Need help deciding on a good cab for my V4-b

[Jo Ke]

Just got a good deal on a 90s ampeg v4-b classic series, which I've heard is the same as the v4-bh. I need help deciding on a good cab to pair it with. Right now I am between the Avatar b410 or b212, or the ampeg svt410hlf or svt-212av. I have heard tons of great things about the Avatar cabs. My only worry is whether the 100w tube head would power the b410. It's hard to find info on them especially the resale ones.
If anyone could clarify some stuff here that would be much appreciated.
(I was set on the b410 until I heard it was rated at 1000w which made me worried the v4-b wouldn't power it).
Btw the sound I am going for came from an svt-cl through an avatar 4x12 (another band we played with). Looking for that low end low mids grunty gurbly throaty sound cause I use distortion and overdrive etc.

 

[micguy]

A cabinet rated for 1000 watts (besides almost certainly being rated a bit optimistically power rating wise) doesn't "need" a certain amount of power to start creating sound - with even a milliwatt into it, you'll hear something - if the thing is rated at 100dB/watt, 1 milliwatt will make 70 dB of SPL - which is like someone talking to you. If the cabinet has a decent sensitivity, 100 watts will be enough to make a decent amount of noise.

 

[Wasnex]

When you are using an amp with a relatively low power rating, the sensitivity rating of the cab becomes very important.

Assume that doubling the power gives you +3dB

So
1W to 2W = +3dB
2W to 4W = +3dB
4W to 8W = +3dB

If it's not clear 1W to 8W gives you a net of +9dB....(3+3+3 = 9)

Sensitivity ratings are normally calculated at 1W. Since your amp is rated for 100W, you need to know the decibel change that comes from raising the power from 1W to 100W is +20dB

If you want to see the math for the decibel change: [Log(100/1) x 10 = 20dB

So if you know the sensitivity rating of a cab, add 20dB and you get the calculated SPL that can be produced by your amp.

For example if a cab is rated 97dB 1W/1m, you 20 + 97 = 117dB.

If the sensitivity rating is 103dB 1W/1m, you get 20 + 103 = 123dB

Notice the 123dB sensitivity rating is 6dB higher than the 97dB rating. Also the calculated SPL at 100W is 6dB louder with the 123dB rated cab. This 6dB relationship will hold true for any power level both cabs can handle.

_____97dB 1W/1m ________103dB 1W/1m
100W = 117dB____________ = 123dB
200W = 120dB____________ = 126dB
400W = 123dB____________ = 129dB

Another important factor is totally subjective. What sort of tone do you like? The trick is you need to find a cab with a high sensitivity rating that produces the type of sound you like. The problem is what you want may be totally different than what I like. This limits the efficacy relying on a recommendation, without actually demoing the cab for yourself. If possible, it's best to try before you buy.

 

[Sid the Kid]

I can’t help you pick your cab but I can tell you that the 100w is loud as heck. Yesterday I played mine both outdoors and in a bar with a single 15 and my ears are still ringing. Either 4x10 or 2x12 would be just fine. If looks matter to you the HLF will probably be the most handsome stack, I have the 212av on order for this reason. Avatar makes good cabinets, they are just heavy and underperform compared to modern offerings.

 

[Yahboy]

SVT 212 cab

 

[Price217mp]

I run 2 older Ampeg 410 cabs they @ 4 ohms each my V4B seems to be happier running at 2 ohm, I also dive my input a little hotter into the 0 DB input with an Origin Cali 76 leveling Amplifier / compressor very little compression slow attack quick release this is an older version of the pedal its bigger than the ones they sell now has input and output trasformers more like a UA 1176 used in studios for recording but the new ones are great too you will get more head room if you need it on your output and it just sounds good Origin makes a great compressor for Bass hands down.

 

[TomB]

You probably know this but V4B‘s begin to break up at about 11:00 on the volume control, depending on what you’re driving it with of course. They do get loud as heck but are pretty much into overdrive by noon. It’s a great sound if that’s what you want .

 

[coreyfyfe]

I run 2 older Ampeg 410 cabs they @ 4 ohms each my V4B seems to be happier running at 2 ohm, I also dive my input a little hotter into the 0 DB input with an Origin Cali 76 leveling Amplifier / compressor very little compression slow attack quick release this is an older version of the pedal its bigger than the ones they sell now has input and output trasformers more like a UA 1176 used in studios for recording but the new ones are great too you will get more head room if you need it on your output and it just sounds good Origin makes a great compressor for Bass hands down.

A bit of an aside and not an answer to OPs question but the V4BH/classic series version of this amp can’t do 2 ohms. It has 4 and 8 ohm output only.

I have had a number of older V4s and have used them with a lot of different cabs.

I agree with @Wasnex if you want to get the most out of the amp find a cab with good sensitivity. I was happy with my V4 and a pair of 112AV cabs, the stack was a little taller than the 212AV but I think that’s a good option. The tuning of those cabs helps keep the low end tighter and they have a good midrange. Haven’t played the avatar stuff.

 

[Price217mp]

sorry i have a v4b that runs at 2 4 or 8 ohms it pairs better with my 410 cabs both are 4 ohms i run them in parallel create a 2 ohm load this amp is the most efficient running at 2 ohms those are facts i have 2 svt 2 heads and a superbassmen they all handle 2 ohm loads i got 4 810 cabs im going on sixty years old i down sized a couple years ago ive always had svt 300 watt tube heads to do what i love to do i dont tour as much as i used to. i gave a answer that was based on the expierence i have with my v4b i love the amp head i love my svt s i guarantee you hook them up to any thing and they will push it all night long now i bought the 212s with the head i didnt like them, i thought they were muddy sounding not enough punch like the 32 ohm 10s but again those work well with SVTS there sensitivity rating is 94db but who cares when you pushing 300 watts of SVT, now im assuming the sensitivity rating is probably higher on the speakers in the 410s because they seem to be getting along fine with my 100 watt V4B and it seems even better @ 2 ohms which mine is capable of, it will run @ 4ohms and 8ohms ive never had an older v4 so i apologize to JO for not knowing that a v4b in 1990 wasnt capable of running at 2 ohms , but since Corey is a bit of V4 expert i thank him for correcting me. Corey ya know maybe its time for and up grade to newer v4B then maybe you can expierence what it feels like to push LOW end into a 2 ohm load with your fingers threw your stings out of your speakers but only if you match the output Impedance of your new v4b to your speaker load if you dont you will shurly smoke those voice coils oh im sorry you may not play your bass with your fingers you probably only use a pick dont worry picks arent sensitive to Impedance i know because i do both. JO i hope you find the cab that works for you and don t ever stop beating up that bass ive played my first one at 12 years old ill be 60 here soon and i still love it loud, PEACE to you all

 

[Jo Ke]

So

A bit of an aside and not an answer to OPs question but the V4BH/classic series version of this amp can’t do 2 ohms. It has 4 and 8 ohm output only.

I have had a number of older V4s and have used them with a lot of different cabs.

I agree with @Wasnex if you want to get the most out of the amp find a cab with good sensitivity. I was happy with my V4 and a pair of 112AV cabs, the stack was a little taller than the 212AV but I think that’s a good option. The tuning of those cabs helps keep the low end tighter and they have a good midrange. Haven’t played the avatar stuff.

So as long as I get a high sensitivity cab that's 4 or 8 ohms I should be good. Do you know how much quieter the v4bh is compared to the original / ri? I've heard people say its quieter but I don't know by how much. Also there is an entire thread where a guy figured out that it didn't have balanced driver tubes and once he switched those out it got louder. Not sure if I should just return it and get something more reliable like a Bass Terror 500 or one of the new Venture series by ampeg.

 

[coreyfyfe]

So


So as long as I get a high sensitivity cab that's 4 or 8 ohms I should be good. Do you know how much quieter the v4bh is compared to the original / ri? I've heard people say its quieter but I don't know by how much. Also there is an entire thread where a guy figured out that it didn't have balanced driver tubes and once he switched those out it got louder. Not sure if I should just return it and get something more reliable like a Bass Terror 500 or one of the new Venture series by ampeg.

The manual for the V4BH states 100 watts at <3% THD, the reissue says 100 watts at 8% THD+N at 1kHz. Not exactly the same measurement but they should be pretty close. Bass gear magazine did a reissue vs original comparison and showed the reissue putting out 112 watts at the same 8%THD+N/1kHz while their vintage amp hit 123 watts. These numbers are all substantially similar. I wouldn’t worry about minor differences in output in that range.

https://ampeg.com/pdf/V4BH.pdf

https://ampeg.com/data/6/0a020a41e58d5e0b91edd46ce/application/pdf/Owner’s Manual - English .pdf

V-4B Old vs. New Head to Head | Bass Gear Magazine

I have a V4 and terror bass, among other amps. I generally prefer the tube heads for electric bass. I usually grab one of my 200ish watt amps, but that more a form factor thing. They’re more compact and lighter than my vintage V4. The 26” wide cabinet always annoyed me as it’s hard to fit on many modern cabinets. Even with a more narrow amp like my AD200 it’s still wider than some of the small modern cabs I’ve been using. The terror is nice, but has a very characteristic tone. You don’t get much range out of the eq, basically the amp works for you or it doesn’t. The ampeg tonestack is much more versatile.

 

[ArenW]

I'm currently running my 1976 V4B through a Fender Neo Pro 115 and it sounds amazing - so good that I'm strongly considering getting a second one for the bigger stages.

The V4B is only slightly wider than the cab so it doesn't look weird either. I made a copy of the Fender grill plate so I could easily swap out the look from a Fender grill cloth to vintage Ampeg just because I'm finicky like that (still waiting on delivery of the vintage blue and silver Ampeg style cloth from fliptops though....ordered over a week ago so starting to get antsy!)

 

[BaltBass5]

I have a V4B and I have it paired with the SVT 212AV cab and it is hard to beat that tone! It's also LOUD as hell!

 

[Bright Midnight]

Reviving this thread. I'm looking into the V4-B. I played the V4-B with an SVT 212 cab and a Spector CST and I cannot tell you how blown away I was. I am literally in love with the sound, but can I add another 212 cab to the head? I'm new to tube heads, never had one, and I've never really thought about ohms and stuff. The back of the head has multiple outs for cabs, and it doesn't make make much sense for an amateur like me. The 212 cabs are 4 ohms, so do I connect each cab to each of the 4 ohm outs on the back of the head? Also, I found the head and cab plenty loud, but I was in a fairly sized testing room so that may have played a role. Say I'd play a small venue outdoors with no FOH support for a crowd of 500, will the head and two 212's be adequate, or simply too little?

 

[coreyfyfe]

Here is the manual for the amp, you can see detailed connection options and impedance pairings on page 7.

Two 4 ohm cabs in parallel is 2 ohms so you would either connect both cabs to the 2 ohm jacks or connect the amp to one cab and use the parallel jack on the cab to connect the second cab. Both options would put the two 4 ohm cabs in parallel.

Be sure to use speaker cables.

https://ampeg.com/data/6/0a0005090b16661dac2aea04e/application/pdf/Owner’s%20Manual%20-%20English%20.pdf

Regarding the volume level. Personally I’ve played in plenty of situations with my vintage V4 and a 212 cab or pair of 112AV cabs with sufficient volume level. Indoors, outdoors, wherever. With a pair of 212 cabs I think it would work for me as well. Plenty of folks will chime in that it wouldn’t be enough for them. Depends a bit on how you eq the amp, how much big booming low end you want, and your tolerance for less-than-clean sounds.

The 212AV is rated at 99db, so a pair would be 102db sensitivity, which means a 100 watt amp could theoretically be hitting 122db. That’s pretty loud. Might not be evenly loud across the frequency response range.