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No options left - It's surgery for my tendinitis

The cast and dressings are off, and I can type with two hands again!!:hyper:

The nurse took care of the cast and putting fresh tape on my stitches. I met with the doc, and he told me everything looks great. When he did the surgery, he told me that not only was the tendon decayed, it was physically unattached from the bone! He couldn't figure out how I could play like that.:eek:

I had my ten year old daughter with me (snow day today), and she came up with the greatest lines when she saw the scar. She said that I can't tell people that the scar was from an operation. She told me that I should tell people that it was from either my days of wrestling with alligators or swimming with the sharks. This is one creative kid!:D

I then went off to physical therapy, and they got my arm straightened out. I can now take real showers, shave, tie my shoes, etc. I will be in physical therapy three times a week for the next month, and then will be cut loose to begin playing again, slowly and for short durations at first just to build my strength back up.

This has been quite a journey so far, but now that PT has started, the real fun begins. In about eight to twelve weeks, it will be like nothing ever happened.
 
Week One of Physical Therapy is over, and my business partner took me and a few friends into NYC for a surprise celebration that I'll discuss in a little while!

My therapist is perfect for me - he's a tri athlete in his '40's that knows exactly how to deal with knuckleheads like me - ex jocks that refuse to grow up!

PT is interesting in that I'm doing tons of exercises that I wish that I did all along. Therapy is divided into heat therapy, warm up exercises (really an, arm "bicycle") stretching, strengthening, massage, and then ice/electronic/ultrasound stimulation. The therapy itself is not painful; it is showing me where I'm still weak and what needs to be worked on. I still have a large lump of scar tissue where the tendon was reconnected, and the scar itself is still tight. I can only type or drive for so long before the area gets irritated again, so I need to keep building up slowly. They may release me to play for 5 minutes at a time in a week or so. That would be fun.

Now, on to the surprise! My business partner has been friends with Steve Gadd and his wife for the last 25 years or so. 30 years ago, he had jazz thing together in Woodstock, NY called L'Image. That band reunited for a 4 night run at the Iridium this week, and Marty (my business partner) got me, my guitarist, singer, and a couple of friends comped for one of the shows. Because of his relationship, we were ushered into the club early, and got to hang with the band after the show. Steve's wife sat with us for the show, and is just a delightful, funny, energetic woman - she also had Arlen Roth sit with us as well, and that was a treat!

Now, here is the surprise that was waiting for me - the bassist in the band was TONY LEVIN!! Tony and Steve came out and hung with us at our table, chatted it up with us, and treated us like we were friends forever. Tony and Steve are like Mutt and Jeff - Tony is about 6'4", and Steve is my size (5'5" on a good day). Tony wished me well with my healing. Gadd joked that he wants to jam when I'm better. To sound like Wayne and Garth, "I'm not worthy!!"

What an unbelievable night. I'm inspired to get through this to say the least!
 
My business partner is great. He knows how much I love to play, who my heroes are, and how much this meant to me. He also knows how scared and freaked out I was prior to having to have the surgery done. If you have a few good friends in this world that are there for you, then you have a lot!!

I have a shaved head, so the first thing Tony said to me was "nice hairdo!" He played a 5 string NS EUB and his Chapman stick, both amplified through a GK 700RB II and a Hartke cab. He killed it! Tony and Gadd together were amazing, and incredibly nice guys to boot.

My business partner is a huge Bruce Springsteen fan. My band has done pre show parties for Bruce in a bunch of cities, and my lead singer is a personal friend of the Boss, so I am going to repay the favor to him (Marty) this spring/summer when our record is done and the band is back out. I just gotta heal first!
 
Week 2 of physical therapy is in the books.

The large mass of scar tissue is still there, but it is slowly receding. The irritation in my right elbow is nearly gone, and the tightness across the scar is diminishing. The scar itself is healing very nicely, and shouldn't be noticeable in a few weeks. I might be released to play for a little while next week!

The new issue that I'm dealing with is that because I have been favoring my left arm through this process, the tendinitis in that elbow has come roaring back in a big way over the past two days. I'm doing ice massage on that elbow to try to calm that down. Yikes! The last thing I need right now is for this one to get to the point that my right was at. Worst case scenario is that I'll just deal with the discomfort until December, and if it's still there I'll probably have to get this one cut as well.

Oy!!
 
I've just completed my third week of physical therapy, and have one week to go!!

My right arm/elbow/tendon is getting stronger (although I'm no where near full strength), and I have my left arm tendinitis back under control. I was released to play about 5 minutes at a time this week, and it felt great. I am sticking to four string only for the foreseeable future, so my two remaining 5ers will probably go on the block soon - they are way too nice to sit unplayed, and if someone else can benefit from them, all the better! In terms of playing, I need to very carefully monitor my technique, lighten up on my touch, and be certain that my wrists are as straight as I can keep them.

Next week is my final week of PT, and then I will be back to my surgeon on March 26th. At that point, I should be ready to build up my endurance and strength further. I don't think that I will ever let myself get to the point that I was at with pain ever again, and I know that I will be utilizing the exercises, stretches, and strengthening methods that I am now using for the rest of my playing life.

Fergie Fulton and I have been having a private e mail dialog about tendinitis, and I wanted to share a part of our ongoing discussion here:

Hi Ed,
hope i find you in good spirits and with no complications or difficulties?
Just a check in to see how your getting on. A few questions on your experience if your up to it?


Have you noticed and improvement?
Was it immediate or graduale?
Has it made a difference?
What advice where you given to avoid such injuries in future? (if any)
Has it been worth it in your situation.

Please add any other info you may think may be relevent

Thanks Ed and here's hoping your well into your recovery?

Fergie

Fergie –

Nothing happens in a straight line, that’s for sure!

I was in a cast for about I ½ weeks, and now I’m in the middle of my third week of physical therapy. Surprisingly, PT has not been one bit painful. Following removal of the cast and getting my arm straightened out, the pain relief was immediate, but not complete. This is due to the tendon needing to be re stretched, and letting what really is a pretty traumatic wound begin and go through the healing process. I was given Oxycondone for pain. I took this for a week, and haven’t touched it since. I would rather have any pain that’s left let me know what I’m doing wrong and right. It is a very reliable gauge!

I still have a very large mass of scar tissue directly on the bone where the tendon needed to be reattached. I don’t get pain as much as I still get simple irritation at that spot. This is because I need to re develop muscle there! It took 48 years to develop that muscle the first time, and an hour to cut it out. I’m doing my exercises and stretching every day as recommended, and using counterclockwise ice massage in the morning and at night. What really needs to happen is for me to build up my endurance in that arm again, and this will take time. I can play, but I need to be very mindful of my technique and pressure. No more digging in; a light touch, low action, and letting the amp do the work is now in order. Also, no more 5 string basses for the foreseeable future, and I’m using lighter strings as well – no more .135 B strings!

The best advice I can give to anyone is to simply LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. If you are experiencing even a little pain, it is there for a reason and you need to take immediate steps to alleviate it and to correct the root cause. Being macho or tough about it is the absolute height of stupidity (and I speak from experience!) Use proper technique. We as bassists need to treat our elbows the same way that a long distance runner or a soccer (football to you!) player treats their knees, or a pitcher in baseball treats their throwing shoulder. We all should take steps to warm up properly and get those muscles moving to get bloodflow and fresh oxygen into those critical areas. We need to constantly stretch and do strengthening exercises away from the instrument. We need to be cognizant of our posture. We all need to breathe correctly when we play, and not get tense. When we’re done with the gig, we need to ice those elbows down for a few minutes, whether you feel any pain or not!

Would I go through the surgery again? As of now, yes, but time will tell. In my case, the tendon was off the bone, and completely decayed. Surgery turned out to be my only course of action. Had I addressed it properly earlier, things may have turned out differently for me. Right now, I’m doing everything I can so that the next 30+ years of my playing career can happen!

I hope that this was helpful for you. Stay in touch!

Ed

Hi Ed, great stuff, one more set of questions about you comment

Had I addressed it properly earlier, things may have turned out differently for me

Do you now truly believe that statement?
Can you pinpoint a time in your past when you should have done something but did not?
If so how did you reason that "it would sort itself out, or its not that much of a problem if you know what i mean?

Great to hear your warming up and down and using ice. The exercises away from the bass are important as are hand positions. I have found a neutral position in all my research, that led me to the conclusion for having the thumbs of both hands pointing at the head stock when ever possible. In this position if you look at the palms the carpel tunnel area is flat and the "carpel tunnel" that is created by having your thumbs in front of the fingers is gone. Try it yourself with your Physio. Hold your hands up in front of you, palms facing you and touch your thumb off each of your fingers starting with the little one. notice how the carpel tunnel reduces as you get to the forefinger and completely dissapears when you point both thumbs out. If you now turn your picking hand over in the position you will notice that your thumbs do indeed point toward the head stock. It is having an opposible thumb that is the problem, and a lot of the research suggests, sort the thumb position rather than the hand positon for carpel tunnel related problems.

Something to think about as you begin to play again and please ask your physio for an opinion i would like to hear it.
take care and speedy recovery
Fergie
________________________________________

Fergie –

I truly believe that statement. Had I addressed the problem while it was small, it would have saved me all of this grief! My whole goal in letting everyone else in on my experience is so that maybe I can help others avoid my mistakes.

I probably ignored the problem for about a year while it got progressively worse gig by gig. I finally broke down and got the first of three cortisone shots, and this turned out to be a temporary solution at best. Following the first shot, my arm was fine for a number of months. Believe it or not, I reinjured the arm lifting a trash can outside of my house. I felt a “pop” at the joint, and got immediate pain. That is probably when the tendon pulled off of the bone. I then went through two more rounds of shots, to no avail, over the next 1 ½ to 2 years. My overall recommendation on cortisone is that if the first round doesn’t work, don’t bother with the other two, unless they are a condition of your insurance coverage to get to the next step. At best, cortisone is a cover up, not a cure, and can only fool you into thinking that you are OK. You still need to take the other precautions (ice, stretching, strengthening, warming up the right way, proper technique, etc.), which I did not do. My attitude was that I was tougher than the problem, and that it would sort itself out. Big mistake!!

Next week is my final week of physical therapy. This is going well, and they have given me plenty to think about and do on a daily basis. Following PT, I won’t have access to either the ultrasound treatments or the electronic “tens” stimulation, but the ice, stretching, and strengthening exercises that I’m doing should be enough until I meet with my surgeon again on March 26th.

I’ve started playing on a limited basis again, and I’m building this back up slowly. I won’t be back into full gig mode until May or June, but I will be able to finish the recording project that was started prior to my surgery commencing in March.

Thanks for the advice on hand positions. I’m going to try it out!

Stay in touch.

Ed

The reason that I have kept this thread alive is that tendinitis is a very real occupational hazard for musicians, and can be career ending in some instances. I simply want to share my experience with everyone here as a precaution as to what can happen to any of us if you let this problem go on too long without addressing it (are you listening, Bikeplate??) When you are younger, you heal a lot more quickly. When you are a little older, regardless of how you choose to fool yourself, your body loses a lot of its' former elasticity, and you become more prone to these injuries. Consequently, healing takes longer!

I will continue to post updates, as I believe that everyone here can benefit from my saga!
 
My final week of physical therapy is over. It went well.

I still have weakness in my grip strength in my right hand, but that is to be expected. I also need to continue building up the strength in the elbow area where the tendons were cut out and reattached. Again, this is a process that will take time.

I am playing again, and also building that up slowly. At first, I could only go for 5 minutes without getting fatigued. I've built that up to an hour as of yesterday. I'm warming up slowly with scales, modes, intervals, arpeggios, and chord shapes, and looking for more efficient ways of getting the job done. To that end, I'm working through both the Paul Chambers book and the Jamerson book again. Both of these guys really understood efficiency and economy of motion! I've also gone back to 4 string after playing 5's exclusively for the past 6 years or so. I traded one of my 5's for a passive FSR Hot Rod Jazz, and had it strung with DR Low Beams (.40-.100), and had the action set up ridiculously low. My goal is to play with a much lighter touch.

Tonight is my first full scale rehearsal with my band. We are breaking in a new drummer who is just a groove monster, so this should be fun. I'm a little apprehensive, but excited at the same time. My gig schedule commences in earnest in mid May, so that will give me time to really get my act together.

I still get a little tingling and numbness along the ulner nerve area, but I have a series of stretches and exercises to deal with that. I will see what my surgeon tells me in a couple of weeks.

This thread has really turned into a personal blog of my journey, and I hope that others can benefit from this. As long as this community will indulge me, I'll keep the updates coming.
 
hey guys I just stumbled on this thread and being a massage therapist I am always curious about injuries. From my quick read of the posts I wanted to point out that tendonitis is a condition of tendon inflammation. Inflammation is generally a short lived scenario usually from an acute bout of over doing it or an injury. Long term tendon pain is generally caused by a progressive, noninflammatory break down of the tendons - this is called tendonosis. So rest, ice and anti inflammatory meds do not correct this tendonosis. It has been stated previously exercise, stretching, posture correction, correct technique can prevent this from happening. In my experience people w/elbow pain/tendon problems are over grippers - they grasp things to tightly and that will over stress vulnerable tendon attachments. Check this out for more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tendonosis.
Commreman: It sounds like your therapy process is going really well. On the bright side sometimes injuries are learning experiences that teach us something we couldn't learn/see before. Good luck
 
hey guys I just stumbled on this thread and being a massage therapist I am always curious about injuries. From my quick read of the posts I wanted to point out that tendonitis is a condition of tendon inflammation. Inflammation is generally a short lived scenario usually from an acute bout of over doing it or an injury. Long term tendon pain is generally caused by a progressive, noninflammatory break down of the tendons - this is called tendonosis. So rest, ice and anti inflammatory meds do not correct this tendonosis. It has been stated previously exercise, stretching, posture correction, correct technique can prevent this from happening. In my experience people w/elbow pain/tendon problems are over grippers - they grasp things to tightly and that will over stress vulnerable tendon attachments. Check this out for more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tendonosis.
Commreman: It sounds like your therapy process is going really well. On the bright side sometimes injuries are learning experiences that teach us something we couldn't learn/see before. Good luck

That is an interesting fact about "overgripping". Degenerative conditions occur over time. About 12 years ago I was into competitive mountain biking, and your rear brake is controlled by your right hand. This was before modern disc brakes existed on bikes, and on certain downhill singletrack sections you would need to maintain a death grip on your rear brake! I'm absolutely certain that the damage may have occurred then, as mountain biking is hell on your hands and elbows, and that the condition was further exacerbated over the years through music. In any event, my right elbow completely broke down!

You are right - this has been a learning experience and a half!
 
This is from a recent NY Times article about treating sports injuries (tendons, ligaments) w/injections of the patient's own blood to stimulate repair. This is cutting edge stuff and it really makes sense to encourage the body to repair itself. Check this out
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My brother knows a police officer that went through the platelette therapy described in the article, and I also asked my surgeon about it. If my injury wasn't so far gone when I finally did something about what turned out to be a separated tendon, it might have made sense. Also, because that modality is still considered experimental, my insurance wouldn't cover it. I don't have a professional athlete's bank account, but if I did I probably would have insisted on at least trying this prior to getting cut. I tried everything else under the sun! As far as the police officer that my brother knows goes, this therapy worked in only one area of his body, but everywhere else he got little to no results.

I just got back from my first rehearsal since the surgery. We blew through about 25 tunes. My arms are tired, and there was a little swelling when we were done, but no pain. I just got done icing down both elbows, and I will take an anti inflammatory before going to bed, and see how I feel in the morning. In any event, it was great to play again!
 
I haven't posted here in a while.

Yesterday I went back to my surgeon for the final post op review. Everything is healing nicely.

Yesterday was also big in that I finally made it back into the studio to continue tracking for our new record for the first time since surgery in January. I can't tell you how unbelievable it felt, and how much gratitude that I have that I am able to continue doing the one thing in my life that I really love to do. Our producer accepted a gospel flavored thing that I wrote during my downtime for the record as well. Given what I have been through, I'm humbled, thankful, and also stoked!

I'm still doing all of the exercises for both arms. I am nowhere near 100%, but by continuing these exercises daily, I'm gonna have Popeye forearms in no time! (I might have to change my avatar.) The irritation comes and goes in both arms, but it is nowhere near the pain that I have had for the last few years. As long as I continue to ice my elbows down nightly after stretching, this should diminish with time.

The moral of the story is listen to your body, and deal with things while they are minor. Never take anything for granted in this life, whether it's your music, your family, whatever. Anything can be taken from you in an instant for a myriad of reasons beyond your control. Appreciate and be grateful for the ability to do what it is we do, no matter where your chops are at, and no matter what the naysayers are saying. We as a community of musicians have been given a wonderful gift. Don't ever squander it, and don't take it lightly! You never know when your last gig will be. Cherish it all. I know that I do.
 
Thanks for all the time and insight you've put into this. As a former soccer player, I totally understand everything you're talking about. I opted to end my playing when I saw the images from all the damage done to my knees from 15 years of playing: tendonitis, bursitis, chondromalacia (hardcorreeee damage). I still don't trust most knee surgeries even to this day and decided to hang up my jersey. I miss playing a lot but I still have trouble running more than two miles (and being a left outside midfielder? bahh.).

I was searching for "elbow pain" since I played a 3-hour gig last night (mostly '70s rock: Doobie Brothers, Bob Seger, Allman Brothers, Eagles, et al) and experienced pain in both of my elbows later before I went to bed. I've never really experienced this before, so I'm not sure what's going on. I've actually been playing with a lighter tough lately, too. Maybe I was playing tense and overgripping like powerbass suggested. It was a last-minute call and I had never played songs like that before. Strange, huh?

Here's a shot from last night:
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I've been trying to move towards a "floating thumb" approach but it's not gig ready yet. Most of the pain is actually in the left hand, not my right.
 
Thanks for all the time and insight you've put into this. As a former soccer player, I totally understand everything you're talking about. I opted to end my playing when I saw the images from all the damage done to my knees from 15 years of playing: tendonitis, bursitis, chondromalacia (hardcorreeee damage). I still don't trust most knee surgeries even to this day and decided to hang up my jersey. I miss playing a lot but I still have trouble running more than two miles (and being a left outside midfielder? bahh.).

I was searching for "elbow pain" since I played a 3-hour gig last night (mostly '70s rock: Doobie Brothers, Bob Seger, Allman Brothers, Eagles, et al) and experienced pain in both of my elbows later before I went to bed. I've never really experienced this before, so I'm not sure what's going on. I've actually been playing with a lighter tough lately, too. Maybe I was playing tense and overgripping like powerbass suggested. It was a last-minute call and I had never played songs like that before. Strange, huh?

I've been trying to move towards a "floating thumb" approach but it's not gig ready yet. Most of the pain is actually in the left hand, not my right.

A fellow outside left midfielder!! It's good to meet you, brother!

Fortunately for me, my knees are the only things that I haven't damaged playing ball. I finally hung up my jersey at 45 (at the not so subtle request from my "CEO") after I tore both calves in the same year.

I played a three hour gig last night. It's great to be out again, as I could have been finished for life. I am taking every precaution there is. Before and after the gig, I stretch. When I get home, I fill two bowls with ice, turn the TV on, and stick my elbows in the bowls for 20 to 30 minutes. The following morning, I do five minutes of cross friction ice massage on both elbows. Arnica, both internally and externally, is also part of the equation. I'm doing my own physical therapy five times a week (my forearms are getting huge!) Overall, while there are still occasional twinges and minor flareups, I am healing nicely.

Overgripping can be a real issue. I have been using a "power grip" tool as part of my therapy - It has individual finger pads and tension. The way I look at it, my hands are getting so strong at this point that I don't need to maintain a death grip. The new and increasing strength has actually aided me in using a lighter touch with both hands. In terms of my right hand, I'm letting the amp do the work and playing with a very light and gentle touch. By switching to a passive Jazz bass, the bass itself lets me know when I'm digging with my right hand too much simply by the change in tone.

The bottom line is to just be mindful and aware, and you can overcome this, or not develop these issues to start with!
 
Could you post more info on this, please?
When I was percussing full time I was using a Dynabee, and that helped my forearms,
but I'm not familiar with a power grip tool.

It's called "Pro Hands" -

I am using this one (the red version, medium strength)

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I bought mine in a local sporting goods store. You can get them at Modells, Dicks Sports, etc. I am using this, as well as light ten pound dumbbells.

What is the Dynabee?
 
It's a gyroscopic wrist exerciser. I guess now it's called DynaFlex, but it's the same thing.

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Since my original Dynabee was stolen (years ago) I just bought one on Ebay.
There's somebody selling a bunch of them at a really good price.
 
A fellow outside left midfielder!! It's good to meet you, brother!

Fortunately for me, my knees are the only things that I haven't damaged playing ball. I finally hung up my jersey at 45 (at the not so subtle request from my "CEO") after I tore both calves in the same year.

:) You too! I couldn't imagine playing any other position. Being me was a bit of a novelty, since there aren't a ton of lefties around in general and since I was very comfortable with both feet. My difficulty has always been that I wasn't a consistent player. (It wasn't a matter of will either.) But when I was on? Oh man. :) Talk about a pain to the other team with my crosses/corners and my knuckle ball of a shot. My nickname was "The Connection." Hahaha. I miss playing.... :(

Overgripping can be a real issue. I have been using a "power grip" tool as part of my therapy - It has individual finger pads and tension. The way I look at it, my hands are getting so strong at this point that I don't need to maintain a death grip. The new and increasing strength has actually aided me in using a lighter touch with both hands. In terms of my right hand, I'm letting the amp do the work and playing with a very light and gentle touch. By switching to a passive Jazz bass, the bass itself lets me know when I'm digging with my right hand too much simply by the change in tone.

I think I've definitely noticed that the low frets and scale length on my Lakland may have something to do with me "feeling" like I'm not getting a proper fret, and thus gripping a little differently, and having to stretch my fingers. The other part, I'm sure, is just my technique and angle.

The bottom line is to just be mindful and aware, and you can overcome this, or not develop these issues to start with!

So, where are some good pictures of people with "textbook" technique (or at least "very good," knowing there are variations to what's "acceptable")?
 
I just checked out your photo. The angle of your wrist on your right hand will lead to trouble!

In terms of good technique, google any photo of Steve Harris. He plays with the bass at the right height, with straight wrists.

When I played ball, my nickname was "Buzzsaw". You can figure out what happened if anyone got between me and the ball!
 

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