Not everyone is on FaceBook......

[KevInDaBassment]

When it comes to band stuff, you have an excellent point OP. "Rant" seems like a term that's implying whiny, you are making a legit argument here so it doesn't come off whiny.

The amount of ads and other crap you deal with on Facebook does make it difficult to deal with, especially if you don't use it personally. Since I don't exactly have a band, I use SoundCloud for song hosting that I send to potential band prospects and such.

 

[Jughead6]

I work with a guy who plays guitar in a pretty successful cover band for hire. He's in his early 20's, so considerably younger than me. He makes decent 2nd income playing weddings and private parties.

Guess what? No band FB or website. They get all of their business by (a) being really good and (b) word of mouth.

IMO word of mouth is the best kind of advertising because it's someone else telling the world how great you are, and is more honest than the shameless self-promotion and blatant exaggeration we often see on FB.

 

[two fingers]

great thread! (kinda) - did anyone see the part where this wasn't supposed to be a facebook bashing thread?

i think this is a great topic for us to discuss. where is the happy medium?

1. facebook is a great way to get your stuff out there. getting tougher though - paying to boost posts and whatnot

2. many people don't have facebook...how do you reach them?

3. even if your post reaches 1,000 people, does anyone go to your show? do facebook people leave their houses?

4. facebook is not what it was - it seems most people in the feed are:
a. photographers
b. wine and sip
c. musicians - do people even look at event invites anymore?
d. rodan fields
e. political trolls
just people selling stuff and starting fights....i never thought i'd wish for more cat photos!

5. where do you go to get your band out there? for me, i've found you have to a little of everything....which includes talking to people!

6. i don't have a personal facebook page but my wife does so we do all the promo for our band through our page and then share it through her account - she has 1200+ friends and that's how we get it out there. but if you only have a few friends and a few likes and you don't want to pay to boost your post, it seems hardly worth it.

so....now that the facebook bashing is done.....what do you do or suggest?

Neat post. If I am reading it correctly, you and I are drawing the same conclusion.

How does one track the data regarding effectiveness of a Facebook as opposed to a website (or any other methods for that matter)? Only when you TRACK your successes and failures can you REPEAT the successes and DISCONTINUE the failures.

 

[slagheap]

I work with a guy who plays guitar in a pretty successful cover band for hire. He's in his early 20's, so considerably younger than me. He makes decent 2nd income playing weddings and private parties.

Guess what? No band FB or website. They get all of their business by (a) being really good and (b) word of mouth.

IMO word of mouth is the best kind of advertising because it's someone else telling the world how great you are, and is more honest than the shameless self-promotion and blatant exaggeration we often see on FB.

yes, THIS. not on FB, plenty of gigs.

 

[gregmon79]

What works better, in your opinion?

Getting out to local shows and venues, foot work, handing out flyers and CDs, calling and or emailing one on one. It adds a huge personal touch and attention to your potential audience that is far and away better than promoting on FB. Again, not saying FB is worthless. But it's not the way I choose to primarily promote our band. There are many ways but the ones I have found that work best so far are getting out to local shows and spreading the word. I realize it takes a lot of time and patience. And work. But that is what I believe works. So that's how we do it. Predominately.

 

[rufus.K]

I also dont have a FB account. I cant say Ive yet found a reason to have one.

 

[gregmon79]

I work with a guy who plays guitar in a pretty successful cover band for hire. He's in his early 20's, so considerably younger than me. He makes decent 2nd income playing weddings and private parties.

Guess what? No band FB or website. They get all of their business by (a) being really good and (b) word of mouth.

IMO word of mouth is the best kind of advertising because it's someone else telling the world how great you are, and is more honest than the shameless self-promotion and blatant exaggeration we often see on FB.

The cover scene is a tad different. However, that does work local original scene as well. Just not quite as fluently. Just depends on a lot of things. But you are right.

 

[garp]

How does one track the data regarding effectiveness of a Facebook as opposed to a website (or any other methods for that matter)? Only when you TRACK your successes and failures can you REPEAT the successes and DISCONTINUE the failures.

This is the essence of smart direct marketing. Unfortunately, few marketers put the metrics in place for learning.

Some folks that I played with years ago currently have a dedicated website and a FaceBook page for their band. Their FaceBook page is one of the ways they promote gigs. However, IMHO, stats like "263 people invited, 14 interested, 3 attended" isn't really the kind of information I'd want to be broadcasting to venues.

 

[guy n. cognito]

Neat post. If I am reading it correctly, you and I are drawing the same conclusion.

How does one track the data regarding effectiveness of a Facebook as opposed to a website (or any other methods for that matter)? Only when you TRACK your successes and failures can you REPEAT the successes and DISCONTINUE the failures.

They provide metrics...

 

[red_rhino]

Interesting and timely thread. Personally, I'm not a fan of FB. I've said before that anyone who knows me, knows how to find me; and anyone who doesn't know how to find me, isn't someone I was to be in touch with. I also think things like FB have the potential to warp our society in ways that aren't necessarily healthy. (Anyone see the first episode of this season's Black Mirror?)

However, I've recently moved to an area where the music scene is very limited. I'd like to connect with other players, and the Craigslist postings for musicians in this area are pathetic. I think a LOT of the people in this community are on FB, because I know there are a LOT of other musicians living locally. I also know that FB is where a lot of other people in this community hang out for their special interest groups.

So for the first time, I'm considering joining FB in some limited form; perhaps only as a showcase for my solo bass stuff that I can then use to network with other players in the area.

I think things like FB are useful as long as they serve you, and not the other way around.

 

[fhm555]

I had a FB account for a minute, but no more.

Oddly enough, when i had the account and was in a few local and regional musician's and music gear groups, i was flipping a lot of basses and getting regular calls for full and part time work playing.

Theses days, not so much, but i've kinda throttled back on horse trading basses and i stay as busy as i want playing, so i don't miss it.

 

[two fingers]

They provide metrics...

Nah. What I am referring to as far as tracking is virtually impossible. I was talking about tracking what ACTUALLY put butts in seats at your shows. In other words, how did the majority of people at the show hear about it and how do you prove it? I wasn't talking about Internet traffic, rather human traffic into the club at the exact moment your band is playing.

 

[Plutonium244]

..... and from what I read and hear they are not a "hip" as they used to be. Why bring that up here?

Because I'm a guy who shops bass gear. And I'm a guy who will actually look up your band if you mention it here and possibly check out some of you music. And I am unable to see your content, or buy your products, if you are only on Facebook!

I am not "old school" per say. Honestly, I just don't want the drama of social media. I did the MySpace thing and it sucked. People getting passed if you didn't respond to everything they said about you or posted on your page. Women flirting with me although I was married. Just not my thing. I was glad to see it fade away and had no interest in Facebook.

How much can a decent Web site really cost? I mean, I can build one and I'm not exactly a computer nerd. There are hosting and building site everywhere.

There are bound to me lots of us....and not just the older "get off my lawn" crowd. With so little money and effort needed to get a web site up, why cut off such a larger part of your potential market?

This is not a plug, rather an example of what I am talking about. This is a personal friend I fill in with from time to time when she comes this way. She built this Web site and has zero experience with such things. You can buy stuff through it, find her schedule (when she updates it), contact her and link to all of her social media.
Invalid Link Removed

According to her it didn't take all that long. And I think it looks "clean".

Point is, if she can do it, bass builders and bands can too.

Is there something I'm missing? Or am I fooling myself as to how many people on the planet don't use Facebook?

Edit: TO clarify, this is NOT an anti-Facebook rant. (Or at least it wasn't intended to be.) If you use/enjoy Facebook, that is great. I am not putting you down in any way. I was literally kicking off a discussion with regard to ADDING a website to your e-marketing package....and whether or not it is even worth it to do so any more. And I was/am also curious as to whether or not any of you have data regarding website traffic for your band/company/product. Sorry if that wasn't clear. I am not "against" anybody. I am NOT advocating getting rid of your Facebook page, either personally or for your band.

What web-builder site did your friend Emily Minor use to design her site? It IS pretty clean.

Facebook is a necessary evil for communicating with venues who might want to hire us, recruiting potential patrons at our gigs, and general networking/visibility. We have a venue that "goes live" with video on facebook at the start of the gig, and gets responses and quite a lot of views, including someone else who wanted to hire us (with whom she connected us, through facebook). So there is value.

I want to put together a website for my current outfit if it can be done economically (facebook = free promotion) since not everyone IS on facebook, and most people including me feel I should be able to pull any business up on the web. I am sometimes suspicious of businesses that "only" exist on facebook. If a landscaper only has a facebook business page, I am not sure he or she is really a professional landscaper.

Facebook is not that great for keeping a master schedule that people can view/download/etc. A convenient side benefit of a website is that there would then be a "master gig schedule" that any band member can consult at any time to make sure we all have the same dates on our calendars. We are not technologically integrated enough (some of us) in this band to do google calendar sharing etc. so a website with the master schedule would also help the band-- the guy booking may not remember to contact every member with each and every added gig, cancelled gig, changed-start-time gig, changed-date gig etc., but if he puts it on the website then no one has an excuse just in case one of those calls falls between the cracks. Everyone checks the website a couple times a month to make sure their calendar is up-to-date, as a fail-safe in case one of those calls doesn't get made.

Realistically, facebook AND a website are in order, but I understand if some people may just want to do the free way, which reaches a lot of people. A website is a point of reference and an easily e-mail-able link for anyone to send information about the band or check for information.

 

[two fingers]

This is the essence of smart direct marketing. Unfortunately, few marketers put the metrics in place for learning.

Some folks that I played with years ago currently have a dedicated website and a FaceBook page for their band. Their FaceBook page is one of the ways they promote gigs. However, IMHO, stats like "263 people invited, 14 interested, 3 attended" isn't really the kind of information I'd want to be broadcasting to venues.

Exactly. I suppose there isn't a great way to track HOW a person learned of you show or what information they used to decide to attend. Maybe give away something free to anyone who answers the question? That could, of course, be costly.

 

[guy n. cognito]

Nah. What I am referring to as far as tracking is virtually impossible. I was talking about tracking what ACTUALLY put butts in seats at your shows. In other words, how did the majority of people at the show hear about it and how do you prove it? I wasn't talking about Internet traffic, rather human traffic into the club at the exact moment your band is playing.

Unless you intend to survey everyone at your gigs, that's not data a band is going to be able to derive...

 

[two fingers]

What web-builder site did your friend Emily Minor use to design her site? It IS pretty clean.

Facebook is a necessary evil for communicating with venues who might want to hire us, recruiting potential patrons at our gigs, and general networking/visibility. We have a venue that "goes live" with video on facebook at the start of the gig, and gets responses and quite a lot of views, including someone else who wanted to hire us (with whom she connected us, through facebook). So there is value.

However Facebook is not that great for keeping a master schedule that people can view/download/etc. I want to put together a website for my current outfit if it can be done economically (facebook = free promotion) since not everyone IS on facebook, and most people including me feel I should be able to pull any business up on the web. I am sometimes suspicious of businesses that "only" exist on facebook. If a landscaper only has a facebook business page, I am not sure he or she is really a professional landscaper.

And, a convenient side benefit of a website is that there would then be a "master gig schedule" that any band member can consult at any time to make sure we all have the same dates on our calendars. We are not technologically integrated enough (some of us) in this band to do google calendar sharing etc. so a website with the master schedule would also help the band-- the guy booking may not remember to contact every member with each and every added gig, cancelled gig, changed-start-time gig, changed-date gig etc., but if he puts it on the website then no one has an excuse just in case one of those calls falls between the cracks. Everyone checks the website a couple times a month to make sure their calendar is up-to-date, as a fail-safe in case one of those calls doesn't get made.

Realistically, facebook AND a website or in order, but I understand if some people may just want to do the free way, which reaches a lot of people. A website is a point of reference and an easily e-mail-able link for anyone to send information about the band or check for information.

Great post. And I don't know what she used. I'll find out and either post or PM you later.

 

[two fingers]

All I can say is that even though we haven't drawn any firm conclusions the discussion so far is great.

 

[two fingers]

Unless you intend to survey everyone at your gigs, that's not data a band is going to be able to derive...

Agreed. And therein lies the quandary. How do you know what works if you can't quantify attempts vs failures in any way? How can you improve and/or streamline your marketing if you don't know the number of flyers or Facebook invites that resulted in someone actually attending your show? This what percentage of each worked? This which one should you spend more energy and/oronly on?

Stir in Web hits, radio interviews, emails, word of mouth and, honestly, you can't get a clear picture of what is effective and what isn't.

Which leads me back to my initial question. Why JUST facebook for so many organizations?

 

[wintremute]

Facebook is a tool of El Diablo. It robs you of your soul, and creates only emptiness in its place. It was created by the worldwide global conspiracy to spy on you, and it will loosen your fillings while finding its way into your wallet. It is pure evil, and must be purged. Or maybe it's the turnips I ate. I forget.

Finally! Someone who wants to talk turnips. SCREW THOSE CARROTS!

 

[guy n. cognito]

Agreed. And therein lies the quandary. How do you know what works if you can't quantify attempts vs failures in any way? How can you improve and/or streamline your marketing if you don't know the number of flyers or Facebook invites that resulted in someone actually attending your show? This what percentage of each worked? This which one should you spend more energy and/oronly on?

Stir in Web hits, radio interviews, emails, word of mouth and, honestly, you can't get a clear picture of what is effective and what isn't.

Which leads me back to my initial question. Why JUST facebook for so many organizations?

FB is free. You can see how many people you reach, but not how many actually show. Given the number of people on FB, and the number you can reach (again, for free), the better question is why wouldn't you do it?

Even several here who are saying that FB is a low end tool for marketing seem to have a large and active FB presence.....