Master Effects Owners Society

[gwangi]

Somebody please keep an update on this, my Super Forty is due this week so I'm kind of concerned.

 

[Sensei Tim]

I got your email. im at work and don't have access to headphones right now and will listen to it tonight.

just a general comment re: the EQ. the high and low eqs are shelving EQs, not peak. if you turn the bass freq all the way clockwise so it's at the highest frequency and then turn the gain up to +15dB do you not hear any difference?

same with the high shelf, if you turn the freq down to the lowest setting and then crank the boost to +15db are you not hearing any difference?

what is your mid EQ set to?

you definitely should be able to hear a significant difference with those hi and low settings.

T

 

[willot07]

I got your email. im at work and don't have access to headphones right now and will listen to it tonight.

just a general comment re: the EQ. the high and low eqs are shelving EQs, not peak. if you turn the bass freq all the way clockwise so it's at the highest frequency and then turn the gain up to +15dB do you not hear any difference?

same with the high shelf, if you turn the freq down to the lowest setting and then crank the boost to +15db are you not hearing any difference?

what is your mid EQ set to?

you definitely should be able to hear a significant difference with those hi and low settings.

T

Just tried again a minute ago. With the highs, there's a slight difference if I completely crank it to the max and it gets a bit muddier if I turn it down fully. With the lows, I'm positive that there's no difference. I've got the high frequency set to 4 kHz and the lows set to 180 Hz.

In the videos I sent over, the mid frequency was set to noon, but I've been setting it to 2 kHz for the most part and I've tried the other frequencies on all knobs as well.

 

[Sensei Tim]

if you go bass -> super 40 -> into the front of the amp or super 40 -> interface is there any change?

 

[willot07]

No, not really. Maybe there's a little bit more low-end in general when it goes into the front of the amp? But that would be it.

 

[JackTheRipper]

No, not really. Maybe there's a little bit more low-end in general when it goes into the front of the amp? But that would be it.

Are you using the Ric-o-Sound output jack or the MONO output jack? What's the position of the pickup switch and volume/tone knobs? I haven't tried the mono output because that's not how I plan to use it. I hope to have time to try that tonight.

--jack

 

[willot07]

I'm using the Rick-O-Sound output jack with the Super Forty through the bridge pickup mainly, occasionally with a second Super Forty through the neck pickup as well. The volume and tone knobs are both maxed too. I haven't given the mono output a go either, I'll probably experiment with that tomorrow as well.

 

[Diamond.Jig]

I've been trying all sorts of combinations and still not getting much out of the SF. Different basses too, even with no bass plugged in the noise level is high when the SF is engaged, you also get very loud clicking noise when engaging the pedal or other switches with nothing plugged in.

 

[Sensei Tim]

I've been trying all sorts of combinations and still not getting much out of the SF. Different basses too, even with no bass plugged in the noise level is high when the SF is engaged, you also get very loud clicking noise when engaging the pedal or other switches with nothing plugged in.

please send me a video of this noise and clicking.

I'm not sure how you're getting noise with no bass plugged in as the input is grounded when there is no instrument plugged into it.

 

[Sensei Tim]

I'm using the Rick-O-Sound output jack with the Super Forty through the bridge pickup mainly, occasionally with a second Super Forty through the neck pickup as well. The volume and tone knobs are both maxed too. I haven't given the mono output a go either, I'll probably experiment with that tomorrow as well.

No, not really. Maybe there's a little bit more low-end in general when it goes into the front of the amp? But that would be it.

ok i watched the videos and here are my thoughts:

EQs - the lo and hi are shelving EQs, not peak like the mid. in your vid you had the frequency for the shelving videos at around noon and then boosted and cut each. the way that shelving filters work is that everything above the cutoff frequency setting is boosted or cut for the high band and everything below the frequency setting is boosted/cut for the low band. you won't hear a huge boost/cut or resonance like you do with the mids. see this for more detail on shelving filters

gain - that is how the schematic shows the gain stage in both the 1978 and 1981 versions. both use a 10k log pot. If the original is not like this then they were using a log pot with a different taper (which wouldn't be surprising given that they were using parts from 40+ years ago that probably aren't available anymore) and/or they were using larger 24mm pots vs 16mm which gives you a bit more control when you rotate them - larger sweep radius for the same amount of rotation.

distortion - it is a very subtle effect. the schematics show the FX loop insert between the gain stage and the low and hi EQ controls. with nothing plugged in the send and return are shorted and the signal passes. the distortion mod outlined in the manual says to connect a pair of 1N914 silicon diodes in an antiparallel configuration from the tip to gnd of the send jack. this results in a very common hard clipping configuration. I tried all of the diodes that i have at home - bav99 (currently what's in there now), 1N4148, 1N914, BAT41, BAT46, D9E germanium and 1N34a germanium and there was NO significant difference between any of them.

 

[willot07]

Hey all, thought I'd make an update as to where I'm at with the Super Forty:

I've managed to get it sounding like I want it to! I've found that you really have to be careful with how much you turn the knobs, and each of the knobs affects the others significantly more than most other pedals I've tried - for example, fiddling around with the high knob can actually affect how much output the low sends out, which is probably why I had such a tough time with it before.. I've set the input to LOW per JackTheRipper's advice which I definitely recommend doing - it's helped a lot with getting where I wanted to be. The pedals are still a bit noisy too but it's not too big of a deal, as I just slapped a noise gate onto the track and that rectifies the issue for the most part. I think the noise is probably something that can't be helped and is just in the nature of the unit, but it's simple to address.

I'm still of the mind that while the EQ does function differently to a lot of other EQs (as mentioned by Sensei Tim) it still does feel a bit unresponsive, but that's the nature of the game I suppose. The distortion is significantly affected by the EQ (namely the mids) and how the gain is set - I can certainly tell the difference at this point but the difference is basically nonexistent when using a different setting to what I'm using now. The distortion is switched on when flipped up and off when flipped down. I've managed to find the sweet spot between clean and punch you in the face distortion by very carefully playing with the gain knob and it does end up being quite a punchy drive which I'm a big fan of.

I've been running an EBS Multicomp before and a Boss GE-7B after the Super Forty to help get some thicker tones (stuff like the tones on Moving Pictures), and just switching the two off for earlier Rush stuff (Like Hemispheres) and it sounds pretty spot on. I'm running my Ricky 4003 in Rick-O-Sound so the signal chain looks like this:


Bridge Pickup -> EBS Multicomp -> ME Super Forty -> Boss GE-7B -> Boss LS-2 -> Audio Interface/Fender Rumble 100 FX Return

Neck Pickup -> ME Super Forty -> Boss LS-2 -> Audio Interface/Fender Rumble 100 FX Return



I like having the second Super Forty on the neck pickup just to help thicken the sound and introduce more low end. I only use the LS-2 when playing through the amp to re-blend the two signals as it naturally only has one input, whereas I use two of the inputs on my audio interface and play both pickups through separate tracks.

Overall I'd say I'm absolutely happy and more than satisfied with the Super Forty now, and I'm very very thankful for Tim and Jack going through this with me and helping me better understand what I'm doing. You definitely need to experiment a fair bit but it's a great recreation of the SC-40 and the tone. Playing around with the Super Forty is absolutely key to make it do what you want it to do and this is without a doubt the most unique experience I've had with a pedal, but it's definitely worth it in the end. I hope what I've written down here will help anyone else who's struggling a little bit too.

Again, a big thanks to Tim and Jack for helping out and going through it. Tim's a lovely guy who does great work and I'll definitely stick around for whatever he's cooking up next. Of course I'm afraid for my wallet because I no doubt will be taking more Master Effects pedals on a joyride in the future.

 

[JackTheRipper]

Hey all, thought I'd make an update as to where I'm at with the Super Forty:

I've managed to get it sounding like I want it to! ...snip

That's great news!

Tonight I did some back-to-back testing with an Ashly SC-40 blackface and the Super FORTY. This time I used a PBass and the Rick 4003 in mono mode. The EQ behavior is the same for both basses with both units. The only difference that really stands out is the behavior of the DIST switch on the Super FORTY and the "distortion mod" on the SC-40:

• Changing the DIST switch on the Super FORTY only makes a subtle change. However, the distortion mod on the SC-40 has a very dramatic impact - significantly impacting (dropping) the volume and low freq response and adding a noticeable amount of distortion.

Something that I looked at in particular was the behavior of the GAIN knob on both the Super FORTY and the SC-40 (without the distortion mod). It's the same for both units - low gain until about 8. Then it's very touchy.

Thanks,

--jack

 

[Diamond.Jig]

That's great news!

Tonight I did some back-to-back testing with an Ashly SC-40 blackface and the Super FORTY. This time I used a PBass and the Rick 4003 in mono mode. The EQ behavior is the same for both basses with both units. The only difference that really stands out is the behavior of the DIST switch on the Super FORTY and the "distortion mod" on the SC-40:

• Changing the DIST switch on the Super FORTY only makes a subtle change. However, the distortion mod on the SC-40 has a very dramatic impact - significantly impacting (dropping) the volume and low freq response and adding a noticeable amount of distortion.

Soomething that I looked at in particular was the behavior of the GAIN knob on both the Super FORTY and the SC-40 (without the distortion mod). It's the same for both units - low gain until about 8. Then it's very touchy.

Thanks,

--jack

I've had the distortion switch on the SF act like the SC-40 distortion mod only when maxed out the gain.

 

[grouse789]

Hey all, thought I'd make an update as to where I'm at with the Super Forty:

I've managed to get it sounding like I want it to! I've found that you really have to be careful with how much you turn the knobs, and each of the knobs affects the others significantly more than most other pedals I've tried - for example, fiddling around with the high knob can actually affect how much output the low sends out, which is probably why I had such a tough time with it before.. I've set the input to LOW per JackTheRipper's advice which I definitely recommend doing - it's helped a lot with getting where I wanted to be. The pedals are still a bit noisy too but it's not too big of a deal, as I just slapped a noise gate onto the track and that rectifies the issue for the most part. I think the noise is probably something that can't be helped and is just in the nature of the unit, but it's simple to address.

I'm still of the mind that while the EQ does function differently to a lot of other EQs (as mentioned by Sensei Tim) it still does feel a bit unresponsive, but that's the nature of the game I suppose. The distortion is significantly affected by the EQ (namely the mids) and how the gain is set - I can certainly tell the difference at this point but the difference is basically nonexistent when using a different setting to what I'm using now. The distortion is switched on when flipped up and off when flipped down. I've managed to find the sweet spot between clean and punch you in the face distortion by very carefully playing with the gain knob and it does end up being quite a punchy drive which I'm a big fan of.

I've been running an EBS Multicomp before and a Boss GE-7B after the Super Forty to help get some thicker tones (stuff like the tones on Moving Pictures), and just switching the two off for earlier Rush stuff (Like Hemispheres) and it sounds pretty spot on. I'm running my Ricky 4003 in Rick-O-Sound so the signal chain looks like this:


Bridge Pickup -> EBS Multicomp -> ME Super Forty -> Boss GE-7B -> Boss LS-2 -> Audio Interface/Fender Rumble 100 FX Return

Neck Pickup -> ME Super Forty -> Boss LS-2 -> Audio Interface/Fender Rumble 100 FX Return



I like having the second Super Forty on the neck pickup just to help thicken the sound and introduce more low end. I only use the LS-2 when playing through the amp to re-blend the two signals as it naturally only has one input, whereas I use two of the inputs on my audio interface and play both pickups through separate tracks.

Overall I'd say I'm absolutely happy and more than satisfied with the Super Forty now, and I'm very very thankful for Tim and Jack going through this with me and helping me better understand what I'm doing. You definitely need to experiment a fair bit but it's a great recreation of the SC-40 and the tone. Playing around with the Super Forty is absolutely key to make it do what you want it to do and this is without a doubt the most unique experience I've had with a pedal, but it's definitely worth it in the end. I hope what I've written down here will help anyone else who's struggling a little bit too.

Again, a big thanks to Tim and Jack for helping out and going through it. Tim's a lovely guy who does great work and I'll definitely stick around for whatever he's cooking up next. Of course I'm afraid for my wallet because I no doubt will be taking more Master Effects pedals on a joyride in the future.

If you really want the pure tone of the ME Ashly pedal, run the out of your signal path to the effect return on your amp(if it has an fx loop)
This will bypass your rumbles preamp, and use only the power amp section.
I’m interested in this pedal. I have an sc40. I made the overdrive mod plug. it geds you to pure Geddyland.
however the Ashly preamp is about as squirrelly or difficult to dial in as it sounds this pedal is.
And that has to do with understanding how this complex preamp interacts with each of the frequencies and settings. It takes time to figure it all out. Patience!

 

[willot07]

If you really want the pure tone of the ME Ashly pedal, run the out of your signal path to the effect return on your amp(if it has an fx loop)
This will bypass your rumbles preamp, and use only the power amp section.
I’m interested in this pedal. I have an sc40. I made the overdrive mod plug. it geds you to pure Geddyland.
however the Ashly preamp is about as squirrelly or difficult to dial in as it sounds this pedal is.
And that has to do with understanding how this complex preamp interacts with each of the frequencies and settings. It takes time to figure it all out. Patience!

Patience indeed! That was a lesson I was forced to learn - I've probably been spoiled by newer pedals such as Tech 21 and Darkglass stuff that I've never had to wrestle with at all. It's in the nature of the SC-40 (and thus the Super Forty) to be experimented with instead and it's important to acknowledge that going in.

If you're interested, I 100% recommend it! Gets the tone I've been craving for years and it's a faithful recreation of its inspiration through to every quirk of the original.

And not to worry, I've been plugging it in to the FX loop already. No way am I letting an inferior pre-amp interfere with my tone. It sometimes annoys me that I'm a hardcore tone chaser but nothing beats the feeling of getting there.

 

[cromag31]

someone need to post a pic of their setting on the pedal! please

 

[cromag31]

Ok, more samples. These samples are taken from the output of my bass rack, not just the individual preamps like my previous samples. My rack is ... complicated

Here's the signal flow through my rack
View attachment 5302916

Note the 2 Ashly SC-40s on the bridge pickup. Here's a sample with the SC-40s. Note that this is a 2011 Rickenbacker 4001 JetGlo (color *does* make a notable difference in tone ) with Classic Amplification pickups, treble pickup capacitor engaged. I took the output of my rack into channel 1 of my audio interface into my DAW, no other processing done.


For this next sample, I replaced both of the Ashly SC-40 preamps with ME Super FORTY preamps. Same bass, same route through my audio interface, etc.

take a shot of your pedal settings please?

[EDIT]: Just to clarify, the samples include both pickups combined/mixed in my rack.

--jack

 

[Parzival]

My Super 40 is on the way it looks like and I am looking forward to trying it out. Question for those that have one already. I have seen a few folks comment that are using on Ricks and maybe a Jazz, but has anyone tried this on a P bass? If so, do you find it to sound better with one or the other? I have a J and two P basses and wondering how it will do with the P basses.

 

[willot07]

My Super 40 is on the way it looks like and I am looking forward to trying it out. Question for those that have one already. I have seen a few folks comment that are using on Ricks and maybe a Jazz, but has anyone tried this on a P bass? If so, do you find it to sound better with one or the other? I have a J and two P basses and wondering how it will do with the P basses.

I've tried it out using my MIJ 51 P Bass reissue. I don't have a Jazz unfortunately so I can't compare it to that. Trying it out with the P bass, I noticed that it took really well with the Super Forty which was a welcome surprise. It's a nice punchy sound that's complimented by the naturally mid-heavy sound of the P bass.

I find it's a bit easier to get punch from the P bass because the pickup's hotter than the ones in my Ricky (I suspect the pickups in a Jazz bass are also hotter than Rickys too) so you don't need to beat the crap out of the strings as much. Overall yeah, you won't be disappointed when trying the P bass out with the Super Forty. I've just put some flats on the P so I imagine the sound would be a bit brighter if you're running rounds.

The sound I'm getting sounds remarkably like Geddy's tone on Roll the Bones from the R40 Tour -

He used a P bass for this song on that tour (and on this recording) too!

 

[JackTheRipper]

someone need to post a pic of their setting on the pedal! please

I posted my settings earlier in this thread:

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/master-effects-owners-society.1531124/page-23#post-28069361

--jack