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Is this considered over-playing?
- Thread starter Pauly McCartney
- Start date
I thought it was pretty solid. Maybe a little too busy for the style at times, but I thought it fit in fairly well. I kind of liked it in the higher register as well. Good stuff.
Solid is what I strive for...Maybe not like the cables of the Golden gate bridge, but at least a good plank of wood...Or maybe a tire...Okay, at least a toothpick.
Also, the high register wasn't my personal choice, but my mic clips with large bass frequencies- so there's that. Anywho, thanks for your critique.
-Best wishes, Pauly
So, the next question is: could this have worked to a better extent with a better equalization of the bass? I only ask this due to the fact that many of Mr. Entwistle's lines usually seem as though they would be rather muddy without the immense bit of treble he used.
-Best wishes, Pauly
-Best wishes, Pauly
Imagining it as if the bass were mixed more realistically (i.e., lower in the mix), I wouldn't say it was too busy, but it was a bit loose groove-wise. I think the busyness would work fine here as long as you laid it in the pocket.
I'm curious why, if you like Bob Birch and Jamerson, you chose to do a classic country tune. Those guys don't play country, their styles are far from the typical Nashville 70's approach.
Ah. Well, I suppose I chose the song mostly due to the overlying country influence in Texas. It's not that I rather wished to do the song, however- more the fact that if I wish to be compensated for any musical work, it will most likely include country repertoire.
Perhaps I was thinking rather wishfully, when I believed I could do something other than a root and fifth pattern.
-Best wishes, Pauly
Do you, by chance, have a description of the word "groove?" It seems to have come up quite often, but no one truly differentiates between a groove and a line- unless they are the same thing? The word groove simply makes me imagine a funk band or, sometimes, a bunch of hippies in the park chatting.
-Best wishes, Pauly
Makes sense, and sometimes you can get away with more than root & 5th. There are lots of nice walking bass lines in Texas swing. And I find it much easier to sing and play bass at the same times when doing country than other things that have a more melody-like bassline, if you're inclined to do any singing.
Llisten to what's done on those classic recordings. That's the reference standard. It can seem boring and unsatisfying if you don't care for the music to begin with. But you do come to appreciate being that solid foundation that vocals and lead instruments can play off of. You just can't aspire to calling attention to yourself the way you can with a catchy funk line. It's a noble calling, though, and there are those who recognize and appreciate those selfless, solid bass lines
Well, I guess if John Entwistle can lay off for a rendition of Johnny B Goode, I suppose I can slow it down for a few country tracks...Well, he certainly made it his own anyhow.
-Best wishes, Pauly
Yeah, "groove" is one of those words that can mean multiple things. I meant "time", so I was saying your time was a bit off. When it was on, it sounded good, but it was off often enough that I noticed.
One of the things that happens is a person wants to come out of the gate a standout player without laying a foundation. I did it myself. The trouble with learning to play songs before music or your instrument is that often the basic building blocks and fundamentals never get learned.
The reason Jamerson got away with being so busy is he was a master musician, schooled in jazz. He knew how to make it all work together perfectly.
The big advantage in the internet age is you can go on You Tube and get free lessons from master players who emphasize learning fundamentals first. That's what lays the foundation for a pro, whether you are a musician, electrician or engineer.
No reason to learn by the seat of your pants anymore like many of us old timers did. Go find Scott Devine on the tube. You'll be glad you did. Best wishes on your journey.
The reason Jamerson got away with being so busy is he was a master musician, schooled in jazz. He knew how to make it all work together perfectly.
The big advantage in the internet age is you can go on You Tube and get free lessons from master players who emphasize learning fundamentals first. That's what lays the foundation for a pro, whether you are a musician, electrician or engineer.
No reason to learn by the seat of your pants anymore like many of us old timers did. Go find Scott Devine on the tube. You'll be glad you did. Best wishes on your journey.
Well, I guess if John Entwistle can lay off for a rendition of Johnny B Goode, I suppose I can slow it down for a few country tracks...Well, he certainly made it his own anyhow.
-Best wishes, Pauly
In my experience, it's actually common for classic country bands to throw in an old rock cover like Johnny B. Goode to mix things up, and that might indeed be an opportunity for you to step up and take a quick solo, and satisfy any craving for attention, so you can fade back afterwards and be that solid foundation for the rest of the night
Yes, you're overplaying, and here's why: You're playing what you perceive the bass in country music doing. I used to do that too. But listen to some country like a scientist for the bass. Don't let what you think you hear affect what you're really hearing the bass do.
The biggest thing you're overplaying are the ghost notes on the downbeats, before the I's and V's. Get rid of 'em. They're a figment of your imagination created by the interaction of the bass and drums. I bet if you listen closely, you'll hear the bass in country play a "boring" super solid 1 .. 3 .. I.e., what you're doing without the ghost notes. It's hard to get, because you want to swing. But try doing this and you'll the song get -solid-.
If all else fails, play notes only when the kick drum hits. And then add in a few leading notes in a predictable pattern. The bass guitar and the bass drum create a new virtual instrument together.
The biggest thing you're overplaying are the ghost notes on the downbeats, before the I's and V's. Get rid of 'em. They're a figment of your imagination created by the interaction of the bass and drums. I bet if you listen closely, you'll hear the bass in country play a "boring" super solid 1 .. 3 .. I.e., what you're doing without the ghost notes. It's hard to get, because you want to swing. But try doing this and you'll the song get -solid-.
If all else fails, play notes only when the kick drum hits. And then add in a few leading notes in a predictable pattern. The bass guitar and the bass drum create a new virtual instrument together.
I agree with most of what you say here. Those ghost notes are usually unnecessary, especially when the bass drum is playing the same beat, but if you listen to the Paycheck tune like a scientist, you hear that the original bassist is playing ghost notes on the entire opening chorus, but not the verse.
I actually don't think ghost notes are a big issue if the timing is perfect and they're doubling the bass drum. The real issue I hear with OP's playing is that there are too many fills and flourishes, and they often either rush or lag and don't end exactly on the beat. You can hear that he's rushing the "easy to reach" notes to give extra time to get to the "harder to reach" ones, which is something I catch myself doing sometimes, and it always sounds amateurish. Working up the chops to make sure every note of a four-eighth-note walkup is exactly on the beat is key here, and keep even those to a minimum. Again, though, the playing is not too far out of the ballpark. Tighten the timing, ditch the fills and you're golden.
To be more specific, I *think* what's happening is that you're rushing the fills slightly, so some of them end up just a little earlier than the beat. But that's based on just one quick listen.
That'd be a pretty normal mistake, just needs a little practice.
I play a bunch of country, including that one. You're over the top for Nashville rules. You get to sign the painting and you can be pretty bold about it, ONCE.
The rest of the time, you get to play the song and not the instrument. New Nashville stuff you can burn up. Traditional, not so much if, you want it to sound traditional. If there is one immutable law in that style of classic country, it is that the bass and kick are welded together. Orphan beats and orphan bass notes are RARE
Here's the real country music career killer you have going on there, you're noodling behind the vocal.
IMHO
The rest of the time, you get to play the song and not the instrument. New Nashville stuff you can burn up. Traditional, not so much if, you want it to sound traditional. If there is one immutable law in that style of classic country, it is that the bass and kick are welded together. Orphan beats and orphan bass notes are RARE
Here's the real country music career killer you have going on there, you're noodling behind the vocal.
IMHO
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It gets wilder--this is actually the original--an R&B tune, with a very non-country bass line.
Ok, that's a crazy song. It's trying to go funk, it sounds like. I think I'd back way off, and play a hip hop funk bassline, like just on the 1, 3& 4.
