JBL E-140s

[Selta]

OK, so I just pulled a speaker from my SUNN 2x15B cab.... I loaded it last year with new JBLs and couldn't remember if I put in D-140s or E-140s. Anyhoo, turns out they're E-140s. I've been using it with these, and it sounds incredible.... anyhoo, I was just curious if anyone out there has long-term expirence with these speakers?
http://www.usspeaker.com/jbl e140-1.htm
There's a link to all the data I can find on them. Like I said, they sound amazing... just curious as to how they compare to the D-140s (I had those in an Acoustic 406... but it's loooong gone) and any other info I can get on 'em. Thanks,

-Ray

 

[Passinwind]

OK, so I just pulled a speaker from my SUNN 2x15B cab.... I loaded it last year with new JBLs and couldn't remember if I put in D-140s or E-140s. Anyhoo, turns out they're E-140s. I've been using it with these, and it sounds incredible.... anyhoo, I was just curious if anyone out there has long-term experience with these speakers?
... just curious as to how they compare to the D-140s (I had those in an Acoustic 406... but it's loooong gone) and any other info I can get on 'em.

The D (edit: and K) series have alnico magnets, while the later E series are ceramic, and have a much higher power handling capacity. They all sound pretty nice, in my experience. Alnico tends to make the speaker compress earlier, with a certain characteristic sweetness for guitar. For bass, I prefer the ceramic models, FWIW.

 

[lonote]

I have a cabinet that had an E-140 in when I bought it. I found the speaker didn't have enough bottom for my taste. I was going through a cabinet buying and selling binge and replaced the E-140 with a JBL M-3 (that I scavenged from a PA cabonet) and I prefer the tone of it. My cabinet, though, is a Sonic compact cabinet and that may have something to do with it.

 

[luknfur]

FWIW:

Actually no direct experience with one but I know an engineer that stuck a 8 ohm E-140 in an old 4 ohm Polytone amp and reportedly is sounded great. I've had 15-20 (including JBL and Altec) 15's and I have yet to find one with a metal dust cover I like through what I played them through.

To my knowledge the K series were alnico mag - at least the K-145 was. I've got the specs on the K and E series and interestingly it only mentions the weight of the magnetic assembly and not the material.

 

[A9X]

To my knowledge the K series were alnico mag - at least the K-145 was. I've got the specs on the K and E series and interestingly it only mentions the weight of the magnetic assembly and not the material.

The K140's are Alnico. I've got a pair of them in my rig, at least until the new drivers arrive and I can move to smaller, more manageable boxes. They are excellent speakers for bass guitar in the right box, and are amazing in front loaded midbass horns.

 

[Funkengrooven]

The K140's are Alnico. I've got a pair of them in my rig, at least until the new drivers arrive and I can move to smaller, more manageable boxes. They are excellent speakers for bass guitar in the right box, and are amazing in front loaded midbass horns.

For my experience the Alnico speakers are tighter, more sensitive and don't have the thick fat bottom that is found on a lot of ceramics.
The Alnico's are fast and punchy and that is why I have four K-140's three of which were reconed with K-130 voice coils on 140 cones making them faster and more punchy yet.

If you want thick fat bottom play through an Eminence
See my signature...

 

[hammer2748]

I'm watching this thread closely as I have an Acoustic 406 that I aquired recently but one of the speakers (top) sounds like it's going. I've been haggling between reloading it with Eminence Kappa Pro's or JBL E-140's, not sure which yet. Leaning towards the Kappa Pro's for now. Currently, the speakers in the cab are EV's (I'm told). I'll know more about that tonight when I pull the top one to see what's up with it. Thoughts and recommendations welcome.

Cheers,
Hammer

 

[Passinwind]

To my knowledge the K series were alnico mag - at least the K-145 was. I've got the specs on the K and E series and interestingly it only mentions the weight of the magnetic assembly and not the material.

The original brochure for the K is here: Invalid Link Removed

It clearly specifies Alnico V as the magnet material. Brain fart on my part last night, grouped the K and E series rather than the D and E. Thanks to you guys for the correction.

 

[Funkengrooven]

The original brochure for the K is here: Invalid Link Removed

It clearly specifies Alnico V as the magnet material. Brain fart on my part last night, grouped the K and E series rather than the D and E. Thanks to you guys for the correction.

Ya still got a brain fart....
The D and K Series are Alnico...the E series are ceramic

 

[Passinwind]

I'm watching this thread closely as I have an Acoustic 406 that I aquired recently but one of the speakers (top) sounds like it's going. I've been haggling between reloading it with Eminence Kappa Pro's or JBL E-140's, not sure which yet. Leaning towards the Kappa Pro's for now. Currently, the speakers in the cab are EV's (I'm told). I'll know more about that tonight when I pull the top one to see what's up with it. Thoughts and recommendations welcome.

EV factory recone kits are readily available, and many of their bass drivers compare favorably (IMHO) to the other ones you're thinking about using. The EVM series woofers cost about $125 for a recone around here from a factory authorized shop.

I'm a geezer though, I'd be looking at lightweight neo drivers if I were to contemplate multiple 15 cabs at this point in my life.

 

[Passinwind]

Ya still got a brain fart....
The D and K Series are Alnico...the E series are ceramic

Yup, time for caffeine!

 

[Funkengrooven]

I'm watching this thread closely as I have an Acoustic 406 that I aquired recently but one of the speakers (top) sounds like it's going. I've been haggling between reloading it with Eminence Kappa Pro's or JBL E-140's, not sure which yet. Leaning towards the Kappa Pro's for now. Currently, the speakers in the cab are EV's (I'm told). I'll know more about that tonight when I pull the top one to see what's up with it. Thoughts and recommendations welcome.

Cheers,
Hammer

It is gonna depend on how and what you play and what you want to sound like.

For my money I'd Take the JBL's (What? You expected me to say something else ??)

Seriously, The JBL's are a very large leap above the Eminence and a definate leap above the EV's.
Although some folks put the EV's in the same category as JBL and Altec, I have not found that to be true, for me.

Load the JBL's you will never look back.

 

[A9X]

It is gonna depend on how and what you play and what you want to sound like.

For my money I'd Take the JBL's (What? You expected me to say something else ??)

Seriously, The JBL's are a very large leap above the Eminence and a definate leap above the EV's.
Although some folks put the EV's in the same category as JBL and Altec, I have not found that to be true, for me.

Load the JBL's you will never look back.

Agree with you generally re the quality between the brands. However, if that Acoustic cab is ported, and tuned for a particular set of T/S parameters, shoving in another driver with different parameters, even if it's 'better' is almost surely not going top work.

 

[Funkengrooven]

Agree with you generally re the quality between the brands. However, if that Acoustic cab is ported, and tuned for a particular set of T/S parameters, shoving in another driver with different parameters, even if it's 'better' is almost surely not going top work.

You are right, although I am not sure that Acoustic was T/S literate at that point.

I have heard JBL's in Acoustics and they seem to work well.
Your mileage may vary.

 

[Selta]

Agree with you generally re the quality between the brands. However, if that Acoustic cab is ported, and tuned for a particular set of T/S parameters, shoving in another driver with different parameters, even if it's 'better' is almost surely not going top work.

Right on... but if you can use E-140s, I definitly reccomend them. They are a serious tight'n'punchy speaker... and they still go very low. I'd sell you mine, but I've got a buddy in line for them . I think I'm stepping away from 15s and going to stick with 12s now... I see a Schroeder in my future.

-Ray

Edit: I did put a pair of D-140s in an Acoustic 406 at one point! I'm not sure how the T-S paras match up... but it was done by a guy who knew all about that, and I never had a complaint about it's sound (for the whole week I kept it afterwards). Man, at one point I had 7x15s... and I'm down to 3x15s, soon to be 1x15. Oh well... it gets old hauling tons of gear everywhere, and I'm only 19!

 

[Passinwind]

You are right, although I am not sure that Acoustic was T/S literate at that point.

I have heard JBL's in Acoustics and they seem to work well.
Your mileage may vary.

Back in the days when those cabs were new, we used to just throw whatever was handy in there, and we liked it!

EVs, Cerwin-Vegas, Gauss, and Altecs all seemed to end up in a lot of those Acoustic cabs, as welll as lots of JBLs. And if it sounds good to you, it is good, no?

 

[A9X]

Back in the days when those cabs were new, we used to just throw whatever was handy in there, and we liked it!

True, but there's a big difference between throwing an old big block Chev into a Chevelle and designing a similar sized car with a well integrated and refined modern motor and chassis that can actually get the power to the ground.

There are a number of modern drivers (BMS, Eighteensound, Precision Devices, Beyma, McCauley etc) that with properly designed boxes can go deeper, louder and cleaner than the great older drivers in a box that doesn't match them properly. Newer drivers also have nice features such as shorting rings to lower distortion.

I love old JBLs and Altecs (and EV EVM12L's) especially but their specs are all wrong to get good bass from a decent size box. Put them in something too small and they're a midrange (I have a 2220H in that role) or in an incorrectly tuned ported and they'll be a mid or a fartbox.

EVs, Cerwin-Vegas, Gauss, and Altecs all seemed to end up in a lot of those Acoustic cabs, as welll as lots of JBLs. And if it sounds good to you, it is good, no?

If it sounds good to you, then it is good.

 

[hammer2748]

Lots of great points made regarding the cabinet itself relative to tuning. It is ported in the middle all the way across, and that's it. It seems the most common reload I've heard around various forums with the most success has been (no surprise) JBL's. The EV's that are in there are a reload. Have no idea what Acoustic originally loaded those things with. And since technology has experienced numerous quantum leaps in this area, I can't imagine not ending better than I am at this point. I've got something buzzing in the upper portion of this cabinet and it definitely is coming from the speaker area and it sounds electronic but not entirely sure what it is. I've tried securing everything that could be loose and it's still there. The higher the frequency the worse it gets. In the lower freqs, I can eq it to a point where it's not as noticeable and in the mix, that nastiness pretty much washes out but I also sacrafice tone shaping. A solo situation is really the big potential for trouble at this point in time, fortunately I don't solo much in my current situation. Thanks for the input, open for more.

Cheers,
Hammer

 

[Passinwind]

I love old JBLs and Altecs (and EV EVM12L's) especially but their specs are all wrong to get good bass from a decent size box. Put them in something too small and they're a midrange (I have a 2220H in that role) or in an incorrectly tuned ported and they'll be a mid or a fartbox.

Amen to that! Altec factory boxes were big for a good reason. One other problem with mismatched cabs and drivers: it can easily lead to blown drivers. So you might not come out ahead on a swap, long-term.

Personally, I've kicked the old driver habit. Besides the fine newer drivers you mentioned, I prefer B&C, Selenium and (gasp!) many of the proprietary Eminence drivers in well engineered small light boxes to any of that scary dinosaur stuff I used for 25+ years. No disrespect to those who love that stuff either, I truly envy those of you with good backs and vintage gear that you love.

 

[LoveThatBass]

I have a cabinet that had an E-140 in when I bought it. I found the speaker didn't have enough bottom for my taste.

I put one in an avatar cab and found it did not have the low end needed until I built a 45 degree baffle just below and behind the speaker that allowed only 3 x 24 inches of vent area between it and the back. This idea came from a Sunn cab. It cut the internal size of the cab down and now sounds really good with very good low end for a 4 string bass. May not be enough for a 5 string with low B though.