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Music Stands on Stage

#101
PastorofMuppets said:
If you play your own music it should definitely be memorized.
If you are playing other peoples music then the same should be true.
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That is ridiculous.
An original band....even an amazingly successful one....only plays 90 minutes tops at any show. Most gigs for (strictly) original bands are 45 minutes (or less) with other bands. Of their OWN material.

A (strictly) cover band typically is playing 3 to 4 HOURS of someone elses material.

So that's apples and oranges don't you think?

Besides that.....I've been a stage hand for 18years, and I can count on less than one hand the times I've been on a stage where the main act didn't have a teleprompter.
 
#102
fdeck said:
I'll give up my music stand when my ability to sight-read gigs stops paying for all of my gear. ;)

Granted, I'm a hired gun jazz player. What annoys me is not the presence of music stands on stage, but the endless dead air, while players flip through their fake books searching for the next tune to play. Also, I got tired of hauling 12 pounds of books to every gig. So I tend to play "standards" gigs without a music stand.
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There is an easy solution to the dead air and 12 pounds of books. :D
 
#103
kikstand454 said:
That is ridiculous.
An original band....even an amazingly successful one....only plays 90 minutes tops at any show. Most gigs for (strictly) original bands are 45 minutes (or less) with other bands. Of their OWN material.

A (strictly) cover band typically is playing 3 to 4 HOURS of someone elses material.

So that's apples and oranges don't you think?

Besides that.....I've been a stage hand for 18years, and I can count on less than one hand the times I've been on a stage where the main act didn't have a teleprompter.
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Use whatever excuse you need bro.

YMMV I have already stated my band knows a couple hundred songs that we do well. Thats at least 6-7 hours worth of covers. We all have it in our head. The biggest challenge is remembering the names of all the tunes to choose from. Im not trying to brag at all. I have seen other bands who play every weekend and they have music stands with huge binders of charts and lyrics and little lamps on the top like a bunch of old fogies. Its kind of pitiful in my most humble opinion. There are exceptions to the rule of course. I am merely stating my opinion.
 
#104
PastorofMuppets said:
Use whatever excuse you need bro.

YMMV I have already stated my band knows a couple hundred songs that we do well. Thats at least 6-7 hours worth of covers. We all have it in our head. The biggest challenge is remembering the names of all the tunes to choose from. Im not trying to brag at all. I have seen other bands who play every weekend and they have music stands with huge binders of charts and lyrics and little lamps on the top like a bunch of old fogies. Its kind of pitiful in my most humble opinion. There are exceptions to the rule of course. I am merely stating my opinion.
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This is easy to say when you're not playing with that group, but if they called you for the gig and the money was right for tunes you don't have in your head, are you declining or are you showing up and using that book on the music stand to make them sound good?
 
#105
For rock bands where the stage show is somewhat important, I'd rather not see a music stand. Players that use them tend to focus on them, and it takes away from the show. If we're talking about jazz gigs, where the band is more like wallpaper, then it doesn't matter as much.
 
#106
Phil Smith said:
This is easy to say when you're not playing with that group, but if they called you for the gig and the money was right for tunes you don't have in your head, are you declining or are you showing up and using that book on the music stand to make them sound good?
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Well even in the most last minute gigs they should give me a set list. I can make notes and use a small notebook on my amp. I can watch a guitarist hands or keyboard left. If I am woefully out of my depth then even the cheat book wont help. If I have heard the song at all then I could get through it with my ear and basic outlines. The point is not about me as a fill in but them as a regular gigging band depending on the books. I would decline a gig if I couldnt handle it. Playing and botching would hurt my reputation and the goal is to play most gigs and decline very few and keep playing and working.
 
#107
I'm genuinely shocked and surprised by how many people have issues with music stands on stage... Are you kidding me?
Is everyone just jealous that they can't read music? Who the heck cares if they have music stands? If the music is good because of it, isn't that paramount?

I rarely ever use one myself... But literally could care less about whether others do or not. If a band leader ever told me not to use a stand because it didn't look cool, I'd probably snap.

So sad when the importance of the aesthetics take over the importance of the music
 
#108
PastorofMuppets said:
Well even in the most last minute gigs they should give me a set list. I can make notes and use a small notebook on my amp. I can watch a guitarist hands or keyboard left. If I am woefully out of my depth then even the cheat book wont help. If I have heard the song at all then I could get through it with my ear and basic outlines. The point is not about me as a fill in but them as a regular gigging band depending on the books. I would decline a gig if I couldnt handle it. Playing and botching would hurt my reputation and the goal is to play most gigs and decline very few and keep playing and working.
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Because "faking" your way or "just getting through it" is better than "getting it perfect" or "nailing it"? Following the guitarist or keys will never sound AS tight as if u didn't have to follow anyone (except maybe a piece of sheet music). IMO. When you're unsure and just following or trying to watch for guitar shapes of chords, you think you are really engaging with the audience and rocking out?

Knowing exactly what's coming up next and not having to guess, I find, makes the music sound better. In a situation where I get called to play 50 cover tunes, many of which I know, few of which I know expertly well, I will totally bring whatever sheet music/lead sheets I need. I never even considered anything else. We are bass players for crying out loud. So much more important than looking like we are rocking out is keeping the groove and having smooth chord changes.
 
#111
PastorofMuppets said:
Well even in the most last minute gigs they should give me a set list. I can make notes and use a small notebook on my amp. I can watch a guitarist hands or keyboard left. If I am woefully out of my depth then even the cheat book wont help. If I have heard the song at all then I could get through it with my ear and basic outlines. The point is not about me as a fill in but them as a regular gigging band depending on the books. I would decline a gig if I couldnt handle it. Playing and botching would hurt my reputation and the goal is to play most gigs and decline very few and keep playing and working.
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What's the difference between someone reading charts from a stand and someone staring at a notebook on an amp or the keyboard player's left hand all night?
 
#112
GroovinOnFunk said:
I'm genuinely shocked and surprised by how many people have issues with music stands on stage... Are you kidding me?
Is everyone just jealous that they can't read music? Who the heck cares if they have music stands? If the music is good because of it, isn't that paramount?

I rarely ever use one myself... But literally could care less about whether others do or not. If a band leader ever told me not to use a stand because it didn't look cool, I'd probably snap.

So sad when the importance of the aesthetics take over the importance of the music
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There has to be something to differentiate 1000000 rock bands from one another.

Competence narrows it down to 100000

Maybe memorized sets narrows it down to 10000

If there are still too many rock bands, maybe the next thing is choreographed dancing.
 
#115
GroovinOnFunk said:
I'm genuinely shocked and surprised by how many people have issues with music stands on stage... Are you kidding me?
Is everyone just jealous that they can't read music? Who the heck cares if they have music stands? If the music is good because of it, isn't that paramount?

I rarely ever use one myself... But literally could care less about whether others do or not. If a band leader ever told me not to use a stand because it didn't look cool, I'd probably snap.

So sad when the importance of the aesthetics take over the importance of the music
Click to expand...

Depending on the type of music, the stage show is an important part of the overall experience. If a rock band puts 5 guys on stage, and they spend the night reading music, then they will have a weak show.

It's the arrogance in musicians that makes them think that the music is all that matters. There are also visual aspects to what we do.
 
#117
guy n. cognito said:
Depending on the type of music, the stage show is an important part of the overall experience. If a rock band puts 5 guys on stage, and they spend the night reading music, then they will have a weak show.

It's the arrogance in musicians that makes them think that the music is all that matters. There are also visual aspects to what we do.
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What's worse aesthetically, a music stand on stage or a big ole beer belly? From the standpoint of the visuals of course.
 
#118
Phil Smith said:
What's worse aesthetically, a music stand on stage or a big ole beer belly? From the standpoint of the visuals of course.
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For a rock band? Personally, I rather see a fat guy rocking it than a skinny guy staring at sheet music all night. If the band wants the audience to get into the music, get up and dance, that's pretty hard to do if they don't do the same.
 
#119
grenadilla said:
When I saw The Who {6 times ], Roger knew what the words were. The Ox knew what to play. Pete knew what to play. When I watch Lawrence Welk, they need their music stands. Local bands at the VFW need their music stand for the words to the old tired hits we all love. Rock and roll heros don't need music stands. [except in the studio]
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Townsend wrote the music for the band and they had been playing it for a long time and Welk was/had an arranger, so they didn't necessarily see the music before the show/rehearsal. Big bands and orchestras use sheet music so they get it right and with that many parts, if someone is launching clams, it sounds really, really bad. In a three-piece + singer, not so much unless they really blow their part. In that case, they're really not "heros", are they?

Ever played in a large band or orchestra? Try it without sheet music and see how it goes. Bandleaders who add music to a show at the last minute need people who can read. Period. If it's a casual gig, having musicians with no ability to read will make them look bad. Talk to someone who plays gigs like these and you may learn why they use sheet music while they're playing.

Some musicians like to play with as many others as possible because they respect them and may be friends, but too busy with their own bands to get together often enough to learn all of the possible tunes. Here's an example of this- Greg and the drummer had worked together for a few years, the bass player occasionally and not much with the keyboard player. If you look between the keyboard player and bass, you'll see the bass player's music stand and to the keybd player's left, his stand. I was at this gig and Greg called tunes all night that these guys didn't know from memory and it was a good example of great musicianship.



When someone writes their own music, plays the same songs all the time or if they don't make changes to the music, they shouldn't need sheet music. If you ever see Led Zeppelin or some other arena/stadium group taking requests, let us know. Most bands have a limited list of songs that they'll play at a gig.
 
#120
Using cheats (chord charts, set lists, etc) and having a music stand front and center are two totally different things.
I'm surprised that that even has to be said.

Oh, I've never seen Led Zeppelin take request, but I have never seen an orchestra do it either.
 

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