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I've got a LM-III, and for most gigs I have a bass with rounds and a bass with flats at hand.
When I swap from a bass with rounds to one with flats I dial all the way off the VLE and VPF. TBH I don't use the VPH much at all, and the VLE can be great or it can be way too much of a good thing, so be careful with that in general. But it (the VLE) does give a more vintage character to a modern cab or a more broken in sound to brand new strings. But I digress.
IMO, if you a "crank up the lower frequencies" player, you're going to need to break that habit, because what sounds good at quieter volumes, by itself, doesn't necessarily work at band volume in a band mix. And keep in mind that flats mute the higher frequencies, effectively raising the bass already. So raise the bass more and you get ... indistinct mud. Ok that said, here....
My advice:
When I swap from a bass with rounds to one with flats I dial all the way off the VLE and VPF. TBH I don't use the VPH much at all, and the VLE can be great or it can be way too much of a good thing, so be careful with that in general. But it (the VLE) does give a more vintage character to a modern cab or a more broken in sound to brand new strings. But I digress.
IMO, if you a "crank up the lower frequencies" player, you're going to need to break that habit, because what sounds good at quieter volumes, by itself, doesn't necessarily work at band volume in a band mix. And keep in mind that flats mute the higher frequencies, effectively raising the bass already. So raise the bass more and you get ... indistinct mud. Ok that said, here....
My advice:
- Turn the VLE and VPF off.
- Dial the tone pot on your P all the way bright (which on a passive pass is effectively "no treble cut".)
- Put your amp's entire EQ section at noon and your VLE and VPF off, and listen to it in a "at gig volume, band context". Get someone to let you know how you sound from where the audience sits (or put a recorder out there). Then make small adjustments if necessary. I think you'll find a very happy place where you cut thru the mix well - especially with the natural voicing of the LM-II - close to that starting point.
I tend to agree. I use La Bella low tension flexible flats on my fretless because they are steel instead of nickel, so they're a little brighter, but I still cut through best with SS rounds on any bass for sure. Even with steel flats I still boost a little more high mids & treble than I do with rounds.
I use flats on all my basses. In my opinion, EQ setting is king. When I play through my vintage 66 Bassman head or my 78 Bassman head I have to set everything pretty much flat. If I use the "deep" switch on those amps then I have to ramp up the treble. On my Markbass amp bass is down, mid is up and treble is up to get a good in the mix sound.
Id say it's a "flats suck" issue.
I have D'addario tapes on my Rick 4003s and they sound great. No fingernoise and lots of clarity with lows. I boost the bass and low mids a bit for a sound I want. I'm liking the Ernie Ball Cobalt flats on my Jack Casady bass and I installed a set on my Precision last night. Sound ok so far but will take a couple weeks to really know how they will sound. A very powerful punchy string with maybe a bit too much high end at the moment.
I can tolerate Roto 88's, I have them on my P-J I love the feel mostly, though the tone has some life, the classic P with flats sound without sounding like a piece of clothesline being plucked.
I have a set of Daddario chromes on my Eastwood Classic 4, and dang they sound perfect on this bass though they flopped on others.
In general, I'm a rounds guy though.
I have a set of Daddario chromes on my Eastwood Classic 4, and dang they sound perfect on this bass though they flopped on others.
In general, I'm a rounds guy though.
What kind of music does your band play? Just from the instrumentation, it sounds like there is a lot of space taken up. Flats do great for jazz and soul and finger funk, and acoustic type music where there is space. If you really need to hold the Low end, it may be that rounds would work out better.
I have a few P-basses. One has dead flats, one has bright rounds, and the other has chromes or cobalt flats (a lot like rounds).
I have a few P-basses. One has dead flats, one has bright rounds, and the other has chromes or cobalt flats (a lot like rounds).
EQ is definitely different with flats. With rounds, I usually cut the treble range a bit and occasionally boost lows and/or low mids. With flats, that can lead to a muddy mess. Also, each rig is different. You will have to experiment to find what works for you.
Have fun!
Have fun!
from my experience ... flats take quite a while to break in ... sound and feel ..! if you want a happy middle ground for feel and sound ... as i did , ... i use GHS Pressurewounds ... they are round wounds that are roller wound under pressure which slightly changed the shape of the wire from round to oval ...! they feel pretty smooth w/less finger noise ... but sound like worn in rounds ...
my other bass wears Ti flats ... and yes , flats do sound different for sure ... i also think it takes a while for our ears to get used to the 'different ' sound ....!! i'd let them break in for a bit .. ( strings & ears/brain ) then try to EQ to taste ...
probably why we find barely used strings for sale around here ... we gotta try stuff ..!!!
my other bass wears Ti flats ... and yes , flats do sound different for sure ... i also think it takes a while for our ears to get used to the 'different ' sound ....!! i'd let them break in for a bit .. ( strings & ears/brain ) then try to EQ to taste ...
probably why we find barely used strings for sale around here ... we gotta try stuff ..!!!
You need to EQ differently when using flats. Remember that the vintage tone a lot of people are looking for with flats has a lot to do with those sealed cabinets that didn't go as deep as today's cabs. It helps to lower the bass knob.
Most likely 30% your EQ; 10% your technique; and 60% the type of music and band you're in.
Flats don't work for everything - or for every band. If the cutting through issue can't be fixed by messing with your low and high mids (and your attack), it may be time to pull them.
FWIW, flats aren't generally a good choice when you want to cut through a mix. They're more the "blend in and semi-disappear into a lot of fundamental" type of strings. Think the Kraken rather than Godzilla if you know what I mean...
Flats don't work for everything - or for every band. If the cutting through issue can't be fixed by messing with your low and high mids (and your attack), it may be time to pull them.
FWIW, flats aren't generally a good choice when you want to cut through a mix. They're more the "blend in and semi-disappear into a lot of fundamental" type of strings. Think the Kraken rather than Godzilla if you know what I mean...
wmhill
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OP- that was always what I found whenever I used flats, so it was just easier to use rounds (which I liked better anyways). Despite what you may have read here on talkbass, flats are not necessarily the perfect string for everyone.
Man, you guys are cracking me up. Change EQ for flats vs. rounds? I hardly change my EQ from room to room 
If I need to cut more when playing flats, I just pluck closer to the bridge. If I want the rounds to sound, eh, rounder I just pluck closer to the neck. Attack I mostly control by how I pluck the strings.
If I need to cut more when playing flats, I just pluck closer to the bridge. If I want the rounds to sound, eh, rounder I just pluck closer to the neck. Attack I mostly control by how I pluck the strings.
"Flats are where you simply can't be wishy-washy. You need a dedicated flatwound bass, and you need to dedicate yourself to the set-up; tone, and technique that flatwounds demand. Flats aren't for pansies."
Dont see how this even makes sense in the OP's context. Or really any, for that matter.
Dont see how this even makes sense in the OP's context. Or really any, for that matter.
