Main melody and Bass line relation

[belzebass]

Hello!
I'm playing this ballad where there's a guitar playing arpeggios, percussion going square beat, and bass plays a complimentary improvised melody to the vocal part (yay, bass solo for 5 minutes straight ).

So here the question: when the vocal melody is going higher and with more intensity/tension, what do you do: go higher too or, on the contrary, do you go lower?
And why?
Any good examples of this? Of bass playing strongly off the vocal melody?

 

[Torrente Cro]

Hello!
I'm playing this ballad where there's a guitar playing arpeggios, percussion going square beat, and bass plays a complimentary improvised melody to the vocal part (yay, bass solo for 5 minutes straight ).

So here the question: when the vocal melody is going higher and with more intensity/tension, what do you do: go higher too or, on the contrary, do you go lower?
And why?
Any good examples of this? Of bass playing strongly off the vocal melody?

Good question!
I usually just move from chord to chord but I would like to learn some different approach.

 

[MalcolmAmos]

Yes that is a good question. Here is how I would answer your question. But, first lets get a little theory working.

If the melody line, lets call this the treble clef, and the bass clef share some notes you get harmony. Its the sharing of notes that let's the two lines harmonize and sound good.

Say the song is in the key of C. Treble (melody) notes would be taken from the scale of C. And the harmonizing chords would be taken from the chords in the Key of C. Chords are made by stacking 3rds of the scale, i.e. every other notes in the scale. The C, E, G notes for the C chord. D, F, A for the Dm chord and E, G, B for the Em chord, etc.

See how the C, Dm and Em chords harmonize the lower area of the tune that is in the key of C. Should add this; the C, F and G chords are the major chords in the key of C; and as this is a song in a major key they are your structure (most used) chords. The Dm, Em, and Am chords are the minor chords or your flavor chords. Simple sticks with the structure chords and as you get fancy the flavor chords can come into play. Moving on...

C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C.

While the tune is in the C, E, G area the C major chord would harmonize that part of the melody as you would have a sharing of the notes thus harmonization. As the tune went up scale and moved from the C, E, G area we need to find a chord that has some of the new melody notes. The F major chord F, A, C pretty well cover the rest of the C scale, so the C and F chord probably will be the most used chords if the song is in the key of C. The G chord would be used as a climax or move to resolution chord. Most music is built around this sharing of notes and the resolution pull of the V to I chords. If you keep this in mind you can assume what the next chord probably will be. Probably....

So yes when I'm jamming and the song goes up scale I go up with the IV chord; and when it goes back down I'd grab the C tonic chord. That G dominant chord will come in a couple of times in a verse and usually falls just before the verse is ending. As the verse's thought is coming to an end you need to end this verse with a V-I chord - returning to rest so a new verse - new thought - can start.

So yes if the tune goes up scale, find a chord that uses notes that are up scale from what you have been playing. The vi chord or Am chord is used in this way quite a lot. Good question...

Have fun.

One more thing. How many shared notes are necessary for harmony to happen?
One per measure. That is why we can pound out just the root and it sounds good.
Two per measure will sound better, this is why the R-5 or R-3 (3b) works so well.
Three per measure is probably not needed. It's like gravy, if you like gravy pour it on...

Question; Cmaj7 instead of C what's the advantage of the 4 note chord?

 

[vickerekes]

My experience is that you'll find our lower register will allow for bigger intervals to be heard melodically, and you'll have more liberty (line, rhythm, range, etc.) using the most consonant tones of any given chord in the progression (usually mostly pentatonic) rather than tracking the actual melody too tightly.
As for going higher with the melody: your choice... you can play the counterpoint, going down as the line ascends, or play a more parallel line - whichever you think sounds better in the mix.

 

[belzebass]

As for going higher with the melody: your choice... you can play the counterpoint, going down as the line ascends, or play a more parallel line - whichever you think sounds better in the mix.

I played it going higher and lower to listen how it goes. In this song the melody is rather sparse, so I mostly hit nice fat root on 1, let ring and play in the spaces of vocal melody (I'm trying to do a second line vocal line ) so going up when the melody goes up doesn't clash and sounds more natural.

 

[MalcolmAmos]

My experience is that you'll find our lower register will allow for bigger intervals to be heard melodically, and you'll have more liberty (line, rhythm, range, etc.) using the most consonant tones of any given chord in the progression (usually mostly pentatonic) rather than tracking the actual melody too tightly.
As for going higher with the melody: your choice... you can play the counterpoint, going down as the line ascends, or play a more parallel line - whichever you think sounds better in the mix.

As it relates to this subject I seldom use a pentatonic scale and rely upon chord tones for my bass line. A few words on using the pentatonic scale would be appreciated. Would we just drop into a groove using the tonic pentatonic's notes? Is that done? Major R-2-3-5-6 or minor R-b3-4-5-b7 pretty well covers this matching or sharing of notes.

How, where and when would you be using the pentatonic scale - in your bass line. I understand the use in improvising a melody line, but, this is something I have not used.

Your thoughts will be appreciated.

 

[vickerekes]

Usually the pentatonic notes of the given chord in a progression are most the consonant (make for the least amount of dissonance) as the chords are played: I = 12356 of the key scale, ii = 23461, etc.. In the key of C major, as the root chord is being played one would tend to avoid the notes F (4th of the chord) and B (7th of the chord), which are most dissonant. The root and octaves are most consonant, the 5th of the chord (and octaves of the note) next, then (for the major chord) the 3rd and 6th of the chord. Which is (as you wrote, MalcolmAmos) major R-2-3-5-6 or minor R-b3-4-5-b7 of the given chord, the same notes and concept said differently.
Counterpoint is a whole new ball of wax - you might want to look that up...

 

[BassChuck]

It's your choice, that's what makes it art. Lot's of good suggestions here, take them all to heart. Experiment and see how you react musically to all the different choices. But remember, there are a lot of different choices and each one should have a slightly different feel. Judge for yourself the quality and impact of each choice. Plan them out for the whole song. Remember from HS English class the form of argumentative essay? Start strong (but not your strongest) follow with the weaker ideas growing to the end where you use your strongest idea. Good music is a flow of energy. Support that energy. Keep in mind this basic rule: Anything that is repetitive is boring, anything that is constantly different is annoying, Art lives in between.

 

[MalcolmAmos]

It's your choice, that's what makes it art. Lot's of good suggestions here, take them all to heart. Experiment and see how you react musically to all the different choices. But remember, there are a lot of different choices and each one should have a slightly different feel. Judge for yourself the quality and impact of each choice. Plan them out for the whole song. Remember from HS English class the form of argumentative essay? Start strong (but not your strongest) follow with the weaker ideas growing to the end where you use your strongest idea. Good music is a flow of energy. Support that energy. Keep in mind this basic rule: Anything that is repetitive is boring, anything that is constantly different is annoying, Art lives in between.

+1.

 

[JamPlay]

Traditional counterpoint would have you go in an opposite direction. Take the bridge to George Harrisons "Something". Melody line goes up, bass goes down, landing on the 3rd of the IV chord or the II major depending on how you look at it. Melodically speaking for the bass the 3rd is a solid and beautiful note. Take James Jamersons bassline on Reach Out I'll Be There by the Four Tops. The vocal sings Reach Out, then ascends to another Reach Out. Jamerson heads south landing on a 3rd, then ascending to a 5th. For bass, when you depart or arrive on a note other than the root of a chord you have melody. Best advice for coming up with a line to compliment or even duet with a vocal melody, is to sing what comes naturally in your head. A theoretical approach can follow. I'm sure it will be interesting, and serve the song well. That is why you thought of the line in the first place, right?
While playing this line, don't forget to groove. Your rhythmic flair is what's recognized almost more than the notes you chose.