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Not getting enough 'punch'

megadan

megadan

Jun 10, 2006
3,002
26
Halifax, Nova Scotia
www.myspace.com
#1
Wasn't quite sure where to post this but my suspicion lies towards the bass.
Basically the problem is that I don't feel I'm getting enough 'punch' from my rig. Attack, that is.
I'm not quite sure where the problem is.
My basic setup is Squier VM Jazz (with American Fender pups, CTS pots) into a GK1001RB and an NV610.

That amp/cab combo should be punch city, right??

Effects chain is generally:
BBE Opto Stomp --> Bass Big Muff --> 3xFx Fatman --> Polish Love OD --> EH Pulsar --> Stereo Memory Man

I bought the compressor to try and help this problem, and while it is subtle (the Opto stomp), I like it, especially at low volumes. But it doesn't seem to help the punch problem.


I'm thinking about getting an 800RB because I'm not getting that GK growl from hitting the rails. There's no way I should need to change cabs. I'm going to try some of my other basses (ie, Stingray), because that should equal punch city. Maybe this Jazz bass setup isn't sending any punch :confused:
 
#4
Ric5 said:
one of the ways to get more punch is to sync in with a good drummer who knows how to use his kick drum and has it miked into a big pa with 18" subwoofers.
Click to expand...

See that's the problem, sort of. My drummer is very good and knows how to kick with the bass. He likes big punchy bass drums. I feel like I'm not keeping up with him!

I'd tried boosting low and hi mids on the GK, but the notes still don't 'leap' out like it seems like they should.
 
#6
Is this your first jazz bass? To me jazz basses are the least punchy basses out there.

A jazz bass pokes through the mix, but it doesn't provide that pillowy punch, especially when compared with a P-bass or stingray.

Adding a lot of low mids might help you but I personnaly really don't like to over Eq if a bass doesn't provide the tone I'm looking for.

I'm not saying jazz basses are not good, not at all, but if you want a fat punchy sound they might not be the best tool around.

All of this of course IMO
 
#7
bassplayer7770 said:
Does the bass have a good setup?
Click to expand...

I do setups for myself and many other people; the setup on this bass is pretty good. A not totally perfect neck prevents getting the action any lower, but I'd say it's at a healthy medium action. Other aspects of the setup are good.

Technically this is my first jazz bass, but I love the sound so much in theory.
I'm going to try my Stingray and see what the difference is. I've never thought of a p-bass as 'punchy' before, just 'thumpy' - close but not quite the same! Punchy to me is fast mids, where thumpy is fast lows.

I've recently started cutting my highs strongly on the bass and amp, to try and get more of the two guitars to come through in my band, without cranking volume knobs.
 
#11
standupright said:
this may be a dumb question, but i didn't see it mentioned. how are you blending your pups?
Click to expand...

generally both pups on full. I have a series/parallel switch that I throw on sometimes for for bottom end.

kraigo said:
Pluck closer to the bridge.

KO
Click to expand...

I play with a pick about 70% of the time, and I play very close the the bridge. It's my default picking place. My fingers aren't strong enough to pluck hard near the bridge all the time.




Oh the other thing I was going to mention was that this bass has a very low output. I wonder if adding a preamp would be of any service?
 
#12
just a suggestion -

set your amp eq and other controls (besides volume) to 12 o'clock.
set your pup knobs to 12 o'clock
play
adjust your pup blend first (try full neck and pull back on the bridge pup)
play and continue adjusting until you find the bass's tone.
then adjust your eq/controls
 
#13
megadan said:
Oh the other thing I was going to mention was that this bass has a very low output. I wonder if adding a preamp would be of any service?
Click to expand...

Is it louder and punchier in Series mode? Assuming the pickups are already close enough to the strings and the rest of the setup is okay, a preamp would likely help increase output. I recently found out there are also ways to keep a bass passive and still increase output. I had a Villex Passive Rotary Tone Booster installed in my Hanewinckel 5-string. I think the bass version is called the Compressor 45 or something like that, and the settings are 0 (natural), +4db, +7db, and +10db. To my ears, each subsequent setting seems add a bit more mids and roll off more highs while increasing output. And, no, it doesn't require a battery.
 
#14
standupright said:
just a suggestion -

set your amp eq and other controls (besides volume) to 12 o'clock.
set your pup knobs to 12 o'clock
play
adjust your pup blend first (try full neck and pull back on the bridge pup)
play and continue adjusting until you find the bass's tone.
then adjust your eq/controls
Click to expand...

+1 to this...............
Do it without your effects in the signal chain first, you've got so much *stuff* modifying the signal, then add them back into the chain one at a time.
 
#16
As counter-intuitive as this might seem... it worked for me. Do a pickup upgrade. Try Villex's passive pickups, put them as close to the strings as you can. It's midrange control should give you every kind of punch you'll need and you won't need the preamp!
-Ryan
 
#18
Im facing a similar problem. I do love the punch i get from my Fender P5 but I recently got a Lakland DJ5. Love it to bits and the tone, at home, is great but its just not cutting it at gigs like the P5 does. I play with a pick most of the time although since i got the DJ5 ive found i can play a bit more finger style.
This is my first Jazz for about 4 years, i have a Hw1 Jazz but never use it, so the difference in tone came as quite a shock.
Nothing i do can get me that punch i have with my P5, even using the same strings. Ive played with the EQ on my amp and i can get some nice enough tones but they all seem to lack something.
In the next few weeks ill have a P pup in it, as far as i can see thats my only option.

Good luck with your quest.
 
#19
megadan said:
Thanks for all the suggestions, I'm going to try and start from scratch, and without the pedals in the chain.
Click to expand...

And, just because no one's said it yet, try turning the contour knob on the GK all the way off (counter-clockwise). That'll "de-scoop" the tone.

And, as mentioned by someone else, try soloing the neck pickup. Years ago, I learned a valuable Jazz Bass lesson when I was playing in a band with a frequencies-hogging guitarist (Les Paul Junior or Strat through Mesa Boogie head into 4x12 Marshall cab, turned way up with the low end cranked). I had both pickups up all the time, because the tone was really smooth and silky that way. People kept telling me that they couldn't hear the bass at all. Finally, at one show I bit the bullet and soloed the neck pickup. The same people said things like, "Is that the same bass? It sounds great!!"
It's the "bedroom tone" vs. stage tone issue.
 
#20
dougjwray said:
...It's the "bedroom tone" vs. stage tone issue.
Click to expand...
Great point, and one that SOOO many people cannot comprehend. They get that sound they love @ home while practicing, then wonder why they are buried in the mix through FOH with a full band.

What sounds good in your tiny little practice area most likely will NOT sound good and fit the band in a live setting.
 

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