Losing faith in what Im doing.

[Low End Scum]

people like to hear stuff they know. I've never heard any of those three songs. IMO, it's fine to sneak in some deeper covers or more obscure tracks if most of the set is easily recognizable. There's plenty of funky covers you guys can borrow or, it sounds you people have enough chops to be able to take some poppy stuff and make it funky or soulful. I personally enjoy putting genre spins on songs. IME, it's not so much about contemporary, but about recognition.

Full disclosure: I feel the same way about our song choices - I'd heard about 15% of our playlist before joining and I wonder if the general population would have any better recognition. I know this style is way more about grooves and getting booties shaking than sing-alongs, but I believe the audience still likes to hear stuff they know.

Best of luck and yes, 12 years is a very long time to hold onto a dream like this.

Herein lies the rub in my opinion. My cover band plays "crowd pleasers". Radio Rock that gets the soccer moms who wish they were still going to see Blink 182 at Warp Tour or going on about the Killers interested in catching a show. People like it. People cheer. My drummer won't play any faster or heavier than Blink 182. We don't make edits to the tracks for our "style". That band I think has potential to either phase the covers out in favor of originals, or to be an event playing "wallpaper music" and playing radio hits type of band. For me, I get to get out of the house, play music in front of people, and not stress to much about an "emotional investment" in what we're doing. Frankly, I wouldn't listen to more than 1 or 2 tracks out of our hour and 10 minute current tracklist. It's about getting out there and playing live to a good response.

My other band, which is one that I definitely get way more musical appreciation and enjoyment out of is really not anyones cup of tea but ours. It's not in vogue. Bands that sound similar aren't popping up out of the underground. I couldn't care less. In my best situations I've run 2 bands. 1 that is for having a crowd be excited, and 1 that is entirely selfish. Given the choice between the 2, I'd pick being entirely selfish because I do this for me.

If, however, you're still fighting for getting to play what you as a player deeply deeply love and get musical satisfaction out of while also maintaining a following and bringing in sizeable groups to bars well......if you ever find the secret panacea to that other than happening to like whats popular at the time please let me know.

 

[Beej]

You guys sound fantastic - I was in a working funk band in the early 90s and we were maybe half as good as you guys functionally, but we were all in our early 20s, hot, had high energy and were playing in a busy and wide ranging venue circuit.

When I listened to funk back in the day, which was in the late 80s/early 90s, the music was only a decade old. You'd still hear bigger songs played on the radio. What you guys are running into now, would have been the equivalent of playing music from the 40s to a 90's crowd. That's older than my parents at the time. So yeah, you sound great, but the music at this point is arguably archaic. I can get my teenagers to listen to 90's grunge and newer, but going older than that just doesn't have the same grab to them. Deftones totally trumps Led Zeppelin to them, hands down and James Brown is 'funny sounding old people music'.

I think there's nothing wrong with it, but I'm also in the camp of your needing to do more covers and known songs rather than focusing on originals. If you love them, that's great, but how many audience members will love them? I love funk and for the right band, I might even actually go out to see them, but I'm certainly your target demographic, (if not even a decade older than me) and how many of us pack the scene to enjoy music right now? Where I am, it's few.

 

[pepj]

I think it's a fine line and quite an art.
We steer away from the songs tgat everybody does but find there is still enough around to be creative and also get people going.
We've put up our rate which is beginning to price ourselves out of the circuit where all the 'same' bands come from. This can be a positive and negative thing but we think if we really want to do that gig..we can drop accordingly but the realisation is that 80% of those gigs are not worth doing anyway.
Where that leads to is agency work, higher prices and likely tickets.
The latter isn't quite so drastic as it seems because venues are finding band rates a struggle so a cover is required.
The people who will pay a cover are also people who expect something different in terms of show and quality.
So, imv, the circle of a journey is joining.
The scene has 3 levels now, local cover, tribute and ticket covers and rates are way different.

 

[roccobass]

Like me, I haven’t read all the posts so someone may have already beaten me to this points.

You guys sound great. I would kill to be in outfit like this. But I agree with an earlier comment that some musics thrive better in certain markets. I know from experience.

Have you thought about hitting the road outside of the Mesa/Phoenix area? Tucson? Vegas? Albuquerque? Even southern California? An even more drastic step is complete relocation, but you all have to on the same page and fully committed. I’m kinda doubting you guys’ll do that after this long. Roots get planted. Hmm. You’ve already worked with agencies? They’ve offered no tips to make you more marketable? Yes/no?. Hmm. You guys may need that something (schtk?) to make you stand out. Maybe working with a professional manager? I dunno.

Yeah, 12 years is a long time to hammer away. Hopefully, you still can love it, but I understand if frustration takes it’s toll. I wish you all the best.

 

[Parzival]

Concur with the people sadly just want to hear what they know. Your music sounds good, probably just not a market for it. That is the kind of stuff I like to hear when I go out somewhere rather than hearing some acoustic duo playing Semi-charmed Life or Long Neck Ice Cold Beer for the 89,456th time.

 

[pepj]

Revisited the OP.
The 3 tracks are very samey and as one the first posts said, there is nowhere to go if that doesn't appeal.

We can all decide to play what we want...but you do need to be self critical about what is or isn't working.
12 years is a long time to not have come to a conclusion one way or another.

It sounds to me you need a good agent to position yourself correctly, however, it may be too late to get round to doing that.

 

[Bass Motifs]

Any update from the OP @seansbrew?

Just looked at your (updated?) website and clips again, looks pretty flash. And you seem to have dates booked!

 

[Bullitt5135]

@seansbrew what type of venues & events are you targeting? You said you've failed to build much of a following. That tells me bar & club gigs are not where it's at for you. I'd be going after summer community concert series, local art fairs, festivals, etc. My town has a 2-week music festival every summer that ONLY books mostly-original acts like yours. Playing originals can work in your favor since some venues do not want to deal with BMI/ASCAP — so they only book original acts (wineries come to mind). It also sounds like you have the talent to do wedding and upscale events...if you shift to covers ranging from Motown, funk, dance, current top-40, etc. Play the hits and save the originals for vanity gigs.

Post some videos of your live perfomances.

 

[newwavefrank]

I read all the comments and watched some of the live video. First thing I noticed before watching video was that I didn't know the songs. That's fine and to be expected if you are an original band, but low-paying, sparsely attended gigs are also an expectation of most bands playing originals. If you want to play because you like writing and playing songs you've written, then that's great. Keep at it. If you want a bigger more enthusiastic crowd then play songs people know. There is a market for old school funk, but make it the hits. The hits that still get heard. I play in an 80's tribute. When picking songs I always ask myself, would a 25 year old know this song? If not, I try to find something else. That may not always be possible in al genres, but it's worth striving for.
When I watched the videos my first reaction was "Not at all what I was picturing when I listened" Your music is good and to me it sounds like you should be wearing flashy outfits, glitter, whatever, and moving to the music. Choreographed movements would be great, but at least moving. If your music doesn't make you move, it probably won't make the audience move either. I would think that upping the stage show would help considerably even if you decide not to change up the set list. I would love it if the audience were just there to appreciate our great playing ability, but I think that is definitely not the case. My personal philosophy on club bands is that song selection is that song selection is most important, good stage show is a very close second, and everything else is icing. (assuming at least a reasonable level of musicianship). You guys have a lot of talent. I would actually be encouraged, because if you wanted to you make a huge amount of improvement in a very short time. Stage presence can be improved almost overnight, if you make it a priority

 

[hbarcat]

I may be wrong, but if I had to guess, then I'd suspect that a band that plays a fairly even mix of originals and covers is usually a tough sell.

That's been my experience, anyway. I've seen the occasional bands in my area (Chicagoland) that play both originals and covers, and it seems to me they all had problems building a fan base, even if they were highly talented, experienced, and professional.

I just think that the audience for a cover band is too different from the audience for an original band to allow for success when mixing the two together.

 

[Pocket Dave]

I may be wrong, but if I had to guess, then I'd suspect that a band that plays a fairly even mix of originals and covers is usually a tough sell.

That's been my experience, anyway. I've seen the occasional bands in my area (Chicagoland) that play both originals and covers, and it seems to me they all had problems building a fan base, even if they were highly talented, experienced, and professional.

I just think that the audience for a cover band is too different from the audience for an original band to allow for success when mixing the two together.

My experience has been audiences like songs they recognize, regardless. Still, local bands who mix originals along the same lines as the personal stamp they put on their version of covers seem to have better luck with it. One local band that's quite popular doing so that you can check out on YouTube is Jason Elmore and Hoodoo Witch.

I'm in DFW, BTW.

 

[pepj]

You can be a very very competent band and lose out to the 'banger' bands that can't play by comparison if on the wrong ground.

Was at a gig recently..not there to see the band ..and they were not a good band by any stretch. Sounded poor, vocals pitchy, no groove and playing by numbers.
But they played their hearts out and wheeled out the usual.
Don't think anyone else took any notice but they are on the circuit so getting gigs.
So, yep, the set list is a 'leveller'..
I wish it wasn't so...but it is for these $400 bands.

 

[pepj]

Like that clip.... but even they need to pick their gigs, imv.
I can see them working at a boogie dance gig and maybe a chilled listening gig.
I would think they'd be able to read the gig and adjust..which is a valid skill.

I have a band that kills 'sit-downs' at a garden party and we just need 50mins end of set dancers numbers..but avoiding what everyone else plays.

We get that comment a lot..which is nice..but need to find our true niche.

Listening band or dancing band..its tricky.

 

[LiptonJigglers]

Have you ever heard of Negation of Negation?
The old gives way to the new but the new arises from the old...

I think that's what's happening here.
Something new must arise from the old because the old has outlived its conditions.

Cherish the memories but move forward.

 

[mambo4]

First impression: For a funk-groove-dance-ish type band, the only one moving around onstage is the lead singer.

Yeah the band doesn't look as good or fun as it sounds, onstage.
Many otherwise great bands falter on this.

There's a fella Tom Jackson Who has made a living as a live music producer. ( I think he mostly does Worship Music now.)
what he really is is a stage presence consultant. His videos are mostly marketing but he drops quite a few nuggets

I heard and interview with Tom years ago on the CD baby DIY musicians podcast.. It really sold me on the idea that what you do onstage takes as much consideration as what you play on your instrument. That is, if you are serious about entertaining, and want to leverage everything you can to succeed. We try to sculpt memorable "moments" into our music, we can do the same with our onstage presentation.

A lot of players react to the idea of any kind of conscious planning of the stage show with indignation, they want to be all about the music and believe if we play well enough, that will be enough . which is only true for an audience made up of other musicians. I'll paraphrase the response Tom uses:

"Most bands will spend months, years, writing their material , practicing , crafting, and preparing for a recording, Why would you then get up on stage and just wing it?"

 

[Pocket Dave]

Yeah the band doesn't look as good or fun as it sounds, onstage.
Many otherwise great bands falter on this.

There's a fella Tom Jackson Who has made a living as a live music producer. ( I think he mostly does Worship Music now.)
what he really is is a stage presence consultant. His videos are mostly marketing but he drops quite a few nuggets

I heard and interview with Tom years ago on the CD baby DIY musicians podcast.. It really sold me on the idea that what you do onstage takes as much consideration as what you play on your instrument. That is, if you are serious about entertaining, and want to leverage everything you can to succeed. We try to sculpt memorable "moments" into our music, we can do the same with our onstage presentation.

A lot of players react to the idea of any kind of conscious planning of the stage show with indignation, they want to be all about the music and believe if we play well enough, that will be enough . which is only true for an audience made up of other musicians. I'll paraphrase the response Tom uses:

"Most bands will spend months, years, writing their material , practicing , crafting, and preparing for a recording, Why would you then get up on stage and just wing it?"

It doesn't even necessarily have to be scripted. In my experience, if everyone in the band focuses on connecting with the crowd selflessly, the bond can be quite strong.

By "selflessly" I mean resist the urge to make it a "look at me, me, me" moment and instead, look up, smile, move around, and try to make direct eye contact with everyone in the room. CONNECT.