Need tips on how to conduct auditions

[basseux]

We did overlap recently for 2 singers, but they could also be brought to do second vocals, which they did without us asking.

Although we had a fair idea, the issue was that it became blurry in our heads who sang what.

But we recorded everything, so we could be objective after that, so whatever you do, you should record the whole session in case of doubt, it should save you time.

 

[basseux]

-Get someone to sit in on drums when the singer auditions, even if you have to do it yourself instead of bass. Hard to really belt out a tune without drums.

I never really got why people believe it's better to have drums instead of bass.

Maybe in rock if bass part is close to the guitar part, but in funk or reggae you would leave out to much without bass.

 

[pepj]

Its more than possible I dont know the person but I'll try and find something rather than a blind audition.
(Nobody really bothers with them anymore but thats because they already know) but if you dont know you need convincing why you are having them along.
I wouldn't mind them singing a few lines down the phone...that would at least give me a reference and let me know how much further we are going.

Most impressive audition I recall was hearing a young girl sing, never done anything live..just a bedroom recording of
I will always love you..complete with key change and no backing at all.
She was as green as green could be, but had a good mentor and now...?? cant afford her lol
That girl is out there now killing it. The type of voice that when she sings, everyone looks to see who the hell is doing that... literally stops the room.
So, the point is, there are unknown quantities so I dont rule anything out, but you need something just so you aren't wasting everyones time

 

[MWKurt]

EDIT- Lobster is right about pre-audition communication, it can save time & trouble. I also STRONGLY suggest (read: insist) on them sending some form of media- YouTube, Mp3, etc. of their performance. If someone does not have anything, in this day & age, that's a red flag to me.

That said-

1)IME, (3) songs are more than enough to see if someone fits

2)Schedule slots 1/2 hour apart.

Not much more to add, other than if you like them, briefly discuss their expectations, availability, and whatever else is relevant, such as sharing rehearsal space costs and the like.

I doubt that the OP even has any audio/video of his playing being the least experienced in the band. Fot him to require it from others seems, wrong.

 

[Bass Viking]

I doubt that the OP even has any audio/video of his playing being the least experienced in the band. Fot him to require it from others seems, wrong.

A band looking for players should also have samples of their playing. It’s a two way street. As an auditionee I would want to know what I’m getting into.

 

[Bass Viking]

As far as the OP's decision-I've been in start-ups in the past, and have had the bad experience of players coming in, with no skills, no feel for the material; a total waste of time- All of which could have been avoided if we had heard them perform 1st.
Anybody can record a track or video at home, it doesn't need to be highly produced.
That's my .02 for him, take it FWIW.

+1. Too many people out there who overestimate their skill. On a side note, making a video of your playing is a great way to become a better player.

 

[Confunk]

I doubt that the OP even has any audio/video of his playing being the least experienced in the band. Fot him to require it from others seems, wrong.

Then it might be a good idea for him to make a track-even a basic cellphone recording- of his music. In order for anyone-beginner or pro- to attract the right player, it's smart to let them know what it is you're trying to do.

 

[gln1955]

+100 on having a videos on both sides. This is especially important for start-up bands and inexperienced players. Once you've been in a band or two and networked, people know you can play. Just starting out in the band scene or in a new city, not so much. Same for a band. Replacing a player in a working band, people know who you are. A start-up is an unknown.

It's more than easy to make something with a phone and simply lazy if anyone won't do it if asked.

 

[Confunk]

+1. Too many people out there who overestimate their skill. On a side note, making a video of your playing is a great way to become a better player.

+1000 The playback doesn't lie!

It's also a matter of STYLE- If I'm looking for a pocket/groove drummer, I wanna hear if the guy is a basher, or if the Singer sounds like Lemmy when I'm looking for Joss Stone.

IME a lot of responders are so anxious to play or get the gig, they'll claim to have skills in all styles...When they don't.

 

[bassicmike]

Can you borrow a drum set for the drummer auditions?

That way you have control of time.

One of the worst things during auditions is having someone in who takes forever to set up, and as soon as they start playing, you know they’re awful and not The One. Then they take forever to break down, during which you have to make pointless small talk until they leave.

Remember that the good candidates are checking you out as much as you’re checking them. Be ready and be professional.

May I ask you ask you a serious question? If you’ve only got 14 tunes together, it sounds like you’re a startup, rather than a gigging band. Be clear about this. Good drummers want a gigging band - a lot of the good ones are already in other bands.

Good luck.

 

[Confunk]

Can you borrow a drum set for the drummer auditions?

That way you have control of time.

One of the worst things during auditions is having someone in who takes forever to set up, and as soon as they start playing, you know they’re awful and not The One. Then they take forever to break down, during which you have to make pointless small talk until they leave.

Remember that the good candidates are checking you out as much as you’re checking them. Be ready and be professional.

May I ask you ask you a serious question? If you’ve only got 14 tunes together, it sounds like you’re a startup, rather than a gigging band. Be clear about this. Good drummers want a gigging band - a lot of the good ones are already in other bands.

Good luck.

Brings back memories to me...

We always used a studio w/ backline inc. a drum kit, but several times drummers really wanted to use their own set. I guess I get that; I prefer my own gear. However, the time it takes for even a "fast" drummer to set up is time wasted. And when there is disaster at the downbeat, then you pretty much have to smile, thank them for their time, and get a stiff drink later.


When we used to audition, I told my Wife/Vocalist that I felt that I could appraise a guitarists' skills as soon as he opened his case. There's something about the way a competent player sets himself up, carries his gear, tunes up, and gets ready to play....

 

[pepj]

On a sub gig with an unknown drummer...I can tell if I'm going to like them as soon as he hits the drum, maybe a triplet. Same if I'm watching a band's drummer set up.
Also being able to tune a kit well is a key key skill.

 

[Amano]

The way I do it. Pick five different style songs you play. Tell the key and what version you expect. Don’t overlap. Give them 30 minutes each. Ten minutes in between. Agree with the current members about rehearsel schedule, live schedule and pay. Style of music. And important be clear who is the bandleader. Don’t let them hang. Be nice, on time and don’t drink during this session. Do not enter friendzone with the last one having a drink. Start with the drummer.

 

[Egg250]

This one here, I second all of it.

As has been said, it seems there are no hard and fast rules. I've auditioned for others way more than I have auditioned others for me. But here are my thoughts:
As an auditioner:
Never audition 2 people at the same time. It's not fair to either participant to have to play off another person who may not be up to speed.

For sure, try to do all of your auditions for each role in one session. It can be brutal for a band to have to suffer through weeks of auditioning the same role and it's easier to compare your options when everything is fresh. For these that typically rehearse mid week, this can be a challenge because of time constraints, but keep the time frame as compact as possible.

Do allow buffer time between people. Allow at least 15 minutes to load in and 15 minutes to load out. Then another 15 minutes for the driveway to clear. Don't forget to include time to chat. Doing this during tear down is common, but there are distractions, so try to have a few minutes set aside to sit and chat - nothing else. This can be the most important part of the audition. Spacing multiple auditions at 90 minutes is about right.

Keep things moving. It is possible to have a relaxed, yet professional environment.

I like to pick out songs that demonstrate specific skills we're looking for, so I will specify which songs they need to have prepared. 4-6 is usually plenty. The audition should probably be different for each instrument. Songs that are good tests for the drummer are not necessarily good tests for the LS. I really don't care which songs they prefer. If there is enough time for a little jam after the formal audition, then you can explore any common ground.

Hopefully you have more than one candidate that could work. Be sure to deal with post audition communication professionally - don't burn your bridges.

Keep track of your secondary choices. It's not unheard of for a new member to abruptly quit (or be asked to leave) after a few weeks for any number of reasons. If nothing else you may be able to reach out to the second or third place person to sub for you - assuming the "sorry you didn't make it" news was delivered properly.

Make sure your band knows the material you're asking to be auditioned.

Don't just start grabbing stuff, but offer to help with the auditionee's load.

And maybe most important, be patient. It is tempting to settle for the person who is close enough wen nobody shined. Settling for the wrong person just drags out the process even further because you eventually have to start all over again. If you have a couple of "didn't knock me over but has potential" candidates, bring them back for a second audition with hopes that they were just having first date jitters for the first audition.

For both sides of the process:
It's about more then musical ability. Look for things about the other party that you like and things that you dislike. You are auditioning each other.

Be prompt and be ready. I waited over an hour at one audition because the LG was running late. This cut my session short because there as another waiting. (I still got the gig, but almost declined because of the late guy's lack of respect.)

You don't need to do the full audition. If things don't feel right and you know the fit is not good, it's just a waste of time to keep going.

Be appropriately groomed. I don't audition dressed to gig, but I am showered and wearing clean clothes. I expect the same of the other party.

Be as clear as you can regarding the administrative stuff before the audition is set. Discussions regarding rehearsal expectations, gig frequencies, travel?, pay structures, genre directions, strict cover copy?, etc can settle a lot of things before you even meet.

As an auditionee:
I like to see a band's full playlist, not just the audition songs. It gives me a better idea of what their game plan is. (I'll typically work up a good chunk of the full list - just in case there is an impromptu call out.)

Please have either a back line or at least an easy load in/out. (I guess this really doesn't apply to drummers and LS!) It really sucks having to dodge kids, dogs, expensive furniture or stairs when loading gear into someone's house.

Be clear in your communication. Don't make me guess what you want/mean.

If money is important, ask about typical gig pay.


Your biggest problem is that you are lacking a couple of key members and it is difficult for either party to audition without the other filled. I think in your situation, I'd be inclined to get the drummer in place, get them up to speed on your LS audition songs and then start the LS process.

Good Luck

 

[Wasnex]

I'll admit that I'm missing the actual point of this thread but it's a good opportunity to share a pretty famous and super cool study done about 20 years back on bias in orchestra auditions. Turns out you have to put up curtains so you can't see the candidate AND put down carpet so you can't hear their shoes before women get a fair shake at orchestra auditions.

Orchestrating Impartiality: The Impact of "Blind" Auditions on Female Musicians - American Economic Association

From a legal standpoint this sort of bias is a violation of labor law. Violation of the law is a matter for a major orchestras because they are employers. I also think eliminating the bias helps ensure the best musician is hired, which tends to be fairly important in professional orchestras. There is also a negative. Ignoring the bias can result in higher levels of interpersonal conflict down the road. Lot's of stories of cat fights in orchestra sections.

The importance and impact of bias is a bit different in the typical cover band. Most cover bands don't actually hire their members, so I don't think it's a matter of law. Bring a new member into a band is more like asking them to join sort of a collective. So I don't think it's necessary or even desirable to eliminate the bias. Although it's desirable to bring in good players, IMHO it's more important for the band to be made up of members who actually get along. The bias helps identify people with personalities you like and feel a connection with.

 

[drpepper]

Lot's of stories of cat fights in orchestra sections...

Fun factoid: Because "catfighting" is, by its dictionary definition, between women, it's often considered offensive and inappropriate as sexism. If your connotation is that it doesn't necessarily refer to women, you should be aware that not everyone sees it that way, and the context that you use it may not convey the unisex meaning that you intend.

 

[Wasnex]

Fun factoid: Because "catfighting" is, by its dictionary definition, between women, it's often considered offensive and inappropriate as sexism. If your connotation is that it doesn't necessarily refer to women, you should be aware that not everyone sees it that way, and the context that you use it may not convey the unisex meaning that you intend.

You mean like mansplaining (IMHO sexist, offensive, and often unfair), but AFAIK the me-too movement is fine with it. This is a great example as it uses a sexist and offensive term to label so called sexist and offensive behavior...and of course no female would ever engage in mansplaining, yeah right! And of course, no man never mansplain to another man...also yeah right!

FYI, My intent was to capture the nature of the quarrel with no reference to gender identity. The fights in orchestras tend to be more about posturing and bitter quarreling than actual fisticuffs. The way I see it, anyone can engage in a cat fight, regardless of gender. But feel free to be offended if you like.

I'll tell you what, if you have unisex substitute that effectively communicates the intended meaning, I will be happy to use it. But as far as I know, a gender-neutral replacement does not exist.

 

[Marko 1]

 

[micguy]

I'm guessing we will have maybe 2 or 3 drummers and 2 or 3 vocalists interested.

My first reaction is "you're screwed", but I should be more generous, so I'l simply say "If you're not darn lucky, you're screwed".

The reason I say that is that good vocalists are really hard to find - a large percentage of the population thinks they can sing, and most of them are wrong. Singer auditions are the worst - to find a good one, you may have to go through dozens of bad ones. I'fe you've ever watched the first show of any season of American Idol, they show a gem or two and a lot of folks that think they can sing, but clearly can't. If you've ever held singer auditions, you know that this is all too real.

Like many things, persistence is key - you can find a good singer, but in 2 or 3 people? I'd like to be wrong, but I think you're gonna need to audition many more than that.

Drummers? Really good ones are also hard to find, but not nearly as hard as vocalists.

Good luck!

 

[Bass Viking]

When we used to audition, I told my Wife/Vocalist that I felt that I could appraise a guitarists' skills as soon as he opened his case. There's something about the way a competent player sets himself up, carries his gear, tunes up, and gets ready to play....

I read something similar about when Phil Collins auditioned for Genesis. The band liked the way he sat down at the drums (before he even played a note). Maybe the player exudes confidence. Or maybe it’s the way he opens his case in a way that suggests it wasn’t 3 weeks since he last did it.