Let's call it a brain fart. I fixed it as soon as I realized I had misspoke, but you know the way the Internet is once it gets ahold of something...
Besides, who could really tell the difference between those two anyway?
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Most iconic hard rock/metal amp & speaker?
- Thread starter agedhorse
- Start date
Besides, who could really tell the difference between those two anyway?
I've used many over the years. the ones that stand out the best were; traynor yba 1 and a monobloc, ampeg svt, v4, b18, pf 400, acoustic 470 w/2-406 transducers, peavey tnt 115, tour 700 w/2-12 scorpions and a 61 fender bassman with either a 2-12 or 2-15 cab. the ones that let me down were gk rb 400, backline 400 (virtually identical) and a peavey firebass 700. I have a ton of speakers I use, most of them are different sizes of cerwin Vegas, 10s, 12s, and 15s, ev sro 12s and 15s, plus a couple of jbl 15s, a couple of peavey 12" scorpions and 4 Bose 4s. the best sounding ones are the cerwin Vega 15s. I've had a lot of other amp and speaker setups but nothing of note.
They're all running Fractal Audio rigs into PA with some cabs on stage for monitors or to generate feedback.
I've been to plenty of them. Increasingly, Fractal and Kemper are showing up more and more with the Helix following closely behind. Weight/portability is a factor as is the rigs run through the PA anyway so why not have consistency from venue to venue with global EQ tweaks. I have a Helix and the gear down in my signature to give me options for the various venues we might play in.
A. I'm going to have to say that when it comes to hard rock and bass, the only true "icon" is the Ampeg SVT head and SVT810E cabinet.
I think the only things that come close to possibly achieving iconic status are:
1. at least briefly, during the 1990s, some sort of Trace Elliot rig, an SMX head with (possibly) the 1048H (4x10+horn, 8 ohm) and 1518 (large 1x15, 8 ohm) cabinet set. Trace Elliot's list of endorsers during the mid-1990s, before the company fell apart, was extremely impressive.
2. again, at least during the 1990s, Mesa Bass 400+ head with RoadReady 2x15 cabinet or the Powerhouse 1000 cab.
There are lots of combinations out there that work great, but when it comes to iconic status, that's as far as I'm willing to go. I think most of the answers people are going to give are going to reflect the era and type of music with which they identify best.
If that's the 70s, then I expect the Acoustic 360 and Sunn 300T would be chosen by many. If that's the current era, I was just joking yesterday that the combination of Dingwall and Darkglass is fast becoming a cliché like a PRS Custom with a Mesa Dual Recto Solo head and Recto cabs was for awhile (and perhaps still is) or a Les Paul with a Marshall JCM and Greenbacks. And although I'm not a fan, Gallien-Kreuger certainly has a following, not least of which is because of Flea.
Two of my favorite rock bassists of the moment are piaying EBS and Darkglass rigs. Another plays an Ashdown rig.
B. Now, what rigs do I think are straight-up awesome for hard rock or metal besides those? The ones I've owned, of course!
1. The SWR Bass 750/750X head or the Interstellar Overdrive preamp & Power 750 head with some version of the Goliath cabinet line (Goliath 4x10, Goliath Jr. 2x10, Goliath Sr. 6x10, Megoliath 8x10), though I personally would go with two Son of Bertha 1x15 cabs.
2. The Trace Elliot V-Type with a pair of 1248H and 1248 cabs.
I'd prefer either of these setups to an iconic SVT rig, any day of the week.
C. If I were building a new stage rig right now, it would be a Mesa Subway WD-800 or D-800+, probably two Subway 1x15 cabs or a Subway 2x15, and I'd make the PA do the heavy lifting.
I think the only things that come close to possibly achieving iconic status are:
1. at least briefly, during the 1990s, some sort of Trace Elliot rig, an SMX head with (possibly) the 1048H (4x10+horn, 8 ohm) and 1518 (large 1x15, 8 ohm) cabinet set. Trace Elliot's list of endorsers during the mid-1990s, before the company fell apart, was extremely impressive.
2. again, at least during the 1990s, Mesa Bass 400+ head with RoadReady 2x15 cabinet or the Powerhouse 1000 cab.
There are lots of combinations out there that work great, but when it comes to iconic status, that's as far as I'm willing to go. I think most of the answers people are going to give are going to reflect the era and type of music with which they identify best.
If that's the 70s, then I expect the Acoustic 360 and Sunn 300T would be chosen by many. If that's the current era, I was just joking yesterday that the combination of Dingwall and Darkglass is fast becoming a cliché like a PRS Custom with a Mesa Dual Recto Solo head and Recto cabs was for awhile (and perhaps still is) or a Les Paul with a Marshall JCM and Greenbacks. And although I'm not a fan, Gallien-Kreuger certainly has a following, not least of which is because of Flea.
Two of my favorite rock bassists of the moment are piaying EBS and Darkglass rigs. Another plays an Ashdown rig.
B. Now, what rigs do I think are straight-up awesome for hard rock or metal besides those? The ones I've owned, of course!
1. The SWR Bass 750/750X head or the Interstellar Overdrive preamp & Power 750 head with some version of the Goliath cabinet line (Goliath 4x10, Goliath Jr. 2x10, Goliath Sr. 6x10, Megoliath 8x10), though I personally would go with two Son of Bertha 1x15 cabs.
2. The Trace Elliot V-Type with a pair of 1248H and 1248 cabs.
I'd prefer either of these setups to an iconic SVT rig, any day of the week.
C. If I were building a new stage rig right now, it would be a Mesa Subway WD-800 or D-800+, probably two Subway 1x15 cabs or a Subway 2x15, and I'd make the PA do the heavy lifting.
Having said all that, and thinking about the context here, that is to say:
1. Andy is a product designer looking for the Next Great Idea.
*and*
2. TalkBass, like virtually every online guitar and bass forum site, tends to be dominated by older dudes.
And I would then say:
3. Consider that future players are not past players, and Millennial and younger generations are facing a completely different world than older GenXers like myself did, or Jones Generation and older Baby Boomers did.
That ligher weight rigs are the current trend is not an accident. I think Mesa's Subway line is perfect. I think Darkglass is a force to be reckoned with in the current market. I think tc electronic is making some great products in their RH and RS pro lines.
Pedals are big now in a way that they weren't in the 90s (again, see Darkglass). With the excellent current crop of cabinet simulators, like the DSM Noisemaker OmniCabSim Deluxe, or the digital impulse response loaders, a lot of players are opting for a "fly rig" style of pedalboard, and my next project is building one, myself.
Do we really see much possibility of younger players reverting to the back-breaking rigs of yesteryear?
1. Andy is a product designer looking for the Next Great Idea.
*and*
2. TalkBass, like virtually every online guitar and bass forum site, tends to be dominated by older dudes.
And I would then say:
3. Consider that future players are not past players, and Millennial and younger generations are facing a completely different world than older GenXers like myself did, or Jones Generation and older Baby Boomers did.
That ligher weight rigs are the current trend is not an accident. I think Mesa's Subway line is perfect. I think Darkglass is a force to be reckoned with in the current market. I think tc electronic is making some great products in their RH and RS pro lines.
Pedals are big now in a way that they weren't in the 90s (again, see Darkglass). With the excellent current crop of cabinet simulators, like the DSM Noisemaker OmniCabSim Deluxe, or the digital impulse response loaders, a lot of players are opting for a "fly rig" style of pedalboard, and my next project is building one, myself.
Do we really see much possibility of younger players reverting to the back-breaking rigs of yesteryear?
Last edited:
That's not the Ric-O-Sound then?I just love that tone he got, although a lot goes into the sound besides an amp and cab as I'm sure @agedhorse will agree. It is a combination of so many variables that it is almost impossible to recreate, because so many are physically personal, such as fingers and technique. Recreate, no, approximate, yes.
Hi Frankie, Glover's bass on Machine Head sounds typically Rick, but on Made in Japan it's a lot fuller....maybe he used the Jazz pickup conversion later for live work…..wonder if he's on TB and could clear it up?
He had a few basses kicking about...….a lovely black P and I'm pretty sure that Fireball is all Mustang from the pics I've seen of DP in the studio at that time.
one of my favourite players...……………..I picked up a lot from listening to him as a kid.
No. But I think there's definitely still a good market for the medium-weight rigs. Amps do not need to be any smaller and lighter than the new current offerings imo.
The WD800 is bigger and heavier than the D-800+ because of the added features and I feel there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.
I think in today's market 2U size is still a viable player. I don't want companies to cut features and tone possibilities just to keep an amp smaller and lighter.
And I definitely don't want to live in a world when a company R&Ds an amp they put size and weight ahead of features and tone. Especially when designing a metal amp from scratch. Not by any means saying Mesa does that, but please don't do that.
Hi Amper, absolutely agree and good that no younger player will ever have to know the 'joy' of turning up at a gig in a bar to find that they are playing on the 1st or 2nd floor...……...the lift doesn't exist and you have an 8x10.....man, that WAS a great feeling!
I'll tell you what amp would NOT qualify...……..a Fender BXR400...…..awful, awful, awful
Just to be clear, in the US, the "first" floor is the ground level.
The WD-800 may be bigger and heavier than the D-800, but it's still only 7 lbs., compared to the 13 lbs. of my "portly" Walkabout head.
As someone who's run with a crowd 20 years his junior... yes.
410s are standard and generally stacked on a 115. 610 and 810 are also popular. SVT-CL, Pro and PF, Orange AD200, Traynor YBA300, GK (I don't know GK we'll enough to remember models).
When I switched from guitar a few years ago I sought advice from TB and wound up getting a D800 and a 112/115 mini stack. After about a year I had a 410 and a Strategy. Now I have two 410s and a Carbine.
I'm going for an audition tomorrow. The supplied rig is a Hartke LH500, 410 and 115. The band I auditioned for last week offered an M9 Carbine on an Ampeg 610.
I'm sure it's different everywhere as each scene has its own personality, but personally I've found a huge gap between what TB thinks and everyone else is actually doing.
Hi Amper……...that's why I said 1st or 2nd floor (covering all bases)
Yeah Buddy!! I Had a Kustom cab that had 4-15's in one tower and played through 2 of them. Frickin thing was taller than me then without the head. What could be cooler than that!! They had hands down the most cabinet, driver combinations you could get out of any other brand or line. 8", 10", 12", 15", horns, tweeters, and I think they even had an 18 inch. I mean just look at that cab the keyboardist is playing through. And this was in the 60's to boot.
As always, there's usually a few people in each thread who seem to have their fingers on the pulse of what's really going on.
+1
I'd agree with this one too. Though I don't really see any 2x15 flying in today's world of perception.
