people that by closeout gear and get a stupid deal, can they only love it 'till they sign a deal? Quite frankly, The people with an endorsement in their signature (which is mandated by talk bass) are some of the most gracious and helpfull here... and they tend to be the ones that don't bash other companies...they prefer what they use and endorse them because they love them. Some of them are even stupid enough to waste trime doing videos so people get a bit of an idea of what the stuff sounds like that can't hear them in person. Do I get a discount? YES I DO... Do I have to pay for it? YES I DO. Will I sing their praises in GB threads? Yes I will? Now, did I take a beating for the 6.0 reviews because I was the first working pro using using one? Yes I did. The others, non-Genz players started trying and loving them. Did I get an appology? NO. The 6.0 is that darn good and the people have decided for themselves what they like. Some didn't like it... some Genz endorsers didn't like it and opted to stay with the FET 3.0...guess what, I still talk to them. Jimmy loves his MB... I am sure he loves MB like I like my Genz. I have some great friends still endorsing Eden, we talk 3 times a week. Every one shops for a price gets a deal because they shopped for it. Maybe just maybe we should all take the time to look at the resume's of people to see if they are worthy of having a strong opinion about a piece of gear. Maybe there should just be an endorsers forum where the folks respect the credentials of the people with strong opinions. And here's something else to think about. Some endorsers who I am sure would love to say what was really on their minds are forced to behave because they do represent a company that they obviously respect. Speaking soley for myself on this one, the people that had Genz gear come in with a problem got the same service I did and the issues were resolved immediately... try that with Eden.
 
#36
I find it a very interesting topic. I think when you are an endorser of a product line it naturally makes some of us leery regardless of your tremendous abilities and resume. Continual posting about gear you "love" makes it even more questionable. Now if you once in awhile raved another amp and posted countless threads about it then it would be more comfortable for some of us. Say you are a Mesa endorser and Epifani comes out with a cab that you happen to love, when do you start posting a barrage of threads about the Epifani? Probably not often. Or not until you become an Epifani endorser.
I know you aren't implying that there is no vested interest in endorsing gear and people only endorse gear they love. Quite obviously they don't. So Tiger Woods gets on car forums and raves Buicks? Probably not. No most here aren't of such high profile that they will receive fantastic benefit from endorsing a line but there is a benefit of some sort or it wouldn't be done. Just my view.
 
#38
I am not discounting your view. Which came first the chicken or the egg? This afternoon I recomended an Eden Navigator to some one that was looking for a preamp. I endorse Lakland and have recomended Smith and Valenti basses to more than a few people. But you really seam to be hung up on peoples endorsements and their opinions are what they are. I walked away from my 4 year Eden endorsement because the company's service went to crap. I tried a lot of companies gear that I thought sucked (no I DID NOT post those reviews here because it would have been condidered bashing). Sowith that in mind, if no one had to show their endorsements in their signatures, would the opninons be more valid. My f'ing 1965 pbass is the best bass ever built and I don't have an endorsement with Fender.
You have been shooting at me since I got here. And don't act like you haven't been. When there are the threads "WHAT DO I BUY, A PEAVEY OR A TRACE", "should I get a MBII or a Carvin" I don't go in and say "You must get a Genz"... I stay away from those threads because the choices are being put out there and mine isn't one of them. I have recomended Sadowsky/D'Addario/Labella and TI strings when I endorse DR. So when it comes to knowing about what I talk about you either need a life or you are looking too hard.
With the exception of this thread or something with Genz in the title (which I started half of them) I will not post in any other threads here so you can get better representation of opinions for everyone else gear. We'll let some other answer questions and give opinions for a change.


USAJO said:
I find it a very interesting topic. I think when you are an endorser of a product line it naturally makes some of us leery regardless of your tremendous abilities and resume. Continual posting about gear you "love" makes it even more questionable. Now if you once in awhile raved another amp and posted countless threads about it then it would be more comfortable for some of us. Say you are a Mesa endorser and Epifani comes out with a cab that you happen to love, when do you start posting a barrage of threads about the Epifani? Probably not often. Or not until you become an Epifani endorser.
I know you aren't implying that there is no vested interest in endorsing gear and people only endorse gear they love. Quite obviously they don't. So Tiger Woods gets on car forums and raves Buicks? Probably not. No most here aren't of such high profile that they will receive fantastic benefit from endorsing a line but there is a benefit of some sort or it wouldn't be done. Just my view.
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#40
That was the point, Tiger was paid big bucks to promote Buick. I bet if Lexus offered him a better deal he would have gone with Lexus. Money talks. As I have mentioned I find this "Talkbass thing" to be very interesting. I don't take it all that personnel or serious but I find it to be a topic that is part of what forums have become. I also can't believe the honest person you are you can't step outside the box and notice how curious this can appear. I also respect your right to bash Eden for whatever reason you may have as well as endorse and rave about the gear you love/endorse. Just as I would have the right to comment or encourage discussion about the "endorsement and motivation" issues.
 

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