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Magnets & Copper Wire: A Pickup Building Thread

So ok Different materials change the Eddy currents behavior , what if there is more than just the Flux behavior within the eddy currents?
What if magnetic energy was like light and by using different materials as a filter you could change the color of the light or In The case of Flux you could alter the tone .
(Hypothetically)
Carbon- red
Silver-green
Oxide-blue
 
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Not that I'm thinking of getting one any time soon,...... but are there any winders that people made or bought in this thread?

I made a simple to build winder with off-the-shelf parts here:

Custom fully automated pickup winder build

I have yet to wind anything, but my pickup parts should be arriving this week so hopefully I can test it out soon.
 
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I made some quick clips of my bass this morning. I built a new AlNiCo Sidewinder for it and installed a preamp designed by designed by @Passinwind. I used my Aguilar TH500 as a DI and plugged it into ProTools. The link is to the DropBox folder.

Jer Bass sounds demo

You can read about the new sidewinder here:

Magnets and Copper Wire
 
Well, I can tell you right now what that would sound like. Removing the side poles would make the pickup sound really thin, not unlike a single coil. I guess with most of the action happening around that central blade, it would basically make it similar to a single coil. The added side blades bring the opposite poles closer to the central pole, making them more a part of the magnetic field while also increasing the aperture.

I've done tests with thicker poles. Generally, the more steel on a sidewinder, the more output and bass response you get. This makes sense because you're increasing your inductance. However, I haven't noticed that the added steel reduces the amount of brightness. I haven’t used anything thicker than .125” for a pole. Maybe that’s not enough to affect your treble response. Either way, in this case, it seems that I was able to "tune" the amount of bass in relation to the treble. When I used 3x.125” blades, I don’t remember being as impressed by this pickup.

Another interesting thing I've noticed is that depending on the sidewinders, once you get past a certain wind count, any additional turns of wire have a greater effect on the sound of the pickup. For instance, the difference between say 6000 turns and 6125 turns is a lot more than the difference between 5000 and 6000. I'm guessing that may be because the coil itself is actually getting physically closer to the strings, but I haven't really done any experiments to prove or disprove that theory.

That sounds like an interesting experiment, but these coils have a hot date with epoxy resin tonight! I could try it with my prototype coils, but I'd have to fix one of the leads.



I don't have a gauss meter, and at this stage in my pickup-making career, I really have no excuse for not having one. Then again, I could say that about a lot of things. I did a check with the magnometer on my phone, and it says that it's about 3000ut at the central pole and -1800ut on the side poles. I honestly don't know what that's telling me. I usually just use that meter to tell which pole is north or south.


Forgive my ignorance, but I always thought stainless steel was not magnetic?
 
Bruce, do you have any closeup shots that would show how this works and would you be willing to share?
I understand the gist of the concept,b can't picture the details of how you pulled this off.
Also, was wondering how the oscillating mechanism from a house fan might be able to be modified to accomplish something like this.
One destroyed house fan later,..... I don't think I can make that work.

Sorry it took a while to get back to you on this.....I took some fresh pictures and marked them up.

My coil winder is complicated looking, but the operation is really very simple. I built many of the parts of it from metal, because I have the machinery here to do that. But you could build a version of this machine from mostly wooden frame parts. A few lathe-turned metal pieces.

Here are the main parts: The spindle shaft is driven by the motor on the left, and the face plate, where the bobbin mounts, is on the right.

The large aluminum feed plate moves slowly side to side, driven by the leadscrew assembly below. On the left is a toothed belt drive which turns the leadscrew at exactly 1:16 ratio to the spindle speed. Another toothed belt drives the mechanical rotary counter at 1:1 with the spindle.

IMG_7867BX.jpg


Here's the leadscrew assembly. The leadscrew itself is turned from steel, on a lathe. It has 1"-20tpi Left Hand threads on the left end and 1"-20tpi Right Hand threads on the right end. The center section is a smooth polished cylinder. The black thing in the middle of the leadscrew is a block of Delrin, which is bolted to the aluminum feed plate.

The leadscrew spins within the Delrin block, and the block also slides side to side on the leadscrew, driving the feed plate side to side. The leadscrew stays still, spinning in the two bearings on either end. The whole feed plate assembly moves left and right, riding on the leadscrew.

Under the leadscrew is the drive bar. It's attached to the bottom of the Delrin block on a pivot pin at the center. At each end of the drive bar is a small brass tooth which can engage the threads on the leadscrew. A link at one end connects the drive bar to the wooden control bar underneath. The control bar is also mounted on a center pivot, and rocks left and right through a small angle. Rocking the control bar pulls on the link, which rocks the drive bar.

IMG_7869BX.jpg


Here's a close up of the brass tooth on the end of the drive bar. When it comes up and engages the threads of the leadscrew, it pulls the whole feed plate sideways. At a steady, precise rate.

IMG_7872BX.jpg


Pressing down lightly on the right side of the control bar raises the left end of the drive bar, engaging the tooth, and causing the mechanism to feed to the left.

IMG_7870BX.jpg


Pressing on the left side of the control bar makes it feed to the right. With no pressure on either side, neither tooth is engaged and it doesn't feed either way.

IMG_7871BX.jpg


Attached to the feed plate is a horizontal steel shaft, with a Delrin wheel at the end. The magnet wire feeds off the spool, through the tensioner, around the underside of the Delrin wheel, and up onto the bobbin. I built the wheel into the machine to make sure that the magnet wire doesn't get tightly bent or rubbed in its path from the spool to the bobbin. The Delrin wheel has a deep V-groove around its edge, and it spins freely on the shaft.

Here the wheel has moved most of the way to the right.


IMG_7875BX.jpg


And here it has moved most of the way to the left. The feed bar can be adjusted in position on the plate, to bring the wheel up close to whatever size bobbin I'm winding.

IMG_7874B.jpg


The whole point of this mechanism is that it provides a constant feed rate. With every revolution of the spindle, the feed wheel moves sideways exactly 0.0031". It's always that same 0.0031"/rev at any rpm that the spindle is running. That 0.0031" feed rate is a product of the 1:16 belt drive ratio, and the 20 tpi threads on the leadscrew. Why did I make it 0.0031"? Because magnet wire in the 40awg to 42awg range is all right around....0.0022" to 0.0030" diameter. My machine is designed to do tight, even winds, putting each wire wrap in close against the previous wrap. Like a screw thread. That's intentional.

This machine basically has a fixed feed rate. It always feeds the wire at a constant rate, left or right, any spindle speed. My hand on the control bar simply changes the direction of the feed, left or right, instantly.

That's why I call this a semi-automatic coil winder. While I'm winding a coil, I'm watching it carefully, and reversing the direction when the wraps reach the bobbin flange on either side. I watch to get an even buildup, and I can easily do a little back-and-forth to build up any low spot that I see.

If I wanted to go to a faster feed rate, I'd have to change the toothed pulleys in the belt drive. Which I could do, if I ever want to. But I haven't seen any need to so far. I design all of my pickups to be tight-wound, compact coils. I'm not into sloppy scatter-wound coils.

I designed and built this machine in 2004, and it's worked very well for me. I've used it to wind the pickups for every bass I've built since then. It's allowed me to push farther into Hi-Fi type pickups, and other obscure types.

This machine is bigger and more complicated than it needs to be. Back then, I wanted it to be very flexible and capable of winding all sizes of bobbins. Now, I understand better what sizes of bobbins I'll be working with.

I recently acquired a cute little antique variable speed motor rig that's just itching to be made into a cool machine. I may build a smaller simpler coil winder from it, sized for my standard bobbin sizes. It would be a similar leadscrew feed mechanism.
 
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And in case you were wondering, when I first built my coil winder, it was Full Automatic. Here's an old picture of the leadscrew mechanism back then.

IMG_2952B.jpg


It's the same leadscrew, feed plate, and drive bar. The drive bar is pulled down by an electric solenoid on the right side, countering against a spring on the left side. The actuation of the solenoid would select between feeding left or feeding right. Two limit switches were mounted to the feed plate and rode along with it. Their levers would contact those two horizontal adjustable screws.

A cool idea, and it generally worked. But in practice, I found that it was fussy to get the stops set just right. Each coil didn't take very long to wind, and I found that it was easier to just touch the limit switches with my fingers to make the feed reverse where I wanted it to. And the sound of the solenoid was annoying. So, I ripped that all out and went with the wooden manual control bar.
 
Thanks for sharing Bruce!

It's brilliant because the manual aspect lets you self adjust. I often wonder for people who have 100% automatic winders, (especially those driven by a cam or other mechanism where manual interference isn't easily possible), what do you do if something is a tiny bit out of alignment, or a little uneven, and the coil wire starts piling up unevenly? With yours you can just bump it back and forth a few times on the low spot to make it even again.
 
Thanks for sharing Bruce!

It's brilliant because the manual aspect lets you self adjust. I often wonder for people who have 100% automatic winders, (especially those driven by a cam or other mechanism where manual interference isn't easily possible), what do you do if something is a tiny bit out of alignment, or a little uneven, and the coil wire starts piling up unevenly? With yours you can just bump it back and forth a few times on the low spot to make it even again.

In theory, the whole point of 100% auto feed mechanism is that it won’t pile up on one side or be uneven. In practice, at least with my own winder, I have stopped the machine halfway through the cycle, recalibrated, and continued on with the wind. It’s a hassle, and something I generally try to avoid. That being said, I’ve been using my winder for a few years now, and I know it’s quirks well enough so that I don’t have to worry about making uneven coils or wire piling up on one end.
 
Yes, I put a lot of design and development work into my coil winder to minimize failures. I don't like ruining coils and having to cut the wire off. I want to wind my coils accurately and consistently, every time. Three main things I worked on:
  • Not breaking or damaging the wire! I made a short, smooth, non-kinking path from the spool to the bobbin. The Delrin feed wheel was a big help. I made a good simple friction tensioner, and I found that 25 grams of drag is the right number to adjust it to. I can get nice tight coils up to 1200 rpm, with no breakage. The 41 ga wire that I use breaks at about 35 grams.
  • Even layering, filling all the way out to the flanges, no big lumps or loose swells. I found that the manual control bar was the most reliable way to do this. I watch every coil as it's winding, and directly control the reversals and filling. Doing it full-automatic was too troublesome. Too many failures to get it dialed in.
  • Eliminate loose loops of wire over the flanges. When you try to fill the wire turns right up against the flange, the wire can catch on the corners of the flange and make a loose loop. Often you can't see them until you are finished winding. And the coil is ruined. I made up aluminum Spool Flanges, below. They eliminated the loose loops problem.
Here are the Spool Flanges. They are machined aluminum discs that the bobbin clamps between. In the face of each disc is a recess that the bobbin's flange fits in to. The face of each disk is chamfered and polished at the outer edge. Assembled on the spindle, they form a neat smooth spool that the wire can't catch on. I can fill the wire into the corner of the bobbin with no loose loops.

IMG_2996B.jpg


The spool flanges and bobbin are held to the spindle flange by a single 10-32 machine screw. There are also two steel pins on the spindle flange which drive the inner spool flange.

IMG_2997B.jpg


Note the tight, smooth wind. That's what the leadscrew feed does. Also, look how close I run the feed wheel to the bobbin. As close as possible.

IMG_2998B.jpg


Overall, this machine has been very reliable winding coils. After the initial development shakedown, I rarely ruin a coil. Maybe 5 in almost 15 years of winding. And they were freak accidents. Bobbins coming apart, wire snapping on the spool, etc.

I normally wind at about 1000 rpm; 5-6 minutes per coil.
 
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I finally received all my bits and pieces and was able to run my first coil on my Custom fully automated pickup winder build.

This single coil blade coil was the first thing I ever wound on the new winder so I was fully expecting all sorts of issues along the way, but for some inexplicable reason it all went flawlessly! Here is the finished bobbin:
finished_bobbin.jpg


Pretty tight, just like I was hoping for! The coil is 3,832 turns and measures just 1.95 mm (about 5/64") thick. That should put it all pretty close to the ceramic bar magnet and give me a nice clean sound. Also, for the geeky, my math says that works out to about 94% fill factor, which is better than I could have hoped for a first go.

Also, for the first time ever, the winder said "FiniShEd"!
finished_message.jpg


Here is a view of the first layer zoomed way in:
first_layer_zoom.jpg


That was wound using the typical 0.071 mm diameter referenced for 42 AWG wire, but based on the small gaps I reduced it slightly to 0.070 mm to try to get it a little tighter.

Looking forward to testing it out!
 
Due to some weird issues printing large flat surfaces perpendicular to the print head, I did a little redesign of the covers on my Wal-style multicoil pickups:


Kinda fits in aesthetically with some triple coils I've been doing. Some more variations here, with bamboo, gold metallic, and silver metallic inserts for the covers, and shoing both zinc-plated and black-oxide-coated pole screws:
 

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