Double Bass Lower strings are really dull in high positions

[Andrew McGregor]

So, I'm trying to play Bach cello suite #1 at pitch, and really depending on my lower strings to sound decent in thumb position as a result. But they just don't, they're rather dull. Other than changing strings, what can I do to help this? The string height seems just about perfect.

The bass I believe is a Wilfer from the late 1950s, strung with Evah Pirazzis.

 

[rjspear]

The strings are probably just too thick. I think you'd get better results with a thin gauge or even solo strings, but that might create more problems than it solves.

 

[iiipopes]

Welcome to bass. The greater mass of the lower strings means they don't vibrate in partials as well as the higher strings, and so don't develop the overtone structure. This is simply one of the physical characteristics of playing the instrument we do.

It's also another reason that folks use lighter strings, or solo tuned down, or a Spiro E with whatever else for ADG. (The construction of Spiros being multi wound tends to retain some of the flexibility and ability to vibrate in partials, hence overtones, hence more defined sound)

 

[Andrew McGregor]

Um... yes, I have been playing for a while. But this bass has been able to do better, tone-wise, before, even with the Evahs. So I'm specifically asking what I can do to improve it without resorting to changing strings.

 

[chuck norriss]

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[robobass]

How is you're string height? Higher action will also have this effect.

 

[eerbrev]

Um... yes, I have been playing for a while. But this bass has been able to do better, tone-wise, before, even with the Evahs. So I'm specifically asking what I can do to improve it without resorting to changing strings.

play around with your bow: where on the string, how much length, how much weight, and whatever other variables you can think of. take your time and play with all the options until you find a sound that you like. I find, often, that a faster bow with a slightly higher contact point can get me the sound that I want for the cello suites (more baroque sounding) but what i'm looking for may not be what you're looking for. Another option is to look at what where you're playing the notes. sometimes it's better to move back out of thumb position to get the sound you want and figure out the fingerings from there (that's not to say that you need to play it all as close to the nut as possible, but open your options up).

This sounds like more of a technique challenge than a set up issue? dunno, it's you, not me.

 

[Andrew McGregor]

It definitely is a technique challenge, for sure.

The main thing is, I wonder if there is something (move the sound post?) I can do to brighten up my lower strings just a bit, since I know this bass can do it. I had some cracks repaired, and it hasn't been quite the same since. A crack repair shouldn't have done anything much to the sound (nowhere near sound post, bridge or bass bar), so something isn't quite where it was... but what?

 

[Cyoder]

Have you tried shifting out of thumb position on the G and D strings but still keeping the bow close to the bridge?

 

[Andrew McGregor]

This is frustrating... I'm looking for suggestions as to how to brighten up the bass, not technique suggestions. Technique I can take care of myself.

I suspect the sound post placement is off, but can anyone suggest which direction to move it?

 

[DHoss]

From David Gage's site:

Link Removed

"Generally, if the post is moved toward the bridge it gets more focused, brighter with less volume."

 

[uprightben]

You are right to suspect that your post is not in the same position that it was before your crack repair. You can move the post north, towards the bridge, or west, towards the the low strings, or both at the same time. It usually takes some experimenting, and sometimes you find that the post needs to go the opposite way you would have expected to achieve the desired result.

 

[Andrew McGregor]

Ok, so this i weird... I lowered my bridge adjusters about 1/3 of a turn, and all my brightness came back. Question is, why?

 

[JoeyNaeger]

Don't worry about it. If it sounds good, it is good. People spend a lot of time talking about theories in the luthier world. It's a necessary part of that world, but I tend to trust empirical data much more.

 

[iiipopes]

If you lower your bridge, you effectively decrease the angle of the overstand to the overlength (front to back of bridge). Not much, granted, hardly measurable, but some nonetheless. This effectively decreases the downforce or tension on the top. It's not much, but each bass has a sweet spot. Too little tension, and the top doesn't vibrate efficiently. Too much, and it "chokes" out. You may have just relieved the "choking" and found your "sweet spot."

 

[Andrew McGregor]

There's just a little backlash in the adjusters... I suppose if it is sitting on the opposite end of the backlash that could do something. In any case, problem solved, yay.