Double Bass New EDB-2 and EDM-1 from Headway For Trial

[Ric Vice]

Post-gig report:
I'm very impressed with this unit. In the bad performance space I mentioned yesterday, I decided to really test my rig and go without the Wizzy12 that I normally pair with the 10. So now it's Realist -> EDB-2 -> Focus SA -> Wizzy 10 on a pole mount.!

Nice addition to an already state of the art system. Did you buy Nathan's SA from the TB Classifieds? There are just so few of them in circulation, I was wondering if that was the case?

Pretty much left the settings alone but when I got to the gig, I found a slight flubbing coming from the Wizzy with the A string. Flipped on the notch filter, set it to low frequency and barely turned it up and voila, flubbing gone from the speaker. And my tone stays the same! Almost too easy! Basically the same thing Ric did. I was actually a little to loud and had to keep turning down a few times.!

This is exactly what I had to do on the concert Monday night, the nice thing about the notch on the EDB-2 (once I learned how to use it) is that it's narrow and "subtile" enough to not to sound invasive. Personally, I really benefited from words low, mid, and high now stenciled onto the notch filter's frequency control.

Sounded fantastic all night. Clear, didn't have much problems hearing myself and loved the tone I was getting. I'm going after a sort of amplified sound similar to Buster, Ron Carter, and George Mraz. I can also scrap the plan with switch to another set of strings since I'm digging the sound I'm getting now.!

Once the EQ is right, it's much easier to play on the strings you love, regardless of their composition and characteristics.

Another bonus was plugging in a passive mic and turning my rig into a PA to do announcements between tunes. The wizzy 12 will now likely sit at home and collect dust most of the time.!

A nice bonus, that Channel 2 input works really well with a DPA 4099B, or the ATM Pro 35. In combination with the Enrlund, the EDB-2 can be EQ'd to let the microphone put the "edge" on the Ehrlund's core tone.

I'm sold! Time to put the ol Fishman up for sale!

No better time.

Ric

 

[Huy Nguyen]

Naw, I've been using the SA for years. I bought it from another TB'er from the BG side. Love that thing. IMO, the only thing better could be if EA made a power amp version of the SA in a tiny little package no bigger than the EDB2.

And oh yeah: the strings I'm using are Labella Tapewounds. Yeah it's hard to bow but man I love the pizz sound they get.

 

[Ric Vice]

It looks to me like section 3 and section 11 of the manual contradict each other.

Meh

Gordon from Nova Strings contacted John Littler from Headway, here's the scoop from John himself.

"The input impedance settings have not changed from EDB-1 to EDB-2 and the Low/Active setting is 1 Meg Ohm ( NOT 50 Ohms), although we got it right in the "Electrical Specifications" further on in the manual.

I'll get onto it and change that in the next print run.

I am very pleased that you appreciate the sound of the unit, as we have spent a lot of time re-developing and improving everything from EDB-1. The concept was to get Pro Audio level quality. Audio Electronics Engineer and bass player, John East of ex Sony Pro Audio (Oxford) has had a lot to do with it."

Ric

 

[DB Slidefunk]

Now I've got used to using the EDB2 I'm getting good sounds from it and finding the notch really useful for some situations. One of the channels broke after a couple of weeks and they sent me out a new unit no questions asked, 4 days later. Now I have it I'll send the broken one back. Pretty good customer service.

 

[rickwolff]

Have a gig tonight at a little restaurant in Raleigh that is a fun place to play but tough to get a good sound. Last time I was there with a 5 piece I couldn't cut through and be heard. The bass was very dark and undefined. Last time I had sent on the EDB-2 to the next trial bassist (Hi Ric), and hadn't gotten my personal one yet. Tonight I'm hoping for much better results. Going early to set up and do sound check. Will probably blend the Lifeline with the Pro-35 mic and send everything to the PA from my Super Flightcase. Gives me lots of options to play with and I'm confidant I can get a good sound tonight. Fingers Crossed.

 

[Ric Vice]

Have a gig tonight at a little restaurant in Raleigh that is a fun place to play but tough to get a good sound. Last time I was there with a 5 piece I couldn't cut through and be heard. The bass was very dark and undefined. Last time I had sent on the EDB-2 to the next trial bassist (Hi Ric), and hadn't gotten my personal one yet. Tonight I'm hoping for much better results. Going early to set up and do sound check. Will probably blend the Lifeline with the Pro-35 mic and send everything to the PA from my Super Flightcase. Gives me lots of options to play with and I'm confidant I can get a good sound tonight. Fingers Crossed.

I've now done a Jazz Club, Auditorium, Church Service, Roof Top Outdoors, and several rehearsals. My equipment was always the same the Ehrlund Eap, Ehrlund Preamp, a Headway EDB-2, and the QSC K8. Each time the unit performed perfectly and covered, myself, the band, and the audience. This box is the bee's knees.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

My equipment was always the same the Ehrlund Eap, Ehrlund Preamp, a Headway EDB-2, and the QSC K8.

So you still needed the Ehrlund preamp? I wouldn't think it would be necessary on the Headway.

I quit using mine on the Clarus+ and I like it a lot better.

 

[rickwolff]

I kept it simple (probably the best policy anyway). Shen 7/8 Gemunder into Lifeline to EDB-2 to Super Flightcase. I tamed the beast of a room. I just rolled off a little of the low bass, very slight boost on the other knobs. Bass cut thru beautifully without the dark, muddiness that I had last time without the Headway. I'd like to A/B it with and without the Headway next time as the Super FC has a 5 bank EQ also, but thats what I had last time when I couldn't cut thru. Admittedly that was a 5 piece with drums (played softly) and this was a trio. But whatever it was, the sound I got tonight was both full and rich but still very clear. We had LOTS of compliments from people working in the restaurant - several mentioning specifically that the bass (and the whole group) sounded great. All in all a very rewarding gig. I'm tempted to think there is some kind of magic in the EDB-2.

 

[Ric Vice]

So you still needed the Ehrlund preamp? I wouldn't think it would be necessary on the Headway.

I quit using mine on the Clarus+ and I like it a lot better.

Don,
I think of it this way. If I were using either of my two Walter Woods heads, then I would use the Ehrlund Pre Amp into those amplifiers, because it's ruler flat all across the entire Double Bass frequency range. You don't have to use it, but Goran Ehrlund told me personally, that the EAP, and Ehrlund Pre Amp were designed as a system, and from my perspective he's absolutely correct. So, that's what I always do, and it always sounds fuller and more defined. Just my take, you certainly don't have to use one.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

Makes sense.

 

[pauliebass]

I've got one pedal to sell before buying the EBD-2. I'm pretty excited to get this into the return on my TH500.

 

[Ric Vice]

I've got one pedal to sell before buying the EBD-2. I'm pretty excited to get this into the return on my TH500.

PB,
I can't say enough about the upgrades that Headway put into the EDB-2. Just remember the EQ is a single channel affair, but there are separate volume controls for Channel 1 and Channel 2. In the new version you can assign the EQ to Channel 1, Channel 2 or both. The Notch and Phase can be assigned to either Channel 1 or Channel 2. They added the 1 Meg Ohm, 5 Meg Ohm, and 20 Meg Ohm, three way impedance to Channel 2, so that's available on both channels now. There is a now a Standby position on the power switch so you don't have to cycle the pre amp before turning on a powered speaker and they retained the three way "Range" (low cut) across both channels. On the bottom of the unit there is an assignable ring/tip phantom power switch for the stereo input on Channel 2.

Ric

P.S. If you wan't to play accompaniment for a solo performance, there is now an iPod 1/8" stereo input on the side

 

[Don Sibley]

I received "the package" from Ric a few days ago but only found time to try stuff out tonight.

I started out by hooking the DPA up the the EDB-2 and running that into a Yamaha DXR8 on a tripod at ear level. Fantastic sound, very acoustic, punchy, and immediate. I was able to get a fair amount of volume before feedback, way more than I was able to get using the Clarus+ and the MAS45. Despite my concerns, the 18v phantom power did a great job supporting my DPA. The EDB-2 is quiet and the EQ section works great. I couldn't really figure out the notch filter but I'm hoping to get a little more time with it later.

I could probably cover 80% of my gigs with this set up and be extremely happy with the sound and portability. If you don't need to be loud then this would be a simple, high fidelity rig and you could blend a pickup with it if you like. I already have an amp for that so I am only interested in using a mic with this set up. I'm tempted to get one of these rigs as an alternative to my "loud gig" amp rig. BTW, the DXR8 is hands down the best sounding, most affordable powered PA speaker I have tried, including Mackie, Yorkville, and QSC.

I posted my very positive experience with The Band here.

 

[Ric Vice]

I started out by hooking the DPA up the the EDB-2 and running that into a Yamaha DXR8 on a tripod at ear level. Fantastic sound, very acoustic, punchy, and immediate. I was able to get a fair amount of volume before feedback, way more than I was able to get using the Clarus+ and the MAS45.

The Headway EDB-2 has a Class A Pre Amp. Here's the description from the older EDB-1 manual "Refined Class "A" inputs with 2 FET stages" the EDB-2 manual has this description "Refined Class "A" inputs and Pro Audio IC components" so apparently they did a bit of tinkering with the box to reduce any noise coming off the unit.

Despite my concerns, the 18v phantom power did a great job supporting my DPA. The EDB-2 is quiet and the EQ section works great. I couldn't really figure out the notch filter but I'm hoping to get a little more time with it later.

18 volts is kind of the sweet spot for the DPA 4099B, it works well, and with the newly designed EDB-2 the unit is very quiet. I've used the notch as a low cut filter by setting the frequency knob to 50 Hz and using the narrowest (sharp) setting on the Q width. That tamed the lows instantly.

I could probably cover 80% of my gigs with this set up and be extremely happy with the sound and portability. If you don't need to be loud then this would be a simple, high fidelity rig and you could blend a pickup with it if you like.

My take is to get a really high quality power amp like the Demeter Minnie and make it my full time rig, using the QSC K8 for the smaller stuff, and adding the Minnie to drive larger cabinets.

I already have an amp for that so I am only interested in using a mic with this set up. I'm tempted to get one of these rigs as an alternative to my "loud gig" amp rig.......

Sounds Ideal, my idea is to take it one step further (not cheap mind you) and make the whole thing as portable and powerful as needed.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

Sounds Ideal, my idea is to take it one step further (not cheap mind you) and make the whole thing as portable and powerful as needed.

Ric

Have you thought about adding another powered PA speaker? You could loop two of these things together. Not the most portable but STEREO BASS!!!

 

[Ric Vice]

Have you thought about adding another powered PA speaker? You could loop two of these things together. Not the most portable but STEREO BASS!!!

Don,
These ideas always cross my mind, but then reality sets in.
If you did this, first there's the additional cost of purchasing a second
EDB-2 and second powered speaker, second there are always phase
issues, plus there's the slight delay created by separating the
speakers. I tried it a couple of times, and found it to be a
PITA. I've always preferred my Bass in Mono. There are more than a few
great jazz recordings where the bass really suffered when they were
remastered in Stereo. Shadow Waltz is one that comes to mind.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

Don,
These ideas always cross my mind, but then reality sets in.
If you did this, first there's the additional cost of purchasing a second EDB-2 and second powered speaker, second there are always phase issues,

You wouldn't need a second EDB-2, all of these little powered PA speakers have an XLR pass-thru that allows you to link multiple units together.

This thing about phase issues keeps coming up on TB and I don't understand it. Though I haven't tried it myself, how is having multiple bass speakers any different than running your bass through the house PA system in a club. I've never heard phase cancellation even with speakers on opposite sides of the stage.

 

[Ric Vice]

You wouldn't need a second EDB-2, all of these little powered PA speakers have an XLR pass-thru that allows you to link multiple units together.

Ah, so your talking about running a second powered speaker in Mono.

This thing about phase issues keeps coming up on TB and I don't understand it. Though I haven't tried it myself, how is having multiple bass speakers any different than running your bass through the house PA system in a club. I've never heard phase cancellation even with speakers on opposite sides of the stage.

I tried it several times. Once with a pair of Bag End 15M's on speaker stands, a second time with a set of Bose 802's, and a third time with a pair of B-15N (Double Baffle) Portaflex cabinets. When you stacked the cabinets together it sounded great. Spreading them out, across the stage like that, I'd get just enough delay between the two cabinets to drive me nuts. You don't notice it as much with a P.A. because the speakers are in front of you. I suppose you could run one of the cabinets in front of you, but that's a lot of additional gear to cart along. What does work for me is elevating a single speaker in rooms that have to much bass response.

t can also create problems with feedback, depending on where you are on the stage. I really prefer the instrument coming from a single point on stage. To my ears bass sounds better that way. Just my take.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

I see, I caused the confusion earlier when I wrote "STEREO BASS". I meant running to powered monitors in sequence. Seems like an inexpensive way to have a modular rig that always gives you your sound. Need a little extra gain, grab that second monitor.

I would think as long as you are equidistant from each source point the worst issue might be some mild comb filtering.

Did you always put the other speaker on the other side of the stage?

 

[Ric Vice]

I see, I caused the confusion earlier when I wrote "STEREO BASS". I meant running to powered monitors in sequence. Seems like an inexpensive way to have a modular rig that always gives you your sound. Need a little extra gain, grab that second monitor.

I would think as long as you are equidistant from each source point the worst issue might be some mild comb filtering.

Did you always put the other speaker on the other side of the stage?

That's what I experimented with, and found that it was better to just put the two speakers together in a linear array.

I also tried it with a pair of Euphonic Audio VL 108's, and although the delay between the two speaker's was very minute, it's there, and I playing that way just isn't comfortable for me. On a regular gig, playing in a quartet or quintet, with typical space constraints, it's pretty difficult to be equidistant from both speakers. So, for

me it's just not practical, nor did I like the results. Stereo's used to be set up with two full range speakers, spread equidistantly, while the many newer setups use a single separate sub and two satellites. From what I understand, higher frequencies, tend to benefit from that kind of dispersion, i.e. stereo guitar rigs etc. While low

frequency content, tends to be monophonic anyway, and sounds better coming from a single source. Just what I've gleaned from listening and reading. Results may vary and opinions may differ, I'm definitely not an expert on this stuff, I just know what I like to hear. If I want more I go FOH or roll out a bigger cabinet.


Ric

P.S. Most FOH systems have dual subs, so those folks can get that to work, but it's complicated.