• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Learning Scales, Chords and Arpeggios quickly

K

Karmine

Oct 13, 2012
3
0
#1
I've been playing bass for many a years now.
But I always forget scales and such. So if anyone knows how to memorize them easily or learn them quickly (not like I really need to learn them now, but sooner the better right?). I am willing to put in a far amount of time to learn them though! :P
Anyone got some tips or pointers they can share with me?
 
#2
Really the only way is to play them. A LOT. How good you get at the instrument is a combination of how much talent you have, and how much time you spend with the instrument, scales and arpeggios included. The latter is far, far, FAR more important. There are no shortcuts, really. The only shortcut I can give you is keep it fun. If you get bored, play something fun, play along to a recording and just rock out, don't worry about how you sound. Just play. Then go back to doing your scales and working on technique. When you're tired if playing, go do something else and come back to it. Don't force yourself to practice when you don't want to, because if you don't really want to, you're really not going to get much out of it.

Just play when you want to, how you want to, and keep it fun. Gaining skill doesn't happen quickly. It's all about familiarity with the instrument and muscle memory. Even if you feel like you've peaked, keep playing and I 100% guarantee you will get better. A good thing is to find the bassist who your style and sensibilities match up with. For me, it's Geddy Lee, and I find his stuff really easy to learn and pick up, because it makes sense to me.

I'm no teacher, but at the risk of sounding pretentious, I have an extraordinary gift for music (so I'm told ;) ), and I think that even in my humble experience, I have something to offer those less experienced than I.
 
#3
Set aside 10-15 minutes of your day in order to run through scales and just play them through each mode and such. When you consistently do the same patterns over the course of 2 weeks you will begin to memorize the patterns.
 
#6
Well, I'd say it takes a lot more than 10 minutes a day to actually KNOW scales. Because it's so much more than just playing them up and down in a linear fashion. The vast majority of basslines are scalar and arpeggio based and being able to manipulate those aspects, rather than just playing them is the trick.
 
#7
Karmine said:
I've been playing bass for many a years now.
But I always forget scales and such. So if anyone knows how to memorize them easily or learn them quickly (not like I really need to learn them now, but sooner the better right?). I am willing to put in a far amount of time to learn them though! :P
Anyone got some tips or pointers they can share with me?
Click to expand...

Put in your hours, everyday. Learn songs in 12 keys

Theres no shortcut except working it out. Its likr learning a language
 
#8
Maybe focussing on one area at a time will help cement them in. Start with most popular Key of E.
Stay in Key of E for a whole week. Learn the whole fretboard in key of E.
Watch for repeated patterns, repeated notes, repeated fingerings, etc until it just clicks, the penny drops.
Do it until you're fluent and never make a mistake.
Do 10-20min bursts at the start and take a break, do something else other than music, let your subconscious process what you've learned.
Do this several times EVERY day to reinforce it and build your confidence.
Find songs in E and apply what you've learned.

Once you feel you've mastered it then move on to a different key. Try C as it has no sharps or flats for a week too.
 
#9
Ya I tend to do a lot of practicing. I think most people that are remotly serious will try to get a LEAST an hour a day of music.

This is just something I can never really remember (really just scales), which sucks as that's something somewhat important.

Even after taking multiple music classes in high school I had to think about it when doing scales as warm ups. Just gonna hope it sinks in eventually!

Thanks for the advice guys :3
 
#10
My issue is ive always been good at memorizing patterens since i got my first bass in july I've memorized the major and minor, pentatonic maj and minor and blues scales, thing is now what??? I'm not sure what im supposed to do with then. Mind you I'm not taking lessons, what am missing
 
#11
Try thinking only of the chromatic scale (all 12 notes), and learning the sound/feel of each of the scale degrees against the root. Different songs do only use subsets of the notes, which is what gives them their mood. But if you can directly assocate the mood with the degrees of the chromatic scale, then you don't need to spend your days 'learning scales'.
 
#12
odarellmc said:
My issue is ive always been good at memorizing patterens since i got my first bass in july I've memorized the major and minor, pentatonic maj and minor and blues scales, thing is now what??? I'm not sure what im supposed to do with then. Mind you I'm not taking lessons, what am missing
Click to expand...

As you learn songs, notice how they follow the patterns you learned, which makes the songs easier to remember.
 
#13
odarellmc said:
My issue is ive always been good at memorizing patterens since i got my first bass in july I've memorized the major and minor, pentatonic maj and minor and blues scales, thing is now what??? I'm not sure what im supposed to do with then. Mind you I'm not taking lessons, what am missing
Click to expand...

Make music with them... They are tools, use them. Having a hammer is useless if you're never going to use it for anything.

For example, pentatonic minor. Put on any blues song (or a blues backing track from Youtube). Figure out what key it's in. Let's say you have one in E. With the track playing in the background, play an E pentatonic scale. Then try playing a few notes from the scale. Pick 3 and play try to vary them as much as you can. Pick different ones and just try to make music. It's not hard if you're having fun
 
#15
The whole problem with scales it that players think they are learning them when they are not. They are memorising note names in an order, or learning a pattern. Now not every player memorises them only as note names of shapes, but I have dealt with a lot who do.
As such they get no information from a scale other that the names of the notes....and then they order them in a diatonic preference.

For example what scale is this? F# G A B C D E F# escapes some players because it starts on F#.

The fact it is GMaj or Em does not register because they do not recognise the interaction on the notes or intervals..all they see is eight notes starting on an F#.

So the fact that if we start any scale on the lowest available note of the scale rather than the root, we learn so much more.
In the example I have given the scale is GMaj but just starting on 7th of the scale, the F#, or the 6th inversion, or maybe even see it as an Em scale because of its relative tendencies. You may even see and attribute modal qualities to it if you so wish. Now none of this is premeditated as to what goes where or what can be used or even what it is. It is instinctive that a player recognises their options, decides, then plays...all this within a few seconds, because it is internalised and they have information supporting and qualifying information in different ways.

But it is Gmag ( or Em ) because it uses one #, the F#.
The scale is started at the lowest note available and played to the last highest note available, we will in fact play and Em scale and a GMaj scale in the process.
So the need to learn two scales is not needed as we have played a GMaj and an Em scale and stayed 'in tune' by staying in key as we played up the full length of the neck...and back down.
Not only that, but in how we play up and down the neck has so many options of notes to choose from as the bass is tuned to 4ths.
Now we learn about certain chromatic approaches and well as different fingerings with open and cross string uses.
We learn the chord tones available, how to build extentions to chords what makes a 9th, 11th, 13th for example, as well as the Triads, Arps and other scale uses such as Pentatonics or Blues scales etc all related to learning a GMaj scale correctly.

Because of learning and not memorising, playing your Major scales in such a fashion means that by playing 7 Major scales in key we learn all the relative minor ones as well, but in still in key with an understanding that they are linked rather than each being seperate things.
We learn the relationships as we go along, we understand why 5ths and 4ths can be our building blocks in playing, why root, 5th and 8th can be a framework for chords, so therefore chord tones.......but only from learning them and understanding them...not memorising them.

Just saying its more about what you can do if you really understand a simple idea. I like to tell students that basic music theory is about 250 pages long, so not a big book and not that hard to learn.....but as for it application, well that would fill countless libraries..as it has done for centuries, and is ever growing with ideas.....Ideas based on 250 pages that cover 12 notes.
 
#16
Fergie Fulton said:
The whole problem with scales it that players think they are learning them when they are not. They are memorising note names in an order, or learning a pattern. Now not every player memorises them only as note names of shapes, but I have dealt with a lot who do.
As such they get no information from a scale other that the names of the notes....and then they order them in a diatonic preference.

For example what scale is this? F# G A B C D E F# escapes some players because it starts on F#.

The fact it is GMaj or Em does not register because they do not recognise the interaction on the notes or intervals..all they see is eight notes starting on an F#.

So the fact that if we start any scale on the lowest available note of the scale rather than the root, we learn so much more.
In the example I have given the scale is GMaj but just starting on 7th of the scale, the F#, or the 6th inversion, or maybe even see it as an Em scale because of its relative tendencies. You may even see and attribute modal qualities to it if you so wish. Now none of this is premeditated as to what goes where or what can be used or even what it is. It is instinctive that a player recognises their options, decides, then plays...all this within a few seconds, because it is internalised and they have information supporting and qualifying information in different ways.

But it is Gmag ( or Em ) because it uses one #, the F#.
The scale is started at the lowest note available and played to the last highest note available, we will in fact play and Em scale and a GMaj scale in the process.
So the need to learn two scales is not needed as we have played a GMaj and an Em scale and stayed 'in tune' by staying in key as we played up the full length of the neck...and back down.
Not only that, but in how we play up and down the neck has so many options of notes to choose from as the bass is tuned to 4ths.
Now we learn about certain chromatic approaches and well as different fingerings with open and cross string uses.
We learn the chord tones available, how to build extentions to chords what makes a 9th, 11th, 13th for example, as well as the Triads, Arps and other scale uses such as Pentatonics or Blues scales etc all related to learning a GMaj scale correctly.

Because of learning and not memorising, playing your Major scales in such a fashion means that by playing 7 Major scales in key we learn all the relative minor ones as well, but in still in key with an understanding that they are linked rather than each being seperate things.
We learn the relationships as we go along, we understand why 5ths and 4ths can be our building blocks in playing, why root, 5th and 8th can be a framework for chords, so therefore chord tones.......but only from learning them and understanding them...not memorising them.

Just saying its more about what you can do if you really understand a simple idea. I like to tell students that basic music theory is about 250 pages long, so not a big book and not that hard to learn.....but as for it application, well that would fill countless libraries..as it has done for centuries, and is ever growing with ideas.....Ideas based on 250 pages that cover 12 notes.
Click to expand...

Well it is a F#min7b5 or F# Locrian :D

Kidding a side a big +1 to all you said
 
#19
Ezmar said:
Really the only way is to play them. A LOT. How good you get at the instrument is a combination of how much talent you have, and how much time you spend with the instrument, scales and arpeggios included. The latter is far, far, FAR more important. There are no shortcuts, really. The only shortcut I can give you is keep it fun. If you get bored, play something fun, play along to a recording and just rock out, don't worry about how you sound. Just play. Then go back to doing your scales and working on technique. When you're tired if playing, go do something else and come back to it. Don't force yourself to practice when you don't want to, because if you don't really want to, you're really not going to get much out of it.

Just play when you want to, how you want to, and keep it fun. Gaining skill doesn't happen quickly. It's all about familiarity with the instrument and muscle memory. Even if you feel like you've peaked, keep playing and I 100% guarantee you will get better. A good thing is to find the bassist who your style and sensibilities match up with. For me, it's Geddy Lee, and I find his stuff really easy to learn and pick up, because it makes sense to me.

I'm no teacher, but at the risk of sounding pretentious, I have an extraordinary gift for music (so I'm told ;) ), and I think that even in my humble experience, I have something to offer those less experienced than I.
Click to expand...

There's no such thing as talent. Talent is an excuse that people use to underachieve.
 
#20
Karmine said:
I've been playing bass for many a years now.
But I always forget scales and such. So if anyone knows how to memorize them easily or learn them quickly (not like I really need to learn them now, but sooner the better right?). I am willing to put in a far amount of time to learn them though! :P
Anyone got some tips or pointers they can share with me?
Click to expand...

Something I've learned that has helped me is to associate scales, arpeggios on the fretboard with something that you're familiar with, like a geometric shape.

I.E Triangles, box like shapes etc.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back