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'Live' bands with backing tracks

#21
Saetia said:
After working at a club for 3 years I've seen many "big" acts use backing tracks or clip tracks and just synch on their instuments. It's was a great disapointment for me, I would say that 50% of the larger national and international acts didn't even play. (I know this because I had to help hook all their gear up and provide a place for the laptop to be hidden).

I won't mention any names, but just think big radio metal bands.

Peace

-Benny
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Yes and No. I know first hand as I played in an act like that. We had backing tracks, but only for overdubs and synth sounds that would have required too many band members. It's not 50%, that is a false # to say they are not playing. They are playing for the most part, but it's still lame..let me explain:

It actually is a very good test for a pro band (playing to a click synced to overdubs)because if you come off beat, your entire song will be out of sync when the tracks come in.

I watched this happen to disturbed. his backup vocals were out of sync and it was hilarious.

Also saw it happen to another band I wont name. they are not that famous or anything anymore,but basically they used an MPC for all kinds of sounds and it went crazy and started playing default drum loops. This was in front of 15-20,000 people. I had already played and was standing behind the drummer watching him freak out. The funny part was that the crowd thought it was part of the show and started getting into the cheesy drumloop..lol. It was awesome as I was pretty ripped at this point which made it basically rule.

I started really paying attention and saw some disturbing trends. Mainly vocal backing tracks that basically were as loud as the singer. So basically these singers were singing over themselves. It was lame. Really started to ruin rock music for me. Rock n roll to me is supposed to be raw and organic and LIVE.

Now a band like Device is touring with no bass player and using backing tracks for bass! lol..thats just stupid. I truly hate where rock is going, which is why I stick to the indie stuff or just listen to jazz.

But to say 50% of the bands are not playing is false. The majority are playing to a click with triggers. IMO any band that is faking to play their parts shold be pulled off the road and forced to payback their tour support, work at starbucks and rehearse their set for a year before going on the road again.
 
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#22
I agree with most of whats said here.


How do you feel about Loop stations?

I know of a solo act where he starts each song by playing 4 bars on guitar, loops that, and then plays lead and sings over the looped rhythm. He might have used some simple drum tracks too. Id say he this was OK being that he was a solo act and still played good leads and sang well.
 
#23
DataDan said:
I agree with most of whats said here.


How do you feel about Loop stations?

I know of a solo act where he starts each song by playing 4 bars on guitar, loops that, and then plays lead and sings over the looped rhythm. He might have used some simple drum tracks too. Id say he this was OK being that he was a solo act and still played good leads and sang well.
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to me thats kind of tired as a live thing, just overdone, but it's an amazing way to write tracks really quickly.
 
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#24
The reality is that as long as they did the right songs, and the tracks sounded OK, and the bride had a good time, nobody cares, including me.

They are a wedding band. I have been in wedding bands and really enjoyed them so I am not knocking them. But let's all be grownups here and admit that "musical integrity" isn't exactly high on the priority list of a wedding band.

That's not their job.

Their job is to have available to them a set of songs that will allow the bride and her college buddies to have a great freaking time and a night to remember. Anything else (like talent, integrity, being "real", or owning/using great gear) takes a back seat (like two hundred yards away in the back seat) to just creating the atmosphere for a good time had by all. Nobody in that room but you cared (relatively speaking).

As far as the money goes, a grand for a wedding band is NOTHING. I played in a band that got $5K on average and actually filled in for a band that got $8K that night (my cut was $1500 by the way). And they used all kinds of tracks. So many that it was hard for me to fake it well in some cases.

Bride happy = nobody cares.
 
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#25
two fingers said:
Bride happy = nobody cares.
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True enough and you can then extend that to whatever audience you want to.

In looking at a totally live band versus a tracked fake one, most consuming audiences don't care about the quality that you get with the real thing and would rather save some bucks by getting the fake.

People have been conditioned to accept low-quality substitutes at lower cost over higher-quality products and services.

As musicians, this strikes us as wrong but it's a reality that we face.
 
#27
two fingers said:
The reality is that as long as they did the right songs, and the tracks sounded OK, and the bride had a good time, nobody cares, including me.

They are a wedding band. I have been in wedding bands and really enjoyed them so I am not knocking them. But let's all be grownups here and admit that "musical integrity" isn't exactly high on the priority list of a wedding band.

That's not their job.

Their job is to have available to them a set of songs that will allow the bride and her college buddies to have a great freaking time and a night to remember. Anything else (like talent, integrity, being "real", or owning/using great gear) takes a back seat (like two hundred yards away in the back seat) to just creating the atmosphere for a good time had by all. Nobody in that room but you cared (relatively speaking).

As far as the money goes, a grand for a wedding band is NOTHING. I played in a band that got $5K on average and actually filled in for a band that got $8K that night (my cut was $1500 by the way). And they used all kinds of tracks. So many that it was hard for me to fake it well in some cases.

Bride happy = nobody cares.
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I agree. I play in a fourteen-piece corporate/wedding band. We use backing tracks for most of our dance tracks. Could we get by without them? To an audience of musicians, sure - everyone in the band can play - but the reality is that we have to be able to compete with what the DJ is doing on a sonic level (texturally, frequency-wise and parts-wise). Most people in the audience have no idea what's going on on-stage (regardless of wether or not a sequence is running) other than that we're having a good time and giving the crowd what they want.

If I go to see an "originals" act my expectations are going to be very different from what they might be for a wedding band but, even then, I expect that certain songs may very well be performed along with a click or sequence. What is really going to bother me is if the sequences are there to cover up incompetence on the part of the musicians. But, with the kinds of bands I've gone to see live, this has never been the case. The other night I saw Khaled performing with seven musicians. They were all killers - playing their butts off. The arrangements were great and the band was super tight. Khaled's been on the scene for a long time and his latest album (not my favourite) has some tracks that are very contemporary-club. There's no way those songs could be performed live and sound anything like they do on the album and so sequences were used for those songs. It was actually funny though because, all of a sudden, the musicians went from being really active and playing with obvious enthusiasm to looking as if they had hardly anything to do with their left hands. :p
 
#31
My band uses some backing tracks:

*Stomp Stomp Clap (accompanied by kick and snare by our drummer) when we do "We Will Rock You
*"Money" sound effects followed by "The Wall" segue for "Comfortably Numb"

We might use more, too. I like it, but it will always be sparingly.

I also have a keyboard sound set up that is bass and distorted guitar, and I play along with my wife on bass during that part in "Train Kept a Rolling" where it just sounds too empty with only one guitar. The bass beefs up her bass line, (the part is kind of fast, and some of her notes get a little lost,) and adds that needed rhythm guitar. The sound is set up so if I use half strength, it is only bass, and if I "punch" the keys a bit, that guitar is loud. I just KNEW my band was going to hate it when I threw that in, but to my surprise, they loved it, so it stayed in.

What is talked about in the OP is just too much, though, in my opinion.
 
#32
I was in a band in the 90's where the keyboard player wanted to do this with all manner of sequenced crap, I was dead against it.

We rehearsed one particular track for what seemed like forever to get it just right. Then when we performed it the drummer couldn't hear it properly in his monitor and lost sync. To save a train wreck the kbd player faded the backing track out and we never tried it again - result.:bassist:
 
#33
bass12 said:
I agree. I play in a fourteen-piece corporate/wedding band. We use backing tracks for most of our dance tracks. Could we get by without them? To an audience of musicians, sure - everyone in the band can play - but the reality is that we have to be able to compete with what the DJ is doing on a sonic level (texturally, frequency-wise and parts-wise). Most people in the audience have no idea what's going on on-stage (regardless of wether or not a sequence is running) other than that we're having a good time and giving the crowd what they want. :p
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You have fourteen people in the band that know how to play and yet you still need to use backing tracks for MOST of your songs?

Seriously?
 
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#34
two fingers said:
Bride happy = nobody cares.
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NWB said:
People have been conditioned to accept low-quality substitutes at lower cost over higher-quality products and services.
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So true, and this applies not just to music, but to pretty much everything, especially when it comes to weddings.

I am an amateur photographer. I shoot on black and white film and make my own prints in a real dark room and I take a lot of pride in my work. I rarely ever get paid for any of it, aside from the occassional print.

I went to a friend's wedding and walked around taking photos, which I later gave her prints of for free as a gift.

She also hired, for big bucks, a "professional" photographer, who walked around with expensive digital gear all night and took the most godawful horrible photos I've ever seen. Washed-out faces, photo bombs, etc.

But the bride didn't know any better, so it was accepted, and that photographer went on to the next wedding to do some more second-rate work. At least my friend was happy with the photos I gave her.

Also, the band sucked, BTW.

I play music for my own satisfaction, same as photography. Nobody in my band would ever think of doing what the band in the OP does. Using the occassional sequencer or loop pedal is one thing, but lip-syncing is just douchebaggery.
 
#35
I'm a huge fan of backing tracks for two reasons:

1. It forces your drummer to learn to play with a click track which is invaluable.
2. Usually because you use up more frequencies in the spectrum the gig will sound better overall, as long as the tracks are of a high quality.

People who say it's a cop-out are wrong and usually jealous that their band sounds worse than whoever they're criticizing
 
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#39
IPYF said:
I'm a huge fan of backing tracks for two reasons:

1. It forces your drummer to learn to play with a click track which is invaluable.
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Not every drummer needs a click to stay on time, and not every drummer will ever need to be able to play to a click. If a drummer does want to learn to play to a click, it can be done without backing tracks.

IPYF said:
2. Usually because you use up more frequencies in the spectrum the gig will sound better overall, as long as the tracks are of a high quality.
Click to expand...

Quite often, less is more. Filling in space just for the sake of filling in space rarely adds to the song. Some of the best songs of all time use sparse instrumentation.
 
#40
LOL One band I was in had a gig opening for Kick Axe. (This was mid 80s, at the height of their popularity. On their Vices tour.) While we were setting up for the gig, they had to redo all their backup vocal backing tracks, as the disc for them disappeared. They used foot pedals to trigger them. I saw them recording them, and saw them in use during their show. :scowl:

 

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