jumping to active 5 strings... multi scale or normal?

[brucehum]

So I play in a hard rock / metal band. I play passive 4 strings. I have a few basses, but the two 'jewels' are my Fender P Bass Deluxe Special (my first bass) and my Rickenbacker 4003, the one I play live (but we haven't played live since before COVID. COVID killed the band, then we came back, but too many drummer changes has meant no live so far, so...).

For practice at home, I alternate between them. For band practice, due to age and a bad back, I mostly use a Spirit XT-2 Headless due to the low weight.

Now we are practicing at our lead guitar's studio, and recording some stuff. I record with his bass. We noticed my style is a bit too aggressive (to use a kind word) and often in the recording we could hear a tac-tac-tac. So last day I tried with his nice active Ibanez ATK, and the pre-amp seems to be eating the tac-tac that sometimes could be heard with passive bass, so it is great!

Which made me think: maybe I should get an active bass. And as I am at that, a 5 strings active bass. One of the reasons would be to play from position 5, avoiding open strings, as if it was 4 stringer with more notes in the same position. And that I can go down from E.

Looking at basses, I found two nice headless ones for decent prices: The Cort Artisan Space 5 and the Sire Marcus Miller M6 5. I'm liking the Marcus Miller... but the multiscale will need adaptation time... AND... I also will keep playing the 4 stringers, of course. So, how easy/difficult is to adapt to multiscale fanned and back?

And any recommendations along those two and similar prices (not still completely set on headless, but the smaller weight and the not hitting things with the machine head is also positive).

 

[Father Gino]

I’ve unsuccessfully tried to transition to 5 string basses 3 times over the course of 45 years. I was unsuccessful because I’m an impatient, lazy, old pos. I could never get the low B string to sound good to me so playing say low E on the B string didn’t pan out. I’m sure it’s my problem technique wise as many people do just fine. I’ve given up on the 5 string idea at this point.
The last 5 string I tried was a Dingwall. I thought maybe the longer B string would help. I didn’t. The guy who bought it from me sounded spectacular on it. The fanned fret idea was fairly easy to adjust to. I mostly played from the 5th to the 12th fret where the fanning is pretty unnoticeable. The lowest 5 notes are a little weird and it’s a long stretch to that low C, but I never went down there as often as I played the 5th fret or above. The fanning gets more extreme at the higher frets also, but of course they’re closer together up there. Some people complain about playing chords with fanned frets, but Gino don’t play that game anyway.

 

[Melt in the Sun]

I was in your boat a few months ago (one passive 4-string for 20ish years) and bought an Ibanez EHB 5-stringer. Adapting to multiscale = no big deal. Adapting to 5 strings = much tougher, still in progress.

coming from only passive, I find the active preamp tough to wrap my head around, and I'm planning to simplify it. A mid sweep is complicated, and I have learned I hate stacked knobs. I'll probably simplify this. YMMV!

 

[mikezimmerman]

You might also look at the Ibanez EHB series, which is pretty popular and available in both fanned-fret and "parallel" versions. I think the lowest models are more or less in the process of range that you're looking at.

 

[silky smoove]

For me the change from 4 to 5 is far more of an adjustment than going from a single scale to a multi scale, which by comparison is effectively not even noticeable.

 

[Lionel Albert]

My first bass was an active, I wanted a passive and tried a 5 string one.
Everything passive, the B string can sound good but not lower than D.
I switched to double bass and bought a preamp.
I tried it with my 5 string bass for two pop-rock gigs (their bassist was playing in another band), the preamp has got a low cut : the bass sounded good even on open B.
Electronics can do everything.

 

[ctmullins]

So I play in a hard rock / metal band. I play passive 4 strings. I have a few basses, but the two 'jewels' are my Fender P Bass Deluxe Special (my first bass) and my Rickenbacker 4003, the one I play live (but we haven't played live since before COVID. COVID killed the band, then we came back, but too many drummer changes has meant no live so far, so...).

For practice at home, I alternate between them. For band practice, due to age and a bad back, I mostly use a Spirit XT-2 Headless due to the low weight.

Now we are practicing at our lead guitar's studio, and recording some stuff. I record with his bass. We noticed my style is a bit too aggressive (to use a kind word) and often in the recording we could hear a tac-tac-tac. So last day I tried with his nice active Ibanez ATK, and the pre-amp seems to be eating the tac-tac that sometimes could be heard with passive bass, so it is great!

Which made me think: maybe I should get an active bass. And as I am at that, a 5 strings active bass. One of the reasons would be to play from position 5, avoiding open strings, as if it was 4 stringer with more notes in the same position. And that I can go down from E.

Looking at basses, I found two nice headless ones for decent prices: The Cort Artisan Space 5 and the Sire Marcus Miller M6 5. I'm liking the Marcus Miller... but the multiscale will need adaptation time... AND... I also will keep playing the 4 stringers, of course. So, how easy/difficult is to adapt to multiscale fanned and back?

And any recommendations along those two and similar prices (not still completely set on headless, but the smaller weight and the not hitting things with the machine head is also positive).

You're leaping to conclusions.

There is something else about that bass that is "eating the tac-tac". It's not the fact that it's active.

 

[silky smoove]

There is something else about that bass that is "eating the tac-tac". It's not the fact that it's active.

I had the same thought. My following thought was "why not work on cleaning up your technique?"

 

[Wasnex]

IMHO the key to success in transitioning from 4 to 5 is to play the 5 exclusively.

AFAIK in regards to multi-scale: There are pros and cons. I demoed Dingwalls at a couple of international music industry trade shows. IMHO the longer scale definitely improves the quality of the B string. I found it easy to play the bass at first. But after 20 minutes are so, I started noticing that playability varies a bit as my fretting hand moved up and down the neck. This was a show stopper for me, but it may not bother you in the least. Good idea to find a mult-scale bass and find out for yourself.

 

[gepettus]

I had the same thought. My following thought was "why not work on cleaning up your technique?"

I think the same. It's not a gear issue, is a technique thing imo. And maybe EQ.

 

[BassicJazzy]

I struggled with the decision whether to go 5 string after playing 4 strings my whole life, or to try fretless 4 string. I chose fretless and I am glad I did. I can still play my fretted 4 strings just fine, after picking up fretless, but if I had chosen 5 string, not so sure that would have been the case. Would be a whole different way of looking at fretboard, different shifts, etc. Or you could just ignore the B string, and have a very wide neck 4 string bass?

I think I'd try multi-scale first, if I was to try something new now. I started non a Rick 4001 and had to reach to the next zip code to get to the nut on that thing, so long scale is no problem for me.

 

[TheSpinDoctor]

I played a 1974 Jazz bass for years, then took a 20 year hiatus. Started playing for my church, so I bought a Schecter Stiletto Studio-5. Put flat wounds on it as I was more looking for an organ pedal sound with the option to add more mids and highs as needed. The 35" scale ensured that the B string was tight. The active pre-amp made finding a suitable tone easy. The bass is great for its neutral tone quality.
About 6 years ago, I decided to play in a rock band again. The Schecter did not allow me to play fast riffs or chords. The frets are too far apart and the strings too close together. I bought a Gibson Thunderbird for the tone. Switching from a 4 string to a 5 string created problems with finding the correct string on the Schecter. My solution was to tune the Gibson to BEAD. Its 34" scale still allows for a tight B string. The the output is greater than the Schecter, for an over driven sound when desired. The neck plays faster as well.
Depending upon what sound you are seeking, a 5 string may be great. If you will play much slap bass, then you may want wider string spacing than common on 5 string basses.

 

[BrianVengeance]

Have switched over from being a passive 4 string player to using an active 5 string multi scale (Spector Dimension HP) in the past year for my current project. The transition wasn’t anywhere near as difficult as you might expect, but there was definitely an adjustment period and some technique adjustment / development needed. All in all I’d say that it has had a positive improvement on my playing.

I’m confident they would have gotten similar improvements without it given my current project, but it definitely forced the issue on some weaknesses that I might have not otherwise directly and intentionally addressed.

Going back and forth between single and multi scale is easy, but a 34” feels more like how playing a short scale used to feel and guitars feel like ukuleles now.

 

[Fuzzbass]

Looking at basses, I found two nice headless ones for decent prices: The Cort Artisan Space 5 and the Sire Marcus Miller M6 5. I'm liking the Marcus Miller... but the multiscale will need adaptation time... AND... I also will keep playing the 4 stringers, of course. So, how easy/difficult is to adapt to multiscale fanned and back?

After four-stringing for over two decades, it took 3 months for me to be gig-ready on 5-string. Note: fortunately for me, I joined a new band at the time I was making the transition. I say fortunately because it was much easier for me to learn new songs on 5, because I was mapping them out fresh in my head. By comparison it was far more difficult to wrap my mind around songs I'd played for years on four: doable, but a struggle.

What also worked for me: putting my four string aside and immersing myself completely in five. I'm not saying this is the correct thing to do overall, but it was correct for me.

Eventually I came to like 5 string so much that I've been playing it exclusively for over two decades. Don't recommend this to anyone else; just saying it was my decision.

 

[Fuzzbass]

So, how easy/difficult is to adapt to multiscale fanned and back?

I mentioned my transition from 4 to 5 just above. As for multiscale: I love the idea, in theory. However: I used to be a regular at a bass-only gear store not too far from me. They kept Dingwalls in stock, so I played them on a number of occasions. Surprisingly to me, I had very little trouble playing at the far end of the neck. It was a bit of an arm stretch, and also a finger stretch for my medium-sized hands, but I felt that I could adapt over time. What put me off: playing in the upper register. All my box patterns turned into diamonds... and of course all the other scales were skewed as well (in my brain). I rarely play solos, but do have to navigate the upper register at times. So, I decided not to pursue Dingwall, not even the Nolly bass which I think is pretty awesome otherwise.

Don't ask me why the low register was OK but not the upper. Something particular to my brain, I'm sure.

Note 1: if I immersed myself in multiscale, then I could probably adapt to the entire fretboard. But while Dingwalls sound great, I also feel the same about my Sadowsky, Zon, and other 34" parallel fret basses, even low B. To me, the Dingwall multiscale tone is different, not better. Same with parallel 35" scale.

Note 2: a friend pointed me to fanned-fret basses by other manufacturers that are not so radical as Dingwall: lots of offset down low, but much less in the upper register. But even so: I'm thrilled with my current collection of basses, so I'll stick with parallel frets.

Last but not least: I'm not trying to sway anyone from Dingwall: quality and innovation are outstanding. Just explaining why I never became a customer.

 

[silky smoove]

Note 2: a friend pointed me to fanned-fret basses by other manufacturers that are not so radical as Dingwall: lots of offset down low, but much less in the upper register. But even so: I'm thrilled with my current collection of basses, so I'll stick with parallel frets.

It's worth noting that Dingwall also makes medium scale basses (32"-35" for 5-string, 32"-34.25" for 4-string, both with the parallel fret around the 7th) with a smaller degree of fanning than their 37" models.

 

[crazycloud]

Going from 4 to 5 is not difficult. As was mentioned above you need to put the 4s away and play nothing but the 5 until it's second nature, like your 4s are now. Also from the start, play the 5 as a 5, not a 4 with a .130 thumbrest. By that I mean any song you already know on a 4 that needs nothing lower than E, use the B string rather than open strings so you learn to use the B, play in 5th position and adapt to playing across the neck rather than along it so much.

Slapping isn't hard on a 5 even with narrower spacing like my basses with 16.5mm, you just need to actually put time and effort into adapting. After having read many comments on various forums about how hard it was to adapt to 5 and they gave up, I really wonder how much effort some put into the transition. Before the Karens start in, you can do it if you really want to. Just remember a 4 banger wasn't easy at the start and now you also have to unlearn some habits, but that,s not a bad thing and you might find it liberating and improves your playing in ways you hadn't considered.

As for MS, my first MS will get here in a week roughly, so I'll see how difficult that is to adapt to. It's a 6, but I won't be doing a lot of chordal work high on it as I have another parallel fret 6 for that.

 

[Fuzzbass]

It's worth noting that Dingwall also makes medium scale basses (32"-35" for 5-string, 32"-34.25" for 4-string, both with the parallel fret around the 7th) with a smaller degree of fanning than their 37" models.

Excellent point. I believe those are the vintage models, P and J-style? Regardless, the Nolly bass was highest on my GAS list.

 

[MechaSparky]

So I play in a hard rock / metal band. I play passive 4 strings. I have a few basses, but the two 'jewels' are my Fender P Bass Deluxe Special (my first bass) and my Rickenbacker 4003, the one I play live (but we haven't played live since before COVID. COVID killed the band, then we came back, but too many drummer changes has meant no live so far, so...).

For practice at home, I alternate between them. For band practice, due to age and a bad back, I mostly use a Spirit XT-2 Headless due to the low weight.

Now we are practicing at our lead guitar's studio, and recording some stuff. I record with his bass. We noticed my style is a bit too aggressive (to use a kind word) and often in the recording we could hear a tac-tac-tac. So last day I tried with his nice active Ibanez ATK, and the pre-amp seems to be eating the tac-tac that sometimes could be heard with passive bass, so it is great!

Which made me think: maybe I should get an active bass. And as I am at that, a 5 strings active bass. One of the reasons would be to play from position 5, avoiding open strings, as if it was 4 stringer with more notes in the same position. And that I can go down from E.

Looking at basses, I found two nice headless ones for decent prices: The Cort Artisan Space 5 and the Sire Marcus Miller M6 5. I'm liking the Marcus Miller... but the multiscale will need adaptation time... AND... I also will keep playing the 4 stringers, of course. So, how easy/difficult is to adapt to multiscale fanned and back?

And any recommendations along those two and similar prices (not still completely set on headless, but the smaller weight and the not hitting things with the machine head is also positive).

I love my Sire 5 string jazz but it feels like playing a park bench compared to a 4-string neck. You have been warned.

 

[BioDriver]

Token “try both and decide” reply.