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Markbass Super Synth

#541
Sorry for being so late in my reaction to Gastric's and Wolffman's excellent exchange, but as I used to play keys, I have to agree wholeheartedly with Wolffman's assessment regarding the multiple keyboards one had to lug about.

Even today, there is no software synth which does it all, and so one *still* has to lug multiple keyboards/modules around, or run more than one on a laptop.

I love my "modular synth" effect pedalboard, and although I've thought about getting a bunch of these pedals rehouse into one master pedalboard, I'm okay with the bike chain link attachment system to keep everything in one place... and to be able to swap out "modules" more easily than a rehoused all-in-one. The only thing that's painful is taking a moment to remember how much each individual "module" cost me, and the total cost of the "modular" approach... ouch!
 
#542
The general lack of responses from markbass is really disappointing as a product owner- you’d think that from a business standpoint they would value customer service and feed back a little more. Their lack of customer interaction is nonsensical- especially considering musicians tend to be very brand loyal if they’ve had a positive experience imo. Even if MB didn’t updated, some communication would go a long way- for example an email back, popping into a forum and acknowledging some of the problems, or offering advice on how to work within the given parameters of the pedal.

Regarding the Super Synth- I’ve found it very useful for certain applications and pretty poor for others. As Gastric noted the sounds on it are killer- personally I utilize the markbass for the same reason- It’s got a very thick aggressive modern sound in some settings. I’ve accepted its current limitations while still hoping an update will make it more useable. You just have to work around it‘s quarks and work with its strengths. I found the majority of preloaded presets to be kind of bland- the only three I’ve kept are 1,2, & 7. The patches I created or got from other users are more diverse- some without a filter sweep and a tight gated staccato sound, up sweeps, gastrics approximated down filter sweep, thick detuned patch, one with a lot of clean blend, etc.

Personally flexibility the software gives outweighs the inability to tweak settings live; I haven’t found any situation I’ve wanted to make adjustments on stage.

To Kwesi’s question- I’ve never used a deep impact, but I do know Marc Brownstein of the Disco Biscuits used to have the DI and is now using the MBSS in his project Conspirator. I find the tracking to be sufficient- just don’t try and play really fast lines. Although some users can not live with this flaw I’ve accepted it- similar to how a lot of tbr’s love the oc-2 but wouldn’t ever consider playing an open E with it.
 
#543
I was so dissapointed with it I returned it. I used the PC app to program it and I know how to program an analog synth. The ADSR is just not an ADSR. You cannot set the attack fast enough to play tight eighth notes. For example you cannot get a click sound for attack. The ADSR just will not go there.
Also the "filter" is not a real filter. You can pull it down to minimum and there is still higher harmonic content- it does not go low enough frequency wise to be called a real filter IMO.
I found the tracking to be OK. Acceptable. Just turn down the treble on your bass and play with the neck pup if you have one. If they fixed those two issues I think they would have a great synth. It does not sound like they care though. Probably not enough profit in it.
 
#544
BassMan99 said:
You cannot set the attack fast enough to play tight eighth notes. For example you cannot get a click sound for attack. The ADSR just will not go there.
Also the "filter" is not a real filter. You can pull it down to minimum and there is still higher harmonic content- it does not go low enough frequency wise to be called a real filter IMO.
Click to expand...

Jives with my general complaints. The thing simply doesn't have enough filter control, and not a fast enough filter retrigger to be able to trip the trigger on fast, consecutive notes. Note it's not ADSR, it's simply an envelope tracking filter with a couple speed (attack/release) and depth controls (filter dynamic/envelope). Which should be adequate, really, if they worked better. And provided some decent down-sweep capabilities.
 
#545
BassMan99 said:
I was so dissapointed with it I returned it. I used the PC app to program it and I know how to program an analog synth. The ADSR is just not an ADSR. You cannot set the attack fast enough to play tight eighth notes. For example you cannot get a click sound for attack. The ADSR just will not go there.
Also the "filter" is not a real filter. You can pull it down to minimum and there is still higher harmonic content- it does not go low enough frequency wise to be called a real filter IMO.
I found the tracking to be OK. Acceptable. Just turn down the treble on your bass and play with the neck pup if you have one. If they fixed those two issues I think they would have a great synth. It does not sound like they care though. Probably not enough profit in it.
Click to expand...

That's exactly the impression I get. I have owned the pedal since it was released at the end of 2009, and am still awaiting an update. There are a few niggling issues (which for me do not include tracking) that could so easily be fixed. They don't seem to listen to suggestions at all - removal of dry signal completely, a few different waveforms etc. I love the pedal, it is, imo, the best synth pedal I have owned, but it could be the be all and and all. It is disappointing when you compare with Eventide for example. Constant updates for my factors, all with useful new features. They listen to customers, and give an ongoing and very rewarding experience with their products, rather than taking the money and running.
 
#548
im still finding use for my ss, and after much work even the octaver aspect.

thankfully the software now seems compatible with mac osx lion, so im able to use it again. for a while after an upgrade it stopped working.
 
#549
yes, it is a really great synth pedal ... I love the computer interface- it has a lot of flexibility, and IMO with so many parameters it makes so much more sense to me to have it laid out nicely instead of scrolling through tons of menus etc. It’s also a very thick, aggressive, modern sound. A lot of synths have that 80’s sound and the MBSS is not at all.

I'd love to try get a deep impact- but I can't part with $700 bones for one. Clay Parnell of brothers past has one patch that sounds amazing- it's got a lot of movement, and almost no filter sweep.
 
#551
BassMan99 said:
its great if all you play is Legato......................
Click to expand...

I disagree entirely, I think it is well suited for slap, more than the BMS and OS(with -1 octave) IMHO. Messing with the trigger on and trigger off control I can get great tracking in staccato and slap playing. My quick action patches do have a level between quick slap staccato and lagatto that doesn't work well, they seem best with real quick or slow not great in between. Perhaps raise the trigger levels and mess with some quick tasty slap action and you'll change your mind.

I admit I have to focus on my finger dynamics a bit but the way it responds to slapping gets me very excited every time I play through it.

I'm digging the pedal so much I wish FunkintheTrunk never let me borrow it for now I have yet another filter at the top of my to save for list.
 
#552
I'm one of the few that disliked the Markbass. No downswept filter (huge buzzkill), no real way to provide a barely moving filter and still retain any type of envelope retrigger, and the envelope retrigger was maddeningly difficult to work with when playing consecutive 8th notes at any reasonable bpm. At least for my skills.

I like to point to 1990's technology that could do all that, albiet without the clear, crisp modern sound of the Markbass.
 
#554
I found it to be possible to play pretty fast staccato using very precise technique. It is a pedal that you have to dig into the software and set up according to your playing style to make it work, though. I ultimately sold mine to Wolfman (who coincidentally has one on sale in the TB classifieds right now), because of the lack of downsweep, expression control, and multiple waveforms (seriously, why have three oscillators and only have one waveform?). However, I do believe I would get one again before paying $800 for a used DI.
 
#555
I gotta admit. I love mine. Yeah, it is not without flaws, but what in our gear collection isn't? I think the key is finding out how to work with those flaws or work around them. I have been able to get great tracking and note to note clarity on faster runs. The key for me is playing very clean and precise. Right hand and left hand muting is the key. If you have any sympathetic resonation, it will kill the pedals ability to track the actual notes you want to play.

The slower tracking works perfect for me though. I tend to be right on or just a tad ahead of the beat, so it really creates a nice pocket when I step on it. That said, I also only use patch #1 all night and it is great. I have a separate octave pedal and the Source Audio BEF that I combine with at times and get some great sounds.

I used to play the Akai MiniAK live but I got tired of lugging extra gear and not being good at keys didn't help either. We play covers like GaGa, Beyonce, some Hip Hop.. ya know, stuff without bass. So, this pedal is great for me.

Anyway, my .02. :bassist:
 
#556
I spent some more time with it last night, and was able to get the filter to retrigger 95% of the time and I played just about as quickly as I could. II took out the computer and messed with the note on/off settings and the envelope controls. I also did do some comparisons with my tone wide open, neck and bridge pickups, played over the bridge pickup and the markbass missed what seemed like almost every other note, then I rolled the tone all the way back, used only the neck pickup, played up on the fretboard and the tracking was noticeably better. My strings are also nice and dead- pretty much rubber bands, which removes a lot of the harmonic content. It’s not perfect, but we all have our idea of what’s “good enough”. Depending on how you like your strings, how you interact with your strings, and how you set up your pickups can have night and day differences in tracking speed.

OhulahanBass said:
I disagree entirely, I think it is well suited for slap, more than the BMS and OS(with -1 octave) IMHO. Messing with the trigger on and trigger off control I can get great tracking in staccato and slap playing. My quick action patches do have a level between quick slap staccato and lagatto that doesn't work well, they seem best with real quick or slow not great in between. Perhaps raise the trigger levels and mess with some quick tasty slap action and you'll change your mind.

I admit I have to focus on my finger dynamics a bit but the way it responds to slapping gets me very excited every time I play through it.
Click to expand...

I tried this too and to my surprise it actually sounded good! I expected there to be huge volume swells, and lots of noise but it actually triggered everything accurately. Nice work picking up on that Ohulahanahanahan na na na na hey hey hey goodbyeBass


Also to Sterl Pearlz point...

M Sterling said:
(seriously, why have three oscillators and only have one waveform?).
Click to expand...

The 3 oscillators set to the same interval make the sound noticeably fatter and more present, but once you set them to something like -12, 0, +12 the sound spans 3 octaves and is much thicker taking up more sonic space. The 3 oscillators also have another use- making double stops & chords. For instance you could have them set to 0, +7, +12 for a power chord, or -12, 0, +7, or -7, 0, +12 for different inversions. You could also set them for a minor chord 0, +3, +7, or for an inversions -3, 0, +7, & -7, -3, +12. Mess with the fine detuning settings and there is a lot going on in one patch. To my understanding there isn’t another synth bass pedal that can do this- you’d need a pog2 after a synth pedal to achieve something similar.
 
#557
wolffman said:
I tried this too and to my surprise it actually sounded good! I expected there to be huge volume swells, and lots of noise but it actually triggered everything accurately. Nice work picking up on that Ohulahanahanahan na na na na hey hey hey goodbyeBass.
Click to expand...


Sweet. With the SS if you can slap, spank or pluck your bass you can play quick key style synth leads! I also like programming 9th chords in the octaves.

I gigged the SS last night, flipped on a low voiced patch 7 half way through one of those funky breaks were everyone in the band plays a tight acceding line, I instantly got hollers, hands and jumps from the crowd.

Only extra complaint I have after gigging is it is to current hungry to be powered by a Trex Chameleon and requires a walwart. This is a small clutter/ extra thing to plug in complaint though and can be fixed with a different power supply.
 
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#558
My recollection was that the envelope control that's at the top right in the software was the key to the envelope action of the pedal. However, the actual envelope parameters towards the bottom of the software page were where you really wanted to control the envelope. However, the top envelope control was what was really controlling the overall envelope performance and you had to have it up fairly high to get any decent envelope retrigger/detection. Unfortunately that also forced the overall envelope to always shoot the filter really high. So there was no way to get any type of subtle envelope movement and retain good envelope retrigger.

The unit sounded great. I just couldn't personally get the envelope behavior and retrigger I wanted. Going off memory as I no longer own one.
 
#559
I spent the last 2 nights with the Super Synth because I was anticipating selling it. Since first readingh about this unit one major gripe a lot of people had is the ‘inability to dial out the dry signal’ although it has never been very noticeable or bothersome to me… All of my presets except one were always keep the mix at fully wet which was close enough for me.

Upon some recent listening to the Brothers Past I realized part of Clay Parnell’s synth sound is the dry tones underneath the synth, so the fundamental still hits with some umph. He has a relatively small board with a modded OC-2, OC3, some type of overdrive/fuzz, a GEB-7, and a Deep Impact. His sound is really superb- you can stream samples of his sounds at the “Everything Must Go” series Link Removed the track Dead Clowns has a sweet synth bass part that kicks in around 6:30. Also the beginning of Dressed Up Worn Down is stellar.

Anyway this got me thinking about my fuzz tones and how I like them much better with a clean blend running into them too (especially with the OC-2 on)- so last night I started putting the mix down in the 7-15 range rather than the 55-63 range (mix goes from 0-63 on the super synth) and VOILA! Instantly got more interesting sounds; they were much deeper and has a layered sound. I also messed with only using 1 oscillator rather than all three and the synth sounded tighter- not as thick… but tighter. Using one oscillator and detuning that against the dry sound produced some crisp thicker sounds too. I was also able to get better sounds with the envelope after tweaking more and more, now that I’m only using the neck pickup playing up by the neck I find the tracking to be very spot on. I used to play exactly the same but also had the bridge pickup on... the difference is larger than I ever would’ve expected. So here I am back in lust with the super synth. Also I love the ability to save as many patches as I want on the computer.
 
#560
ive had a pretty similar experience keeping a bit of a clean signal mixed in. the layered sounds are deeper and pretty interesting and still uniquely expressive. i never really had too much trouble with the clean/wet mix either, as you can dial the clean pretty far down if you want.

this is also what helped me find some decent tones using the octaver. (can't make the octaver sound anywhere near as full as the oc2, but to my ear its much better than say the mxr)
 

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