Mesa Strategy and Prodigy discontinued. Also PH cabs.

[sigterm]

Well, since you offered

I have no idea if this is doable, and even if it is, I have no idea if it would sell, but I do dream of a giggable bass amp in stompbox format. Picturing a 300 watt d800/TE Elf in a Boss sized pedal box with di out.

That said RIP Prodigy/Strategy. I really love those amps, even though I don’t own them. Always liked that they were an available option.

I've wanted a stompbox format amp, but I'd end up with a wiring nightmare. I'm happier now that preamps pedals have come such a long way.

 

[Rickter]

Just going to jump in here to say that both the Strategy and Prodigy are really hot rodded amps and it's becoming more and more difficult to get consistent quality production KT-88 tubes that can handle the high voltages and currents that are necessary under the wide variety of real world conditions that these amps see in the wild (and getting more and more difficult every day it seems) . They are an expensive tube (especially a set of 8), and when reliability suffers the costs of replacements can get pretty high awfully quickly. Since our warranty is both long and liberal (as many of you are aware of, and some of you have taken advantage of), it has just become impractical to continue with such a costly, almost custom build type amp. There are some still available throughout the dealer network, as well as showing up on the TB classifieds. The warranty is transferable, so if you want one just keep your eyes open.

As far as the Powerhouse cabinets, the days of players seeking out 100+ pound cabinets is coming to a close. Absolutely nothing wrong with the speaker, just that tastes have changed away from this to cabinets like the Subway and similar lighter weight more compact cabinets. There are plenty of new and used PH cabinets out there so there's certainly no shortage plus we continue to stock all the repair parts and warranty service should it be necessary.

Don't worry though, I am always working on new designs and listening closely to what Talkbass players are looking for, as you all seem to be ahead of the curve more than anywhere else. Now's your chance to speak up!

Thank you for the info and explanation. Just another example of why I love the TB community. It gives us actual advocates in the marketplace.

 

[arbiterusa]

What about a true hybrid class A/B/D amp design?
One where you have a full compliment of tubes for gain, EQ and power section, with a rather low total of maybe 30W. Just enough to drive a B string with the bass pot turned up without immediately breaking up.
Then, there is a class D unit with 800 Watts (that gets its signal from the output transformer) and a very clever mechanism to blend (if possible) or switch between the two poweramps.
So you can:
-enjoy your 30W of pure tubeness.
-as soon as that is not enough, you can amplify further by using the class D unit.
-the class D unit could also work the other way round. You set your tube amp so you get a nice compression and saturation from the powertubes that run at full power, but the class D unit only plays at bedroom volume.

I’m a pretty diehard solid state guy, but owned a V4B for quite a few years and loved it. I’d be seriously interested in something like this.

So maybe the future of tube amplification is a 12AX7 preamp, and a push pull 12AT7 into a big honking class d slave.

SWR on line one, lol. Although I must say as an owner they don’t sound like tube amps at all. And the GK MBF series is pretty much exactly what you are describing. I have not gotten to try one of these yet.

 

[swarfrat]

SWR on line one, lol. Although I must say as an owner they don’t sound like tube amps at all. And the GK MBF series is pretty much exactly what you are describing. I have not gotten to try one of these yet.

Both the SWR and GK MBF are tube preamps - nothing push pull about the tube section.

 

[PotsdamBass8]

I thought they were really great looking designs. I got to try the lower output one (prodigy?) a few times at a local store and was surprised at how different it sounded from what I had imagined an all tube amp would sound. I had a hard time dialing out the extensive highs and getting a warm and pillowy low mid and low end, which to me is what sounds “tubey”. I understand that that’s not what ALL tube amps sound like, and it’s more of a voicing thing, but to me it was missing what makes the cost and weight worthwhile. Also the preamp overdrive wasn’t that appealing to me, it sounded clean and then buzzy without much in between. Granted I wasn’t cranking it to the point of power amp breakup, so I couldn’t comment on that. But I wonder how many other consumers came to see it the same way as me, looking for a specific kind of sound and response and not being able to find it?

 

[BogeyBass]

Huh?

Lol it's not my money. I love the ignorance game. It ain't the tubes. Even back in the 90s it was the " tubes fault" then again that was the " good old days" when SED was in full production. The supposed only factory making " good tubes"

My Chinese loaded kt88 Marshall and kt66 Marshall doing fine.

Let's all start rumours that " tube are bad" and nobody needs big cabs lol. So we can sell are overpriced class D's and scare the market from buying real tubes.

 

[smcgov]

I would like to see mesas take on neo 410 and 610

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

Just going to jump in here to say that both the Strategy and Prodigy are really hot rodded amps and it's becoming more and more difficult to get consistent quality production KT-88 tubes that can handle the high voltages and currents that are necessary under the wide variety of real world conditions that these amps see in the wild (and getting more and more difficult every day it seems) . They are an expensive tube (especially a set of 8), and when reliability suffers the costs of replacements can get pretty high awfully quickly. Since our warranty is both long and liberal (as many of you are aware of, and some of you have taken advantage of), it has just become impractical to continue with such a costly, almost custom build type amp. There are some still available throughout the dealer network, as well as showing up on the TB classifieds. The warranty is transferable, so if you want one just keep your eyes open.

As far as the Powerhouse cabinets, the days of players seeking out 100+ pound cabinets is coming to a close. Absolutely nothing wrong with the speaker, just that tastes have changed away from this to cabinets like the Subway and similar lighter weight more compact cabinets. There are plenty of new and used PH cabinets out there so there's certainly no shortage plus we continue to stock all the repair parts and warranty service should it be necessary.

Don't worry though, I am always working on new designs and listening closely to what Talkbass players are looking for, as you all seem to be ahead of the curve more than anywhere else. Now's your chance to speak up!

Sounds like I'd better buy another pair of PH212's pronto. IMO they're excellent cabinets, I'm sad to see MB stop making them.

Can you comment if there's a "New and Improved" 2-12" bass cabinet?

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

I would love to see the Voice control that is flat at 12:00, clockwise does the smiley curve, and counter-clockwise does a frown curve.

Count me in on that! Especially the frowny curve!

 

[agedhorse]

Can you comment if there's a "New and Improved" 2-12" bass cabinet?

Can't comment specifically on any new product, but I have been listening closely to what you guys have been asking for.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

Can't comment specifically on any new product, but I have been listening closely to what you guys have been asking for.

It's great that you're an active member here!

 

[mmbongo]

I'd like to see the weight of the cabs get lower if possible. My first (and only) jump into the amp and cab world started with a Barefaced Super Compact (1x12) and when I went looking for an amp I quickly settled on Mesa.

The weight difference between the Barefaced 1x12 and the Mesa 1x12 is about 12 pounds. That's not a lot but it's enough to make a difference for a smaller guy like me. It seems like more and more companies are going for lightweight equipment and the build quality of lightweight equipment is getting better and better. If there were ever a revision of the cabs I would love to see them get just a little bit lighter, though I imagine that is easier said than done.

Yeah I think there is a tradeoff there though. I do have a Super Compact and a Subway 112. The Super Compact is definitely lighter, but the build quality of the Subway is just on another level. The Super Compact uses a much thinner wood that I can physically flex by pushing on the cabinet, no way that is ever happening with the Subway cabs. They are built like tanks yet still very lightweight.

 

[RoadRanger]

Interesting that Behringer/Bugera took the approach of lower plate voltages on their tube amps to deal with the "modern crappy tubes" crisis. But that also makes their amps a bit less "edgy" so not terribly popular. Not to mention the abysmal failure of their "Infiniums" due to crappy ribbon cable connections in the auto-bias circuit . OTOH I really should dig out my 1960 to get that Jack Bruce thing goin' in my latest band .

 

[RoadRanger]

My latest band is a power trio plus singer and I do notice that if I have the mids flat to sit in the mix well with that 100w halfstack that when the guitarist "cuts out" on rhythm to do a lead that I really cut through as if I changed something . Not a bad thing actually - just a bit surprising at first...

 

[bassstrangler]

Lol it's not my money. I love the ignorance game. It ain't the tubes. Even back in the 90s it was the " tubes fault" then again that was the " good old days" when SED was in full production. The supposed only factory making " good tubes"

My Chinese loaded kt88 Marshall and kt66 Marshall doing fine.

Let's all start rumours that " tube are bad" and nobody needs big cabs lol. So we can sell are overpriced class D's and scare the market from buying real tubes.

Actually, my "huh" was in regards to your really hard to follow rambling post. I'm still having problems following a long to your posts.

 

[CryingBass]

They will have to pry my 8:88 ( fed into 2x Berg NV115’s ) out of my cold dead hands.

Unfortunately, that does speak to my playing lately...

 

[bobcruz]

When amps are discontinued it only means more good things are coming our way from Mesa...just when my G.A.S. has subsided to a record low. I always wanted to try the Interstellar Overdrive or the similar offerings from Hughes and Kettner but haven't come across them locally. If Mesa comes out with an amp along those lines, I'm in trouble again....drool

 

[Wasnex]

If we are kicking around ideas, I'll mention that I shy away from amps that don't have bias pots. Bonus points if you can access the pot without removing the chassis. I'm not skilled enough to retro fit a pot.

Unfortunately external bias pots tempt people to fiddle who don't know what they are doing. The way the Ashdown CTM300 is setup is pretty cool. Individual bias pots for each tube and a built in meter. But I bet there are a fair amount of CTM300s that break down because users max out the current in each tube instead of setting the bias in the proper range.

Setting the bias is an extremely easy procedure on the CTM300 if you read the manual...I get the impression most owners don't, and even if they do, many don't seem to understand what is going on.

FYI, I only have one bass amp that I think sounds best biased above 70% dissipation...and it is supposed to be "class A."

 

[Wasnex]

I thought they were really great looking designs. I got to try the lower output one (prodigy?) a few times at a local store and was surprised at how different it sounded from what I had imagined an all tube amp would sound. I had a hard time dialing out the extensive highs and getting a warm and pillowy low mid and low end, which to me is what sounds “tubey”. I understand that that’s not what ALL tube amps sound like, and it’s more of a voicing thing, but to me it was missing what makes the cost and weight worthwhile. Also the preamp overdrive wasn’t that appealing to me, it sounded clean and then buzzy without much in between. Granted I wasn’t cranking it to the point of power amp breakup, so I couldn’t comment on that. But I wonder how many other consumers came to see it the same way as me, looking for a specific kind of sound and response and not being able to find it?

In my experience most tube amps have a pretty bright top end, but they are often used with speakers that offset the brightness. My first amp was a Fender Twin loaded with JBL E120s, so I was used to hearing plenty of high frequencies. My second amp was an SVT with the matching 810E. I thought the SVT was really dark until I hooked it up to a full range speaker.

Another thing I have noticed with the bright and harsh highs of many tube amps is they mellow out and soften once the amp is cranked. Part of this is because many amps have a bright cap wired across the volume/gain control. As you crank up the volume the bright cap becomes less dominant.

The other factor is once most tube amps reach a certain volume, they will start to compress a bit. At low volumes the highs may seem really brittle and hard, but once you push the amp into compression the highs may soften a bit. This varies from amp to amp...For example, Hiwatt style amps don't tend to compress very much even when run flat out.

 

[bonin in the boneyard]

^^^ This.

Those crystal highs are wonderful through a tweeterless cab, but overwhelming through a modern super cab.