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Lead Guitarest not long for this World!!

Discussion in 'Band Management [BG]' started by Peter S, Dec 11, 2011.


  1. Peter S

    Peter S

    Nov 27, 2008
    Northern Ireland
    Has anyone had this problem? I come from Ireland and one of the bands I play for does its own songs which are best described as soft rock. Fairly melodic stuff.

    The Lead Guitarist is a nice guy but he:

    1/ Copies my fills all the time. I take a lot of time trying to come up with melodic and different fills since I can't sing and I want to contribute but of course I don't neglect the groove or the roots. It's the fills where my creativity comes in.

    2/ When he is not doing that he is playing in the bass register on the EAD strings in a Dwyane Eddy style. When he does this he drowns me out completely especially as I prefer flatwounds and a mellow tone.

    I have mentioned it to the guy a couple of time and he pretends to comprehend but it's really getting my goat now. I know I could at least get the neck of his Strat up his ar** but does he deserve it?.

    Pete
     
  2. Lee H

    Lee H

    Nov 30, 2011
    Redding CA
    would you like to borrow wire cutters? Clip the E,A and D strings, and let him play with the other three for a while:p
     
  3. 1) Is there any way to come up with fills he can't possibly copy? Just to teach him a lesson in self-reliance... Once it's ingrained into his brain, hopefully you should be able to play your typical fills without him mimicking them...

    2) There should be nothing wrong with playing deep notes Duane Eddy-style, it sounds like he needs to turn down the lows on his amp.
     
  4. odin70

    odin70

    Dec 26, 2007
    Its your gig. But personally i would just concentrate on the "bass playing" and let the lead guitarist do the fills/leads. It can be very annoying when a bass player tries to compete with the guitarist. Thats how i see it.
     
  5. Dave W

    Dave W

    Mar 1, 2007
    White Plains
    Have you tried EQing around him to be heard a little better?

    I don't see a problem with how he is playing, maybe he's too loud?
     
  6. CS

    CS

    Dec 11, 1999
    UK
    You are supposed to be working together, he shouldn't be in your register and you shouldn't be taking up all the available space...IMHO of course.
     
  7. Nev375

    Nev375

    Nov 2, 2010
    Missouri
    Stop looking at the things he does as annoyances and start looking at the positives.

    He copies your leads? Cool! Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Now you have an opportunity to write the guitar fills as well as your own. When he is learning a song, just play the guitar fill you wrote for it, then when he has that down, come in with the accompanying bass fill you've been holding back that contains harmonizing notes, counter-rhythms or whatever you have to go with it.

    He plays in the bass register. Well, you can either go up high on the neck when he goes low, or you can switch to roundwounds and go for a more "cutting-through" tone that works with his style.

    Or.... you can get rid of him, but frankly that seems like the easy way out and kind of a waste. A true artist does not require a blank canvas, but can use whatever is in his environment as his medium.
     
  8. ChrisB2

    ChrisB2 Bass... in your fass

    Feb 27, 2008
    TalkBass > Off Topic
    +1

    As to him drowning you out, turn up and/or get a louder amp.
     
  9. Marko 1

    Marko 1

    Mar 9, 2009
    N.E. Ohio
    Guitar/bass/drums, I get to be pretty busy and creative, and I regularly hear the guitar building onto the dynamics I’ve created...

    but my bass lines are bass lines, not something a gui**** would even want to do.
     
  10. eban3

    eban3 Supporting Member

    Apr 29, 2007
    Palm Bay FL
    ive had this problem several times before ........pissed me off so I showed up at a rehearsal with a 12 string bass and walked all over his playingfor a few hours ,Tell him to quit guitar and take up bass ......or just ignore it if its a paying gig
     
  11. Peter S

    Peter S

    Nov 27, 2008
    Northern Ireland
    I like the idea of giving him the obvious fills and when he is into that provide what I have worked on myself. I am not sure I understand Odin. Are you suggesting I just stick to playing the root? it's the bits that link the roots the bass can play and what this man is stealing. He needs to get his ass up the fret board or play chords. Thanks Guys
     
  12. OtterOnBass

    OtterOnBass

    Oct 5, 2007
    Michigan
    I've noticed on recordings that the bass player will often fill in the middle of a measure, instead of at the end, giving the drums and guitar a spot.
     
  13. James Judson

    James Judson

    Jul 16, 2009
    This guy sounds like me. While I lay down the groove I lay down bass licks that mimic guitar, sax, keyboard. Sounds great but I'm mindful not to step on his space. Am I stealing his lines???

    And where did you steal the lines that your guitar player stoled from you??? Remember your a team so you might try spoon feeding this guy some lines to play while you augment what he is playing.
     
  14. When he starts playing your line, start improvising so your part is more interesting.
     
  15. jefkritz

    jefkritz

    Oct 20, 2007
    iowa city, IA
    to the OP - from your last post, it sounds less like he's playing your fills, and more like he's just playing your entire bassline, but on guitar. is that what you mean?

    if that's the case, i would probably be annoyed too. although, i really like it in reggae when the guitar matches the bass. similarly with 'tic-tac' bass in country, and rage against the machine et al. i think eq'ing will be even more important than it always is here, but it could work.

    if it's not the case i agree that this isn't necessarily a bad thing, and to use it to your benefit.
     
  16. calebbarton

    calebbarton

    Aug 25, 2007
    Oregon
    I manufacture for several companies including but not limited to: Bridge City Sound, Catalinbread, more.
    The problem is that when you bring up an issue like that here, you are going to get different opinions and guys telling you "you should be doing it my way cause I've been doing it that way for 100 years". Thats all fine and great but remember, while their way works for them, it may not work for you.

    If you brought it up to your guitarist and he has not responded favorably, try an alternate means of communication than the way you have already tried. If you asked him nicely in private not to steal your lines, ask him nicely in public. Just dont be a dick. That will give him every excuse to continue just to spite you.

    You essentially need to do what is good for the band and what sounds good with everyone, not just what sounds good to you. If you have to change strings and re-EQ just to stick out a little, do it. What you want is valid but you are in a band, not a solo act.
     
  17. Peter S

    Peter S

    Nov 27, 2008
    Northern Ireland
    Exactly!!!. This lead guitarist is playing bass lines. I am not playing stuff below the 7th fret most of the time. Sometimes I would go to 9th but in the main I prefer my bass runs to be where they should be if you have two guitars, which we have, = Way down. I always go down if I can rather than up. I want the rumble not the twang.
     
  18. Baron Von Vik

    Baron Von Vik

    Jun 11, 2010
    Somewhere in Arizona
    Mojo FunkBasses
    EQ his amp to "Guitar" settings.

    Nothing's more irritating than competing with a rumbly guitarist, especially if he's creating dissonance.

    He may not know he's copying you. He may not even hear how bad things are sounding. I played with a rhythm guitarist who couldn't tell the open E from the open A unless he looked at the strings. He used to make me think I was hitting massive clams if I was standing near his amp. Threw off my groove, man.

    So sit down with him and work with his tone. You may even like the sync'ed sound after you get him in the correct register.
     
  19. rllefebv

    rllefebv

    Oct 17, 2000
    Newberg, Oregon
    This works well, but be prepared for things to creep back after a while... You will probably have to revisit/re-apply this approach with every guitar player you will work with... I call this syndrome, 'Bedroom Settings Syndrome'... What sounds good at home, alone with the CD player, rarely works well with the band... (by the way, BSS can happen to bassists as well... I know that I've been guilty from time to time!)

    -robert
     
  20. Peter S

    Peter S

    Nov 27, 2008
    Northern Ireland
    Now that's a good thought because that is exactly the outcome.

    So in summary I write the licks for the lead guitar (which in this case are bass lines) AND write additional bass lines for me.

    I never played guitar although I know basic chords. The first time I picked up an electric lead Burns 6 string in the early 70's, all I was interested in was the EADG strings to play along with Stevie Wonder. Of course I did not know then that my influence was James Jamerson.
    Pete
     

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