Lee Sklar sets the record clear: 4 string? 5 string? pick? fingers? fretless?

[Dr. Cheese]

We debate 4-string vs 5-string because, generally speaking, we have too much time on our hands here (currently lockdown situation notwithstanding).

If I had an actual career in music, a la Lee Sklar, I wouldn't give a rat's tight little patootie about that and many other topics around here.

True.

 

[DavidEdenAria]

But TB says that I have to have a J and P to go into the studio ... or to play in a blues or country band ...

I agree with Sklar ... all of this is stupid and only serve to gratify a vision not the actual music

BUT, Lee stays away from P basses, especially the single P pickup....tho his mainstay bass is a P body with a J neck but modded with early 2 EMG P pickups in the J positions.

The J neck started out as a P neck but was shaped to be a J neck.....has mandolin frets as well which he puts on every bass.

 

[SunByrne]

Warning: long.

I liked the video, but find it more than a little ironic that many of the people rushing to defend Sklar seemed to have also missed Sklar's point.

Let me take on an example here:

Bass is not a lead instrument, and the mark of an immature and egoic [sic] player is a bassist that looks to make it about themselves. Your job is to support the singer and the song.

That's... a bunch of rules. You know, the thing Sklar himself said we shouldn't be applying here about gear or how to play.

And while I certainly agree that being entirely a support instrument is one way to think about the bass, it is not the only way. Wasn't that Sklar's point?

When people go to a Marcus Miller concert, who's it really about? I'd argue pretty strongly that it's about Marcus Miller, and I also disagree with the idea that somehow automatically makes Miller immature and egotistic. Consider this thread:

Songs where the bass line IS the song.

In a lot of those songs, it actually is about the bass line, and I'm totally OK with that. Given how popular that thread has been, I think it's safe to say there are bass players here on TB who also think that it is, in fact, OK for the bass to be more of a lead instrument... at least some of the time. I think bass is a versatile enough instrument to have more than one single, rigidly-defined role, and that moving outside that narrow definition is not, in fact, indicative of some kind of character flaw.

Sklar himself said your job as a bass player is to do something you enjoy. I take that to mean the whole range, from hammering out three-note Ramones tracks badly in your bedroom with no knowledge about technique or theory to being a session musician on highly technical jazz to being Peter Hook. Play in the pocket if you want to. Play "lead bass" if you want to. It's all good.

And while I don't agree with Spaghetti's tone (dude, seriously, lighten up) or his lack of respect for Sklar, I also have to say that I do agree that the majority of music Sklar has made is... well, let's just say not my cup of tea. DrCheese posted a huge list of albums Sklar worked on, and I think I own none of them. I find most of the stuff on that list just doesn't suit me. Frankly, a lot of it just strikes me as kind of... boring. It leans toward folk/folk-pop—not entirely, obviously, but it leans that way—and that's just not the kind of music I'm into. It doesn't mean Sklar is bad, by any stretch, and I think that's where the criticism went off the rails, but the stuff he tends to play on is not for everyone, myself definitely included.

To wit, when I first started playing, my instructor asked me to generate a list of songs I wanted to learn. Being a little OCD, the next week I brought back a list of about 120 songs, from simple stuff like the Police and Talking Heads to a somewhat more involved stuff like Rush, Yes, Tool, and Level 42. How many were Sklar? Zero. None, nada, zilch, empty set. His enormous body of work just fails to intersect with my interests, both as a listener and as a bass player.

I think the mistake is to confuse what you like and what you respect. There is music I like that I don't particularly respect (we all have guilty pleasures, right?) and there's lots of music out there I respect, but don't particularly like.

Sklar's a great example of the latter. I have tremendous respect for his ability to work with so many people for such a long time, and he seems from what limited information I have like a genuinely decent human being. There's no doubt that he's a talented musician and I'm sure he came up with many of those lines on short order and executed them expertly, something few if any of us here on TB could do—certainly way beyond any skill level I'll ever achieve. He must be great to work with because he sure gets asked back a lot. Major props to him for his obviously illustrious career, clearly respectable... but it doesn't make me enjoy most of his actual music. If someone told me the only songs I'd ever be able to play are songs Sklar played on, I'd probably never pick up a bass again. That'd make me sad, but I'm not gonna spend time playing music I don't like.

Nor, I think, would Lee Sklar himself want me to.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

Warning: long.

I liked the video, but find it more than a little ironic that many of the people rushing to defend Sklar seemed to have also missed Sklar's point.

Let me take on an example here:



That's... a bunch of rules. You know, the thing Sklar himself said we shouldn't be applying here about gear or how to play.

And while I certainly agree that being entirely a support instrument is one way to think about the bass, it is not the only way. Wasn't that Sklar's point?

When people go to a Marcus Miller concert, who's it really about? I'd argue pretty strongly that it's about Marcus Miller, and I also disagree with the idea that somehow automatically makes Miller immature and egotistic. Consider this thread:

Songs where the bass line IS the song.

In a lot of those songs, it actually is about the bass line, and I'm totally OK with that. Given how popular that thread has been, I think it's safe to say there are bass players here on TB who also think that it is, in fact, OK for the bass to be more of a lead instrument... at least some of the time. I think bass is a versatile enough instrument to have more than one single, rigidly-defined role, and that moving outside that narrow definition is not, in fact, indicative of some kind of character flaw.

Sklar himself said your job as a bass player is to do something you enjoy. I take that to mean the whole range, from hammering out three-note Ramones tracks badly in your bedroom with no knowledge about technique or theory to being a session musician on highly technical jazz to being Peter Hook. Play in the pocket if you want to. Play "lead bass" if you want to. It's all good.

And while I don't agree with Spaghetti's tone (dude, seriously, lighten up) or his lack of respect for Sklar, I also have to say that I do agree that the majority of music Sklar has made is... well, let's just say not my cup of tea. DrCheese posted a huge list of albums Sklar worked on, and I think I own none of them. I find most of the stuff on that list just doesn't suit me. Frankly, a lot of it just strikes me as kind of... boring. It leans toward folk/folk-pop—not entirely, obviously, but it leans that way—and that's just not the kind of music I'm into. It doesn't mean Sklar is bad, by any stretch, and I think that's where the criticism went off the rails, but the stuff he tends to play on is not for everyone, myself definitely included.

To wit, when I first started playing, my instructor asked me to generate a list of songs I wanted to learn. Being a little OCD, the next week I brought back a list of about 120 songs, from simple stuff like the Police and Talking Heads to a somewhat more involved stuff like Rush, Yes, Tool, and Level 42. How many were Sklar? Zero. None, nada, zilch, empty set. His enormous body of work just fails to intersect with my interests, both as a listener and as a bass player.

I think the mistake is to confuse what you like and what you respect. There is music I like that I don't particularly respect (we all have guilty pleasures, right?) and there's lots of music out there I respect, but don't particularly like.

Sklar's a great example of the latter. I have tremendous respect for his ability to work with so many people for such a long time, and he seems from what limited information I have like a genuinely decent human being. There's no doubt that he's a talented musician and I'm sure he came up with many of those lines on short order and executed them expertly, something few if any of us here on TB could do—certainly way beyond any skill level I'll ever achieve. He must be great to work with because he sure gets asked back a lot. Major props to him for his obviously illustrious career, clearly respectable... but it doesn't make me enjoy most of his actual music. If someone told me the only songs I'd ever be able to play are songs Sklar played on, I'd probably never pick up a bass again. That'd make me sad, but I'm not gonna spend time playing music I don't like.

Nor, I think, would Lee Sklar himself want me to.

Lee Sklar has been involved in numerous side projects and “vanity” bands over the years. He has recorded a lot of self indulgent music from The Section to The Barefoot Servants to his current project, Immediate Family. At the same time, he got rich (at least for a sideman) realizing the vision of singer song writers, beginning with James Taylor. Marcus Miller did the same thing, getting famous realizing the visions others from Luther Vandross and Aretha Franklin to Miles Davis. Marcus since has gone on to have a successful solo career. Miller likes being a solo artist, Sklar likes being in a band. They both have had careers that have allowed them to express themselves.

 

[Feral Feline]

While most of what he's done isn't my cup of tea, either, he's been around long enough to have done enough stuff that there's stuff in his canon that I would happily learn...

YES to Cobham, Bowie, BB King, Cohen and Cole — and a whole lot more.

NO to Collins, Manilow, Black, Gill and Williams — and a whole lot more.

 

[Kubicki Fan]

I liked his videos at first until he started whining like a teenager about facebook. He sounded desperate and it was embarrassing to look at the screen and see this old dude mope like a preteen who'd been grounded from using his x-box. Not a good look.

Apart from that I find his playing, his tone (ESPECIALLY his tone), and overall his basslines to be the epitome of studio session-guy blandness.

I can see why synths took over in his era. Just no pizazz whatsoever; the opposite of a player like Will Lee who always injected some personality, dynamics and tone to make him stand out a bit even when the point of being a session guy was to NOT stand out.

I liked Lee Sklar better when I didn't actually hear him talk or play.

One of Lee's kling-on's showed up (and got scraped off promptly )

In an era when people want to commercialize every bit of wisdom they picked up on their way it is refreshing to hear a true master's take on things for free, yay!

Thanks for posting this! (For those that didn't know)

 

[Kubicki Fan]

Seriously? Always fun listening to someone I’ve never heard - or heard of - dissing an acknowledged great in such a condescending manner. I’d love to hear you play. Got any links?

The only links he got are in his sausage ;-), the neophyte little troll.

 

[Jon McBass]

The only links he got are in his sausage ;-), the neophyte little troll.

In their search for an identity, many adolescents need to go through the troll stage. Too many never grow out of it and reach adulthood.

 

[fastgeek]

I only recently became "reacquainted" with Lee a few weeks ago watching his Sussudio video. In said video, he freely admits to being rusty and needing to get his fingers back in shape. Then, so far as I'm concerned, he played without a hitch. Makes a guy who's struggling to start playing again question his life choices!

When all was said and done, I found myself being very impressed with the man's skill and humbleness. Also left with a deep curiosity of the fan fret setup and, honestly, a serious case of beard envy. All jokes about "God / Gandalf plays the bass!" aside, he's widely respected throughout the industry. Even if a lot of his music history doesn't float your boat, one doesn't atain that kind of stays being a nothing-very-special player. JMHO of course.

 

[Gianni "Orlandez" Orlati]

Thx. for the explanation!

 

[40Hz]

Sklar himself said your job as a bass player is to do something you enjoy. I take that to mean the whole range, from hammering out three-note Ramones tracks badly in your bedroom with no knowledge about technique or theory to being a session musician on highly technical jazz to being Peter Hook. Play in the pocket if you want to. Play "lead bass" if you want to. It's all good.

If you view music as a performance art-form then it’s not quite as simple as doing whatever you want and it’s all good. At least not if you go beyond the mindset of a bedroom guitarist.

Music involves collaboration. At the very least with your listener. And one trap it’s easy to fall into is imagining you’re so far ahead of the curve that people don’t understand you because you’re too “subtle,” “advanced,” “intelligent,” or “uncompromisingly artistic.”

Far too many amateurs mistake being obscure, incomprehensible, or just plain weird for being profound. Heartbreaking genius and mind boggling originality are extremely rare despite Apple Computer convincing so many wannabes that, with the right technology, a big enough ego and zero self-awareness, anyone can be a genius at whatever they want to be.

Got news. There’s a 99% chance you won’t. You might become technically proficient at something. Maybe even to the point of convincing yourself and your little entourage. But it won’t hold up long nor create anything lasting. Unless you actually are in that special 1%.

So by all means aim high and go for it. If you really are that brilliant it’ll show. And the world will catch up eventually. But at least show good form by not going around self-awarding your own laurels. Understand that and it is “all good.”

 

[yodedude2]

i noticed someone referred to lee sklar's bass playing as 'bland' and indistinct. here's an anecdote for y'all:

i collect 8 track tapes, especially quadraphonic tapes. not too long ago i acquired 'spooky lady's sideshow' by kris kristofferson. i had never heard it before, so i did the usual repairs and popped it in the deck for a spin. almost immediately i noticed the bass guitar: great tone, great note choices, great phrasing. i thought to myself, 'i know this player. it sounds like leland sklar. but on a kristofferson album? kris must've told the guy at the session to play like lee sklar'. well, turns out i was wrong. it was lee sklar after all. i had had no idea sklar had ever played on a kristofferson album before.

i reckon this shows that some folks can hear a musical style when others can't.

Not a question,

 

[TreySonagras]

I see him as a bass player that is doing YouTube videos on the side. Instead of a YouTuber who is trying to be a bass player on the side.

 

[40Hz]

A session player also usually needs to play what they’re asked to play. I’ve had sessions where I thought I’d nailed a great part only to hear during playback, “no, actually we want less of this and more of that.” Most of the time you’re role is to help the artist actualize their vision, not your own.

^Precisely this.

More than once I got asked prior to a recording session: “Are you able to work with a click track - and somebody who is capable of playing a chart exactly as written without embellishing or otherwise messing around with it? If <name> wants any creative input from any of the session players they’ll ask for it.”

 

[Ostie]

As I read down the list of Lee Sklar’s work, I kept nodding to myself “yep....yep.....heard that one.....love that track....” This is a guy who has made a very successful career as a studio player and whether or not any of us like the recordings, you can’t help but be respectful of the work he’s done. Artists and producers know that this is a guy who will show up on time, make the song better, get along, and then head to his next date. I could spend hours, days maybe, listening to his stories.

 

[Feral Feline]

I see him as a bass player that is doing YouTube videos on the side. Instead of a YouTuber who is trying to be a bass player on the side.

BINGOHOWTRUEDAT!

 

[grinx]

i wonder if Spaghetti Lee is actually Lee Sklar's evil online social media presence?

 

[Tom Bomb]

The most likable, most supportive, most experienced, most employable, most trusted, accomplished, kindly, solid, reliable, wise, no nonsense bass player in the solar system. Pathetic really.

 

[Pimpernel Smith]

I think it's a treasure for bass players to have Lee share his thoughts, let alone his music.

 

[Hover-Rich]

it sounds like leland sklar. but on a kristofferson album? kris must've told the guy at the session to play like lee sklar'.

Forgive me for going off on a tangent, here. This reminds me of a thing that David Hungate (Nashville session bassist) said many years ago:
Artist: Can you play something like so'n'so would play?
Translation: I really wanted to get so'n'so for this session.
Session player: Can you sing more like George Jones?
Translation: Kiss my a**.