Double Bass NS Design NXT Megathread

[steve_rolfeca]

So it looks like this HPF thing is the way to go if I want to play with consumer pedals.....

What do you think of the low-end Zoom boxes once I have the impedance sorted out?

EDIT: I have a Tech21 Sansamp Bass Driver DI. Does that help with the impedance?

The BDDI is like having a Boss tuner or the Zoom MS-60B.

At 1 MegOhm, it has a high enough input impedance to avoid loading down your electric bass guitars, etc. But not enough to give you the best tone from passive Piezo pickups like the one in your NXT.

The low-end Zooms have similar audio performance to the top of the line, but the user interface isn't even in the same league.

I strongly recommend spending the extra to pick up a new or used B3n or G5n. The trouble with the low end pedals, is that they tease you with good models and tones, but leave you wishing that you could get at them more easily.

Check out the MS-60B megathread to see what I mean. Most users love what they're hearing, yet 80% of the posts are on the same theme: "how do I get around shortcoming X?". The rest are often about chaining multiple MS-60B's or other stompboxes in a vain attempt to get the functionality that's already built into the bigger units.

The top of the line Zoom's, on the other hand, are close enough to what you can get out of things like the Amplifire and Helix, to keep you from GAS'ing for vastly more expensive floor modellers or conventional pedalboards.

BTW, the FDeck is a phenomenal piece of kit. Useful with electric bass and other instruments as well, plus Francis' customer service is second to none. I have the V3 version, and highly recommend it.

 

[Spanky123]

Thanks for this. I will look at other Zooms. Do you happen to know if my Tech 21 bass driver raised the impedance if I put it in front?

The BDDI is like having a Boss tuner or the Zoom MS-60B.

At 1 MegOhm, it has a high enough input impedance to avoid loading down your electric bass guitars, etc. But not enough to give you the best tone from passive Piezo pickups like the one in your NXT.

The low-end Zooms have similar audio performance to the top of the line, but the user interface isn't even in the same league.

I strongly recommend spending the extra to pick up a new or used B3n or G5n. The trouble with the low end pedals, is that they tease you with good models and tones, but leave you wishing that you could get at them more easily.

Check out the MS-60B megathread to see what I mean. Most users love what they're hearing, yet 80% of the posts are on the same theme: "how do I get around shortcoming X?". The rest are often about chaining multiple MS-60B's or other stompboxes in a vain attempt to get the functionality that's already built into the bigger units.

The top of the line Zoom's, on the other hand, are close enough to what you can get out of things like the Amplifire and Helix, to keep you from GAS'ing for vastly more expensive floor modellers or conventional pedalboards.

BTW, the FDeck is a phenomenal piece of kit. Useful with electric bass and other instruments as well, plus Francis' customer service is second to none. I have the V3 version, and highly recommend it.

 

[fivestringgecko]

(The pedal collection above is impressive, but way out of my league).

I live in a remote location so I cannot visit a retail shop. I have to mail order.

Thanks! To be fair though, that board isn't specific to my NXTa. That's my live rig for electric bass with the various bands I play with, and just happens to be very cool with the electric upright.

It may surprise you a bit given what I have for a pedalboard, but despite having that setup, I practice through a Zoom B3 at home with both my electrics and the NS. I much prefer my single pedals, but the B3 doesn't sound too bad and it's super handy. It's got a broad spectrum of effects/amp models, can function as a recording interface, has a metronome & rhythm trainer, XLR out, etc etc. I've even used it as a travel board on a couple quick weekend fly gigs, it fits in the front pocket of my gig bag. It's discontinued so you'd have to find one used, and there's an extensive TB thread on it here. Like others have mentioned, you'd need something like the FDeck with your NXT.

Re: Mail Order: You can check online places like Musicians Friend, Sweetwater and Sam Ash, which have pretty liberal return policies. You can return things even if you simply just don't like them, all you pay is shipping. The only drawback with that route is that they aren't so strong with used gear, if that matters. I've always found the TB classifieds and Reverb.com seem to be the best bets for used.

I'm hardly on Talkbass much anymore, but I do poke my nose in once in a while. I may be a little slow to reply, but you're welcome to message me if you're looking for any specific info on the B3. I'll help if I can.

5sg.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

Thanks for this. I will look at other Zooms. Do you happen to know if my Tech 21 bass driver raised the impedance if I put it in front?

If you plug a passive electric bass into too low an impedance, you'll lose treble and get a dark mushy sound.

Piezos are the opposite. Plugged into a low-impedance input, they get bright and quacky, and lose a bunch of bass response.

You always want your highest-impedance device in front of the NXT, and it's best if you can connect it through a short, high quality cable.

That said, the Tech 21 BDDI is only 1 MegOhm, and you'll want 5 or 10.

The NXT won't have a very fat bottom end, and the treble will sound pretty raspy through the BDDI.

Fiddling with EQ will only do so much, and you'd be happier with a proper high-impedance buffer before the rest of your pedals, DI, amp, etc.

There are tons of 10 Meg Ohm preamps on the market:

• FDeck HPF pre.
• Radial PZ-Pre, PZ Deluxe, PZ Select, Bassbone, Bassbone OD
• Fishman Platinum Pro-EQ
• Grace Designs
• Headway EDB-2
• LR Baggs Gigpro or Mixpro
• Quality Bass Gear QBG1

Some of the preamps have more bells and whistles, but I find my main needs are for the high impedance input, and a sharp High Pass Filter to get rid of the subsonic mud that happens with piezos.

The NXT can pretty much get your speaker cones jumping out of the cab without an HPF...

 

[fivestringgecko]

...and a sharp High Pass Filter to get rid of the subsonic mud that happens with piezos.

The NXT can pretty much get your speaker cones jumping out of the cab without an HPF...

I've found this as well. I use the Graphic EQ in my B3 to cut at 50Hz. I know that's not quite the same as a dedicated HPF, which I'd get if I ever get into any serious gigging with the NXT, but it does help clean up the sound significantly. I also use just a smidge of delay (like, 15ms) to liven up the sound a bit.

I'll also add Broughton Audio for HPF filter options. They have a couple options, I've got [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] on my G.A.S. list. Pretty reasonably priced, always on... mount it under the board and forget about it.

5sg.

 

[jthisdell]

I use a Radial Bassbone OD and occasionally I'll forget to switch on the high z impedance. Then I am confused as to why it sounds thin and crappy. Finally I will remember to switch it on and wow, what a difference it makes! No amount of EQ can compare to using the high z input. I've only had to learn this lesson about ten times although at least my recognition of the problem has improved dramatically! (The Radial Bassbone and Bassbone OD have two channels with the high z on 1. If nothing is plugged into 2 the high z goes off to turn on another feature. So I usually have to remember to plug an open cord or adapter into 2 to make sure the high z on 1 is turned on. Confusing result of too many features packed into a box.)

 

[equill]

(The Radial Bassbone and Bassbone OD have two channels with the high z on 1. If nothing is plugged into 2 the high z goes off to turn on another feature. So I usually have to remember to plug an open cord or adapter into 2 to make sure the high z on 1 is turned on. Confusing result of too many features packed into a box.)

I use an OD and haven't noticed this, nor does the manual mention it. Will test tonight and report back, though.

 

[jthisdell]

I use an OD and haven't noticed this, nor does the manual mention it. Will test tonight and report back, though.

The model I have has the high z switch on channel 1. It also has a feature where if you have an instrument plugged into channel 1 and nothing in 2 you can use both channels for one instrument and switch between them to toggle between two different eq settings. When you do this it defeats the high z feature.

 

[Mark Gollihur]

The model I have has the high z switch on channel 1. It also has a feature where if you have an instrument plugged into channel 1 and nothing in 2 you can use both channels for one instrument and switch between them to toggle between two different eq settings. When you do this it defeats the high z feature.

We actually include a small 1/4" adapter plug with the Bassbone OD for this purpose, as a bonus item, since many of our customers are using it with their uprights.

"The Bassbone is spec’d for use as a channel switcher for an electric bass, or a two-instrument switcher. If you are only using it for one upright bass on a gig, plugged into Input A (which has the 10 megOhm switch), you might experience lower gain levels. This is because the “smart switch” (which apparently isn’t very smart) isn’t activated by something being plugged into Input B.

So, the simple solution: Plug this little adapter into the “spare” input if you’re not getting full gain levels out of the preamp."

 

[steve_rolfeca]

We actually include a small 1/4" adapter plug with the Bassbone OD for this purpose, as a bonus item, since many of our customers are using it with their uprights.

And that's a pretty good example of what makes you such a class act.

 

[Spanky123]

I appreciate all the responses. I have taken forum's advice and purchased an Fdeck pre. It is on the way. Meanwhile, still deciding on a stomp. It looks like the higher-end Zooms are popular here. Has anyone tried a Line 6 Pod? At this point I am not using it for professional purposes. I have an attention-deficit and bore easily while practicing my scales and arpeggios. I am really just looking for something to liven up my exercises. I think a synthesizer might be fun. I am dependent on mail order since I live in Saudi Arabia (no Guitarcenter for at least 1000 miles).

 

[Spanky123]

NXT case: $680 on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/NS-Design-Fl...7176&sr=8-3-fkmr1&keywords=ns+design+nxt+case

I am thinking that there has to be another case out there that fits this instrument for a lot less money. Does anyone have any insight on this question?

 

[Mark Gollihur]

NXT case: $680 on Amazon
I am thinking that there has to be another case out there that fits this instrument for a lot less money. Does anyone have any insight on this question?

 

[ArtechnikA]

I am thinking that there has to be another case out there that fits this instrument for a lot less money. Does anyone have any insight on this question?

My NXT-5 came with one of these: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000F61ZU8/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1
Maybe not pro-tour ATA approved, but people fly expensive skiis in them...

 

[Spanky123]

Well, shucks.....

My NXT-5 came with one of these: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000F61ZU8/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1
Maybe not pro-tour ATA approved, but people fly expensive skiis in them...

 

[Gabriel1918]

Hi folks, I'm kind of new to the forum but have been reading my way through this thread and have finally got through all 56 pages!

I have an NXT5 and could do with some pointers on tone. I'm using a Fishman Stage preamp and still have the contemporary strings on (E to C) and have been struggling with tone, particularly with the E and C. The C is a piece of cheese-wire and sounds more like a thin steel guitar string than a bass string. The E - well, imagine going up to a steel telephone pole stabilising cable and hitting it with a spoon - it's empty, hollow and has no body or real volume/ punch to it. If I boost the bass or low mids it's boomy and undefined. More attack on the string just gives more boom and hollow not more bass tone.

Now before people start recommending changing to traditional strings, I just want to point out that I'm not chasing a more acoustic double bass sound. Nor am I keen to spend another £200 experimenting with a set of Spirocores if the problem mainly lies in the NXT model that I've chosen. I'm interested in the hybrid sound (potentially). So I don't really want high tension strings and more 'thump' as many people do. I'd like to keep the fretless 'mwah' (hate that word) but with good, rich bass tone rather that hollow metal tube cling-clang I have at the moment. I've begun to wonder if there's something wrong with the piezo.

I'm at the stage where I'm considering whether it's the CR-M model I need. I'd sooner not go spending a fortune on more gear if I can make the NXT work for me. If strings are definitely the solution then that would be great. Anyone who has experienced the same problem and either found strings that solve it or who have switched from an NXT to a CR-M may have answers that could save me a lot of wasted time and money chasing a rainbow.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

Hi folks, I'm kind of new to the forum but have been reading my way through this thread and have finally got through all 56 pages!

I have an NXT5 and could do with some pointers on tone. ...If I boost the bass or low mids it's boomy and undefined. More attack on the string just gives more boom and hollow not more bass tone.

...I'd like to keep the fretless 'mwah' (hate that word) but with good, rich bass tone..j. I've begun to wonder if there's something wrong with the piezo.

No comment on the high C, as I have no experience with that on upright or electric bass.

But it sounds like there's definitely something wrong.

I have the stock strings, and had similar issues at first.

The biggest problem for me, was using the wrong arco switch setting. I was using it to get more mwah, and then trying to EQ out the harshness. That just didn't work.

The next, was that cranking the low end on my bass amps didn't offset the clack and hollowness that came from plugging the passive piezo's into a low impedance input. A high-impedance K&K preamp fixed that.

Now that I was getting the full depth and richness that the NXT is capable of, I needed to figure out how to tame it in boomy rooms and/or busy stages.

The final refinement came from swapping the simple pre for an FDeck HPF.

The two-stage version of the FDeck is perfect. The fixed, always-on filter takes care of the sub-sonics from the piezo, and the variable one is great for making on the fly adjustments to suit the room and the band.

With this setup, I no longer need post EQ to get a good tone.

I've never used the Fishman, but if I were in your shoes, I would start by zeroing out the EQ and fiddling with the Arco switch.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

Steel core high C strings are either thin sounding (in the lower position at least) or higher tension and cut into the finger if the action is not very low.

It might help to know the string height (a bit below the third octave) since string height has a large influence on sound.

 

[Gabriel1918]

Thanks guys. I've adjusted the string height up and down to no avail. It's currently low at about 5mm on the E side at the fingerboard end and maybe 4mm on the C. Doesn't seem to make a great deal of difference even when I max out the bridge height. I suspect that the contemporary C is just not a good string and would be better in a bigger gauge/ different type of string. Right now it's unusable to my ear.

The Fishman has switch selectable filtering and works best when set to cut 40Hz. It also has Bass, Mid with mid frequency pan selector and treble. There's no getting away from the fact that there's no life in the E string even with all of the tweaking on the preamp. Volume on the E is an issue, but my current thoughts on that are that this is likely due to insufficient low middle frequencies inherent in the string itself. Boosting the preamp low mids helps a bit with volume but things are muddy rather than clear and punchy. And in any case this throws out the EQ on the other strings. Or maybe it's a bum piezo? Or could it be that this is just the way these basses sound and it just doesn't suit me? I don't know as I have no reference to compare to, other than my fretless basses, which of course work off magnetic pickups, not piezos.

I've listened to Warwick Triumph basses online and am a fan of Eberhard Weber, and from amateur to pro soundclips, they all have tight, thick, low end tone on the E string. I can't get anywhere near that type of tone.

By the way, I'm using a Trace Elliot AH200S and 2 x 12 and have tried it through my little Phil Jones Double Four. Same problems. Everything points to the instrument/ strings.

Anyone had these problems and solved them with different strings or a change to a CR magnetic pickup model?

 

[buffalobillh]

A more substantial/robust C string might help, but the Contemporary E string ought to be solid. I have been playing Traditionals for years, but even before I switched to them, the E string was still a big fat Thor's hammer with good tone when I needed it to be.

A friend of mine had some of the foil covering the pickup peel away, and it killed his E string. I am wondering if you have a similar problem…?

Have you talked to NS about it? It could be an issue with the pick up that might be relatively easy to solve. My experience is that they are second to none with customer service.