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My drummer is killing me

#21
JRA said:
that's just about the worst advice i've ever read!* :laugh: and just how do you do that? i.e., deal with the problems without comment?

* on TB. out in the real world = plenty of bad advice...and it's all free!
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Obnoxious comment, but I'll bite and educate.

What my comment in this case means is simple: Like with many frustrating situations like this, you have 3 choices:

1) Accept him for who he is without comment. That's what "accepting" means. You can't say you accept his limitations and then go on and on and on about it out loud - to him, to the rest of the band. duh. It simply doesn't work and it's not fair. nor is it "acceptance". Acceptance means dealing with the person, the situation, realizing that you aren't likely going to be able to change it - so you accept this guy as he is. With his limitations. Cheerfully and without comment. Nagging someone. Berating someone. it's the opposite of "acceptance" of a situation. Clearer now, scout?

2) Fire him

3) walk yourself.

I suppose you could have him in the band and simply tell him how crappy his drumming is constantly (option 4). I'm sure that will do the trick!! PROBLEM SOLVED!!! *rolls eyes*. That's an option, yes, but clearly not a very good one. so I go back to the original 3 -- accept the situation as is cheerfully and without comment, fire him, walk. there really aren't any other choices here unless you are hoping he gets killed in a tragic gardening accident....I guess you could HOPE he quits on his own....but in this case, as BL you should take control of your band's destiny and lose this guy.
 
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#22
https://www.talkbass.com/members/qorc.34639/ : binary?

i tell musicians they have to 'step it up' all the time. if they are perplexed by that comment = i break it down for them. if they want help with the issue = i help them. if they work on it = i reinforce their effort. yada yada...

but i like your either/or simplistic thinking: works great in emergencies!
 
#23
micguy said:
So, you have a drummer, and he doesn't have good ........timing. How did he get in the band?
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Well, I don’t live out there. I occasionally get us gigs but mostly I just play bass. I don’t get too involved in running the band. I am not in the area and don’t really have time to personally find a drummer and work with them. Basically, I can tell them to get a new drummer or I quit and then they would have to do the leg work. That is why I am hesitant to make that move. I was hoping he just needed time to acclimate. When I said he was capable, i mean that he CAN play correctly. When i tell him “play that part with just me” after we run a song and he messes up, he can. His first gig with us, he nailed it. But since then, he has made a LOT of mistakes at gigs and at practice and it KILLS me when he screws up at a gig. Sometimes it has been pretty colossal. I am getting quite sick of it.
 
#25
i could see an at least halfway decent drummer needing maybe a month to nail all the songs if they were originals, but a year? either he or i would have already been gone.

if the drummer is aware he's crappy and it turns out he wants to improve, you could do a few bass and drum practice sessions, but if he were even slightly motivated, he'd be playing with the songs at home and wouldn't need you to practice with him. he's had half a year, and i assume that if your songs are originals there are at least rehearsal recordings of the band with the old drummer he could practice with. or if not motivated enough to practice, he could listen to the songs in his car till he at least knew the changes.

i just saw the post where you say he nailed it at the first gig. have you asked him what the problem is? maybe he just sucks, but maybe he's feeling pressure about living up to the previous drummer that's making him too tense.
 
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#28
JRA said:
https://www.talkbass.com/members/qorc.34639/ : bin

but i like your either/or simplistic thinking: works great in emergencies!
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telling musicians to "step it up" is lovely, but mostly futile. you can get people to improve on the margins. it works. sometimes. But you can't fix "suck". so the advice is a bit simplistic? Great drummers everywhere. You shouldn't have to "encourage" drummers to reach the level of "Adequate."

Fire/replace
 
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#29
Mantis Tobaggan said:
we have had a new drummer for about a year. He screws up all the time. He comes in early off of fills. He plays the wrong tempo. He can’t keep a tempo. He messes up at gigs. Our old drummer was the greatest but he had such a drug problem that we couldnt work with him. The main thing that bothers me is that this drummer doesn’t seem to know or care how bad he is. At rehearsal, if I tell him to play with just me, he can lock in but then later he will mess up. I know he is capable but his attitude sucks in that he isn’t the perfectionist that the rest of us are. He doesn’t seem to care. I live a few hours from the practice space and usually just rehearse once before we load up and go to the gig. I used to live out there but then i moved. Should i bother trying to do a drum and bass practice or just pack it in? This is just for fun and it is getting not so fun.
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Not trying to put TOO much blame on you here, but if you want the drummer to lock in with you, maybe you need to rehearse with him more often than once before each gig.
 
#31
Agree that it should be fun. I play in a few different bands with players of varying skill levels, but there's a minimal low bar for certain things that has to be met in order for me to be happy to be involved. It sounds like this drummer isn't meeting that low bar for you, for whatever reason. He may be capable, but it sounds like he's lazy and inattentive, and if that means he goes off, it's just as big a problem. Were it me, I'd find another place to spend my time, especially with the distance you're driving in order to have this less than enjoyable experience.
 
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#32
pcake said:
i could see an at least halfway decent drummer needing maybe a month to nail all the songs if they were originals, but half a year? either he or i would have already been gone.

if the drummer is aware he's crappy and it turns out he wants to improve, you could do a few bass and drum practice sessions, but if he were even slightly motivated, he'd be playing with the songs at home and wouldn't need you to practice with him. he's had half a year, and i assume that if your songs are originals there are at least rehearsal recordings of the band with the old drummer he could practice with. or if not motivated enough to practice, he could listen to the songs in his car till he at least knew the changes.

i just saw the post where you say he nailed it at the first gig. have you asked him what the problem is? maybe he just sucks, but maybe he's feeling pressure about living up to the previous drummer that's making him too tense.
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I joined a country band with a middle aged drummer with a VERY expensive custom kit that had been playing "since he was three".

He couldn't get the beginning to "I like it, I love it" so he, the lead guitar and I had a rehearsal for just that song. We went through the beginning over 100 times (yes, I started counting) and he NEVER got it. Our solution was for me to shout "ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR" at the gig so he'd know when to come in.

I say "the gig" because I quit shortly after, and that was the reason. He was ensconced in that band and I was the new guy. No point in fighting. I just left the band.
 
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#34
My current drummer sounds like yours. A really nice guy. Girls would say he's sweet. Hung out with him last night. He's a miserable drummer. Guys like him that constantly miss changes are basically not listening to the rest of the band. Some of us count for the changes, some of us listen to the vocal or guitar melody, some of us key off words in the lyrics, and some of us just aren't paying attention. I'm actually pulling the plug on my band and relocating to Portland soon.
 
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#35
I'll be darned, our old drummer must have moved to Florida!
It's the part where he shows no signs of caring to improve that waves the big red flag. Ours had a speed problem--not drugs, but the snowball-rolling-down-the-hill type. We provided recorded evidence, introduced him to that handy gadget, the metronome, but the bottom line was that he didn't think he had a problem. There's not much you can do with someone like that.

Your guy sounds like he can do it if he concentrates, but doesn't want to concentrate. That strikes me as a failure of professionalism. Even if playing music is not one's primary job, people don't pay your band to come to their function and sound like you're under-rehearsed.

I suggest 1) talk to other band members, see if they feel the same way; 2) if they do, the leader should tell the drummer that you will give him a chance to shape up, but that you are going to start to audition other drummers. Since your band seems to rehearse rarely, it might help to give him recordings of your songs as you play them for him to practice to.

Drummers can be a flaky lot. . .
 
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#36
I'd find others to play with and bail or fire the drummer, or if it really is just for fun, keep having fun and forget about it.

I just decided to not take a gig because the drummer plays just like you described. I'm working on being associated with better musicians, and his playing will reflect badly on me.
 
#37
Salicete said:
Does he play to a click?

Fixes a lot of your complaints.
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My guitar player gave him a click track so I suspect the other guys are noticing this as well. I wouldn’t be shocked if they took it upon themselves to fire him. I am going to see how it goes Saturday and then say something.
 
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#40
Mantis Tobaggan said:
we have had a new drummer for about a year. He screws up all the time. He comes in early off of fills. He plays the wrong tempo. He can’t keep a tempo. He messes up at gigs. Our old drummer was the greatest but he had such a drug problem that we couldnt work with him. The main thing that bothers me is that this drummer doesn’t seem to know or care how bad he is. At rehearsal, if I tell him to play with just me, he can lock in but then later he will mess up. I know he is capable but his attitude sucks in that he isn’t the perfectionist that the rest of us are. He doesn’t seem to care. I live a few hours from the practice space and usually just rehearse once before we load up and go to the gig. I used to live out there but then i moved. Should i bother trying to do a drum and bass practice or just pack it in? This is just for fun and it is getting not so fun.
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I didnt know my old drummer had moved to a different town :)
 
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