Kala UBass Megathread, Part 7

[Mimmo]

Maybe I'm not clear on flat spirals. How smooth are they compared to the Kala/Galli flatwound (not the black ones)? I ask because I hear the round wound zing when the player slides on your strings. I don't want to sound critical, but I don't like that zing sound at all, even when I played guitar for almost 50 years, I used flatwound strings.

Let me add that I think Mimmo and Aquila are very reputable and conscientious, I have a lot of respect. He's been very generous with me. I also had a ShortBassOne that I bought directly from Aquila and it does sound really good, fashioned after the Ovation guitar, but with nerve damage to my neck from radiation treatments for cancer, I had to give it up.

Do not worry to ask: it is you right. What you have heard in the video is the very first prototype made by me. The copper wire is flat right before to be wrapped upon the core but when the string is finished it is necessary to employ sandpapers of different grains: Well, I have not done the best with the surfaces of the strings so they still are just a little not perfectly smooth. But this happens in this sample; the strings addressed to the market will be smoother, exactly like happens on our double bass strings.

There however is one thing to say: it is impossible to obtain exactly the smoothness of a flat wound steel or nickel string; this because the rule: 'harder the metal smoother the surface'. same happens with an harder and a softer wood....but, for sure the use of the Sugar bioplastic and copper assure the very best performance ever.

In fact in the video there is the cheapest chinese ukulele (180 US dollars) that produce a loud sound without amp: maybe this open the door to instruments that works without amp?
Thinks about music education in the classrooms...
Mimmo

 

[HaphAsSard]

Do not worry to ask: it is you right. What you have heard in the video is the very first prototype made by me. The copper wire is flat right before to be wrapped upon the core but when the string is finished it is necessary to employ sandpapers of different grains: Well, I have not done the best with the surfaces of the strings so they still are just a little not perfectly smooth. But this happens in this sample; the strings addressed to the market will be smoother, exactly like happens on our double bass strings.

There however is one thing to say: it is impossible to obtain exactly the smoothness of a flat wound steel or nickel string; this because the rule: 'harder the metal smoother the surface'. same happens with an harder and a softer wood....but, for sure the use of the Sugar bioplastic and copper assure the very best performance ever.

In fact in the video there is the cheapest chinese ukulele (180 US dollars) that produce a loud sound without amp: maybe this open the door to instruments that works without amp?
Thinks about music education in the classrooms...
Mimmo

Will the completed string receive some sort of treatment against corrosion? My hands produce very acidic sweat, and copper and brass strings turn green on me in a few hours of playing.
(Maybe the product is just not for me. That's fine - you make a number of others.)

 

[Mimmo]

Will the completed string receive some sort of treatment against corrosion? My hands produce very acidic sweat, and copper and brass strings turn green on me in a few hours of playing.
(Maybe the product is just not for me. That's fine - you make a number of others.)

I have not taken in consideration this point. maybe these strings are not for you. For sure I do not like to employ steel or nickel for the consideration I have already done (considering that both produce allergy on some players...). However on the doublebass no hone after one year complaint about this problem.

 

[Mimmo]

'Flat Spirals' first professional test:

 

[John Stephen]

And speaking of batteries, there was a post from @KohanMike a few pages ago, saying there are some passive uke basses out there (Mike, sorry if I'm misquoting you). I have been searching for a passive electric uke bass but have been unable to find one (I've done the usual online searches and have come up empty). Anyone know of any? Thanks in advance.

 

[KohanMike]

And speaking of batteries, there was a post from @KohanMike a few pages ago, saying there are some passive uke basses out there (Mike, sorry if I'm misquoting you). I have been searching for a passive electric uke bass but have been unable to find one (I've done the usual online searches and have come up empty). Anyone know of any? Thanks in advance.

Actually, I was talking about passive electric guitars I converted to a mini bass. I think early Kala U-Bass didn't have a preamp, only a pickup, but I don't know if those had some kind of battery. I think piezo pickups have to have a power source.

I did have one of my Hadean 24" scale solid body bass ukes modified to passive by Eric's Guitar, removing the entire piezo system and replacing it with 3 passive magnetic pickups, it was also necessary to replace the Kala/Galli flatwound nylon core strings with all metal flatwounds. Shortly after I sold it because I'm now only playing 21" scale.

 

[John Stephen]

OK Mike, thanks for the info. I appreciate the quick reply. I will continue my search, and ultimately I may have to go the conversion route as you did. I have a guitar tech nearby, in a shop that sells lots of ukes, so he might be able to do it.

 

[HaphAsSard]

I think early Kala U-Bass didn't have a preamp, only a pickup, but I don't know if those had some kind of battery. I think piezo pickups have to have a power source.

[^ Emphasis added.] The signal needs to be eventually stepped up at some downstream point, of course, but that is what the preamp stage, onboard or external, is there for (besides EQ). IOW, if the early U-Basses didn't have a preamp, they had no battery either.

I did have one of my Hadean 24" scale solid body bass ukes modified to passive by Eric's Guitar, removing the entire piezo system and replacing it with 3 passive magnetic pickups, it was also necessary to replace the Kala/Galli flatwound nylon core strings with all metal flatwounds.

Since the highlighted sentence can be read in two ways, I'll clarify for others:
the replacement of piezo with magnetic pickups determined the need to replace nylon-core with steel-core strings, not the other way around. Mike could have used the all-metal flats with the original piezo no problem, had he chosen to do so: piezoelectric pickups sense pressure (the "piezo-" part of the name means that in Greek), so they work with any type of string, including metal, nylon, silicone, you name it.

 

[mrperkolator]

Since the highlighted sentence can be read in two ways, I'll clarify for others:
the replacement of piezo with magnetic pickups determined the need to replace nylon-core with steel-core strings, not the other way around. Mike could have used the all-metal flats with the original piezo no problem, had he chosen to do so: piezoelectric pickups sense pressure (the "piezo-" part of the name means that in Greek), so they work with any type of string, including metal, nylon, silicone, you name it.

Nylon core isn't a problem if the winding around the core is magnetic. Turns out chrome steel may or may not be magnetic depending on composition of steel. I'm only mentioning this because Galli Strings (maker of Kala's flatwounds) also makes a "synthesis flat" which is nylon core with chrome steel flat windings. I've not tried these strings, but it interests me. I'm guessing the composition of their steel flat windings are in fact magnetic, and work with magnetic pickups. Of course the nylon core does not work with magnetic pickups.

So if you do manage to make a magnetic passive uke bass... you still may be able to use those metal strings kala sells. Try them before chucking them.

 

[HaphAsSard]

Nylon core isn't a problem if the winding around the core is magnetic. Turns out chrome steel may or may not be magnetic depending on composition of steel. I'm only mentioning this because Galli Strings (maker of Kala's flatwounds) also makes a "synthesis flat" which is nylon core with chrome steel flat windings. I've not tried these strings, but it interests me. I'm guessing the composition of their steel flat windings are in fact magnetic, and work with magnetic pickups. Of course the nylon core does not work with magnetic pickups.

So if you do manage to make a magnetic passive uke bass... you still may be able to use those metal strings kala sells. Try them before chucking them.

I am well aware of both the Galli long-scale Synthesis flats (I was the first to mention them on these boards, exactly a year ago) and the fact that, as reported by @KohanMike, the UXB910C/KA-BASS-4FW nyloncore uke-bass flats, also made by Galli, can be used with magnetic pickups. I was actually excited by his discovery, and I spammed about it all over the forum.
[The relevant factor appears to be the *quantity* of metal per linear inch: these strings - both the long-scale and the uke-bass versions - are likely to have not only a magnetically-active outer ribbon winding, but also one or two intermediate steel layers.]
However, Mike also reported that their output is somewhat inadequate, which was the reason, or one of the reasons, for his replacing them with Pyramid custom-length steel-core, chrome-nickel flats.

The point I was trying to make, in case a reader misconstrues his post above as meaning you have to have magnetic pickups if you choose steel-core strings, is that this is not the case: piezos work with whatever; it's mag pickups that are, well, picky, so if your instrument is mag-only, the strings you put on have to have some sort of magnetically-active mass.

 

[mrperkolator]

I am well aware of both the Galli long-scale Synthesis flats (I was the first to mention them on these boards, exactly a year ago) and the fact that, as reported by @KohanMike, the UXB910C/KA-BASS-4FW nyloncore uke-bass flats, also made by Galli, can be used with magnetic pickups. I was actually excited by his discovery, and I spammed about it all over the forum.
[The relevant factor appears to be the *quantity* of metal per linear inch: these strings - both the long-scale and the uke-bass versions - are likely to have not only a magnetically-active outer ribbon winding, but also one or two intermediate steel layers.]
However, Mike also reported that their output is somewhat inadequate, which was the reason, or one of the reasons, for his replacing them with Pyramid custom-length steel-core, chrome-nickel flats.

The point I was trying to make, in case a reader misconstrues his post above as meaning you have to have magnetic pickups if you choose steel-core strings, is that this is not the case: piezos work with whatever; it's mag pickups that are, well, picky, so if your instrument is mag-only, the strings you put on have to have some sort of magnetically-active mass.

Reduced output does make sense with less magnetic mass. I'm certain we're on the same page. I was pointing out the core is not the only important part of the string. Based on your comments on reduced output, I'd wager that putting nylon core strings on a hotter magnetic pickup would be advantageous, but putting same string on say a Bartolini that's already under epoxy and a plastic cover would make the output very low (may still sound good tho...).

Needless to say, the lower magnetic mass above your pickup does matter. We're in agreement. We're just talking about slightly different aspects.

hopefully we haven't chased anyone off with overanalysis of bass uke strings....

 

[KohanMike]

I did try the flatwound nylon core and they did work, but the volume was definitely compromised, so I went with all steel. Felt there was no reason to compromise. Now I only play piezo bass ukes, specifically to use only one type of string.

 

[J Posega]

Just took delivery of my first uke bass in many years, a Hadean 23" scale. I had a Kala way back when they didn't have preamps.

It's been several years since I sold most of my gear for a big move, so I can't compare directly to a shorter uke bass, but the 23" scale definitely ups the string tension, improves note clarity and intonation pretty substantially. It also seems louder than I recall my old U-bass being.

The bass has black Thundergut strings on it, but I'm curious to jump back into the U-bass world and try out some other strings now that there are so many options out there.

Any good sources for thumb rests or finger ramps? My thumb and fingers miss having pickups for anchor points.

As for the Hadean U-bass itself, the quality is pretty good, especially for under $200 shipped.
+ It's a very attractive zebrawood throughout the body and veneered headstock, and I think mahogany for the neck.
+ The satin finish suits the wood choice and is well applied save for a slightly rough patch by the neck heel on the body which I wouldn't ever feel without actively inspecting the instrument
+ The tuner built into the preamp works well
+ Fretwork and intonation are good (enough for a floppy rubber string bass)

- The tuners are kind of coarse/gritty feeling so I'll be applying some graphite lubricant
- The button to turn the tuner on is tiny.
- The serial number on the back of the headstock is black text on white label from a handheld label maker
- Logo on headstock is a goofy looking font
- Fret ends are a little prickly
- Screws on backplate are a little prickly, too (like the heads got just a little bit stripped)

// Side dots are shifted slightly towards the headstock rather than being centered between frets but they mark the right frets so it doesn't matter to me
// No comment on the electronics and amped tone since I haven't plugged it in yet

For the price, none of negatives (-) are deal breakers. It'll mostly live at my desk so I can thump around on it during the workday.

Fat cat for scale (she approves):

 

[John Stephen]

That is purty! Enjoy it.

 

[J Posega]

Anyone on here using the Thunderbrown or new formula Thunderblack/Thunderred strings? These slick old-formula Thunderblack strings sound good, but the Brown ones interest me for being higher tension, lighter gauge, and textured.

 

[zardeefonder]

Anyone on here using the Thunderbrown or new formula Thunderblack/Thunderred strings? These slick old-formula Thunderblack strings sound good, but the Brown ones interest me for being higher tension, lighter gauge, and textured.

I have the old Thunderreds and Thunderbrowns. The Thunderbrowns are better than the Reds and vastly superior to the original plain Thunderguts. They have more sustain than the Reds and yet
are closer to an upright sound.

If you check YouTube Magnus has done a review.

 

[Bodeeni]

I have not tried the Galli/Kala flatwounds.

I have a couple of HB Uke basses. I am using the Galli flatwounds on the fretted Uke. They are very good. They do sound and feel like a regular flatwound full scale string but the are very stable and consistent. I will use this setup as a backup to my full scale bass at live gigs. I will see how it goes when my live season starts in a few months. I still have the Aquila Thunderguts on the fretless and will keep that setup for the classic U sound.

 

[JesseMalaska]

Just bought a set of Aguila Thunderbrowns to my fretless Ubass because I was wanting more tension on the string and I want to keep using these "rubber" strings. I had a set of Thunder reds on my bass for years. BUT after I installed the strings D and G -strings were buzzing on the low end of the fretboard and on open strings. I loosened the truss rod and it didnt help at all. E and A -strings were ok and I didnt have this problem with my reds! After trying to rise the nut and bridge with shims it didnt help either... I put red D and G -strings back and the buzzing went away... So now I have brown E+A and red D+G... Its actually quite good combination but that buzzing was really weird. Anyone else had this kind of problems?

 

[JesseMalaska]

I just also realized that my Ubass is 8 years old this month!

 

[KohanMike]

Just bought a set of Aguila Thunderbrowns to my fretless Ubass because I was wanting more tension on the string and I want to keep using these "rubber" strings. I had a set of Thunder reds on my bass for years. BUT after I installed the strings D and G -strings were buzzing on the low end of the fretboard and on open strings. I loosened the truss rod and it didnt help at all. E and A -strings were ok and I didnt have this problem with my reds! After trying to rise the nut and bridge with shims it didnt help either... I put red D and G -strings back and the buzzing went away... So now I have brown E+A and red D+G... Its actually quite good combination but that buzzing was really weird. Anyone else had this kind of problems?

Yes, I had the same problem with the new browns I tried. One of the final reasons why I decided to give up on poly strings and use only flatwound. Waiting to try the new flats Mimmo has shown.