NV215 or HS410 with Thunderfunk?

[Big String]

My T-Funk sounds great with my NV610 but better with my HS210. Now my DB750 sounds awesome w/ my NV610. Actually for gigs and am going to be using my T-Funk and HS210 this time around

Squidley
Is you HS210 a 4ohm ???

edit: never mind, just went to the site an looks like 8ohm just available. Shrug.

 

[tombowlus]

This is from Jim Bergantino himself:

Hi Ken,

The HS410 relative to the SA410 can play louder due to the new woofer design. It will also have more apparent low end, although it's not due to extension (i.e. lower response), but due to the fact that the newer woofers can move more air before compression so that the low end is warmer and fatter, but again, not more extended.

(irrelevant stuff deleted)

Regards,

Jim

From what I can understand, the drivers are equally efficient, but the 10's in the HS410 have more excursion, and therefore move more air, and are therefore louder (at least in the lows). Bottom line is, the HS410 and HS210 are designed to get the most from lower powered heads, but still be able to handle higher power.

I had the chance to hear the HS410 and HS210 for the first time last Friday down at Bass Emporium. OMFG!!! I had some idea of what to expect, but I was extremely blown away by the HS410 (and the HS210). We were testing them with an EBS HD350, which puts 350w into a 4 ohm load, and it was loud, full, clear, and just so darned 'good' sounding. Very impressive.

Of course, I still love that NV215. Tough call, there.

Tom.

 

[Mr_Dave]

From what I can understand, the drivers are equally efficient, but the 10's in the HS410 have more excursion, and therefore move more air, and are therefore louder (at least in the lows). Bottom line is, the HS410 and HS210 are designed to get the most from lower powered heads, but still be able to handle higher power.

I had the chance to hear the HS410 and HS210 for the first time last Friday down at Bass Emporium. OMFG!!! I had some idea of what to expect, but I was extremely blown away by the HS410 (and the HS210). We were testing them with an EBS HD350, which puts 350w into a 4 ohm load, and it was loud, full, clear, and just so darned 'good' sounding. Very impressive.

Of course, I still love that NV215. Tough call, there.

Tom.

I want the HS410 for my Tfunk bad now...

 

[Alistair R]

I want the HS410 for my Tfunk bad now...

Man you gotta get one soon.....

 

[Mr_Dave]

I would also highly recommend trying the new Epi410UL-II... more conventional voicing than the original version, at least as efficient as the HS410, very nice match with the TF, and MUCH lighter if that matters to you.

The NV215 is a WONDERFUL, unique cab.... old school 2x15 with a slightly modern twist. That's a GREAT cab!

Argh... Ken you're killing me... Maybe i'll somehow order both or something

EDIT; i think i posted in my HS410 thread a while ago, while the weight of the ul410-II is much better, i think it might be too deep to go in the backseat of my car, the 15.5" depth of the Berg is more friendly for that... hmmm

 

[KJung]

Argh... Ken you're killing me... Maybe i'll somehow order both or something

I actually erased that post, since I did not see the 'rock voicing' sort of requirement in the OP prior to posting. While I haven't heard the new HS410, it seems to be very similar to the SA410 (same box, same crossover, etc., but with more 'typical' drivers vs. the very tight surround woofers used in the SA410 to mimic a sealed cab for use with the SA200). Assuming that's the case, I would think it would be a great 'rock 410'... low mid punch, etc., without the low end limitations I heard with the SA410 and a moderate powered SS head.

If you don't mind the weight, I bet that's a great cab. However, if you don't mind the weight, and like a rock tone, I'd be ALL OVER the NV215... forget about it!

Edit: That being said... the 410UL/TF is quite impressive and talk about an easy schlep! It's worth a listen, especially with the Thunderfunk!

 

[tombowlus]

While I haven't heard the new HS410, it seems to be very similar to the SA410 (same box, same crossover, etc., but with more 'typical' drivers vs. the very tight surround woofers used in the SA410 to mimic a sealed cab for use with the SA200). Assuming that's the case, I would think it would be a great 'rock 410'... low mid punch, etc., without the low end limitations I heard with the SA410 and a moderate powered SS head.

Actually, the exterior box is the same, and the tweeter is the same, but the drivers, the crossover, and the tuning are all different. The lows are definitely stronger, the mids are equally powerful and clear, with a slightly more open sound, and the high end is perhaps a tad more airy. The overall efficiency is definitely apparent when comparing it to other cabs (which you can easily do at Bass Emporium - I love that switcher John has!). That HS410 is a very loud cab, and it seems to really open up with no effort.

I need to spend more time with one, but my initial experience is that the HS410 has exceeded my expectations (which were honestly quite high going into it).

Tom.

 

[Vic]

We were testing them with an EBS HD350, which puts 350w into a 4 ohm load...

Gotta' qualify this a bit... the HD350 is VERY VERY conservatively rated. It's easily as loud as any 500-700W "rated" amp I've used.

 

[tombowlus]

Gotta' qualify this a bit... the HD350 is VERY VERY conservatively rated. It's easily as loud as any 500-700W "rated" amp I've used.

Good point. But, I wouldn't go so far as to say it's as loud as a head/amp rated at 700w into the same load, but it certainly does hang with some other amps rated for, say, 500w into the same load.

That said, since I used the same head with all the cabs I tried, the HS410's relative efficiency (compared to those other cabs) would not be dependent upon whether the head was conservatively or aggressively rated.

 

[KJung]

Good point. But, I wouldn't go so far as to say it's as loud as a head/amp rated at 700w into the same load, but it certainly does hang with some other amps rated for, say, 500w into the same load.

That said, since I used the same head with all the cabs I tried, the HS410's relative efficiency (compared to those other cabs) would not be dependent upon whether the head was conservatively or aggressively rated.

+1... the EBS350 is a great head, but it couldn't hang with, for example, the TF volume wise (at least without sounding pushed).

I have no doubt that the HS410 is a loud cab, since that was Jim's design goal. Since most of Jim's other cabs are quite low in SPL (at least the other larger HT boxes... of course with that low SPL comes that deep low end extension... you can't have it both ways ), this cab would be considered a 'high efficiency' Berg. However, my guess would be it would be similar in volume to the other 'high efficiency' 410's that have been on the market for some time... Epifani, Aguilar, Eden, etc. There's nothing magic about making a good sounding cab with good SPL! The Eden 410XLT and XST and Epi410UL are massive loud with moderate power also!

 

[jacove]

If you want something that sounds louder, fuller and more ballsy than the HT112, but still has a lot of midrange to cut through and relatively portable the Aguilar DB112's are great. I think Tommixx uses a couple with a Thunderfunk with great succes. Just another option to make you more confused..hehe, sorry...

 

[tombowlus]

I have no doubt that the HS410 is a loud cab, since that was Jim's design goal. Since most of Jim's other cabs are quite low in SPL (at least the other larger HT boxes... of course with that low SPL comes that deep low end extension... you can't have it both ways ), this cab would be considered a 'high efficiency' Berg. However, my guess would be it would be similar in volume to the other 'high efficiency' 410's that have been on the market for some time... Epifani, Aguilar, Eden, etc. There's nothing magic about making a good sounding cab with good SPL! The Eden 410XLT and XST and Epi410UL are massive loud with moderate power also!

While I agree that those are all relatively efficient designs (and that some of Jim's prior designs really needed some juice to drive them properly), via direct comparison (using John's handy dandy speaker selector), the HS410 definitely had more apparent volume than the Eden 410XLT, Aguilar GS410, or any of the other 4x10's John had on hand (he did not currently have an Epifani in stock).

 

[joelb79]

I think that as a matter of voicing, its up to the OP on whether or not the cab has what he is looking for. Some people love the grindy mid sound for rock, others like the extreme lows and sizzle thing which takes the grind out. It sounds like the HS410 might be the ticket, and man what a deal for the price point.

 

[Fuzzbass]

From what I can understand, the drivers are equally efficient, but the 10's in the HS410 have more excursion, and therefore move more air, and are therefore louder (at least in the lows). Bottom line is, the HS410 and HS210 are designed to get the most from lower powered heads, but still be able to handle higher power.

I had the chance to hear the HS410 and HS210 for the first time last Friday down at Bass Emporium. OMFG!!! I had some idea of what to expect, but I was extremely blown away by the HS410 (and the HS210). We were testing them with an EBS HD350, which puts 350w into a 4 ohm load, and it was loud, full, clear, and just so darned 'good' sounding. Very impressive.

Of course, I still love that NV215. Tough call, there.

Tom.

Per Jim the HS410 will be louder across the spectrum than the SA410, but we bassists will primarily notice the loudness increase in the lows. Regardless, I'm fairly certain I'll be on the HS bus soon. A pair of HS210 will be a louder and more portable alternative to my SA410, and have the same aural mojo... the 2x10 stack will also be a smidge taller. The SA410 at 85 pounds is lighter than most non-neo 4x10 cabs, but a pair of 52 pound 2x10 cabs will be a piece of cake to transport!

 

[Alexander]

The HS 410 sounds like a great contender, here to be sure! I'm looking essentially for a tone very similar to my BMS, with added girth\depth\bottom. I got the BMS with my rather widely voiced\scooped SWR and the mid-focused BMS was a great compliment to that. When I switched to the TFunk, however which is also very mid focused, the end result was something thinner than I like - fantastic mids and airy highs, but the depth just isn't there. I do like a growly, not nasally J bass tone overall - I got more of this grind through an Epi UL112 I tried than my BMS. When I talk about "rock voiced", I'm thinking Allman Bros, Govt Mule, Marshall Tucker, Hendrix, SRV, etc - NOT punk, metal, thrash, etc. Not sure if this makes a difference.

I'm also looking for added volume above what the BMS provides - seems either the UL410 or HS410 will deliver on this.

Thanks everyone for all of the feedback!

 

[JOME77]

I'm considering picking up a larger Berg cab - either the HS410 or NV215. I've used an HT112\EX112 stack for the past several years and they've been awesome. But I am in the market for a larger (i.e. bigger and more full sounding) cab to use with my 400W Thunderfunk - it is an amazing sounding head and the combo sounds great. In certain situations, though I find the combo to be overly mid-focused and almost compressed sounding, lacking that fullness I want for my new band (blues\rock\country).

I know it's a bit off topic from your questions concerning the larger Berg's with the TFunk, but knowing how much you've dug the sound and portability of the Berg 112 stack over the last couple of years I wondered if you've played the TFunk through the Epi UL-112's?
I played Tfunk and Eden heads through 2 Berg HT-112's for a little over a year and recently made the change to the Epi UL-112's. In my case, I recently switched over to a Smith as my main bass and the mids of the Smith coupled with the mids of the Bergs was just a bit much.
I really think that the Epi 112's will give you the fullness that your looking for. The Epi's have much more full sounding lows and have a bit more sizzle in the highs than the Bergs. Plus they're even lighter (29 lbs)!
While IMO the Epi's don't have the sweet mid voicing of the Bergs but they do respond real well to EQ'ing and the mid's don't sound nasual or honky at all.
I'm also real impressed with the amount of clean volume that the Epi's put out too.

.......just a thought.

 

[Alexander]

Yes - I tried a UL112 (unfortunately, they only had one). I really noticed the added growl, but was also trying a Sadowsky for the first time instead of my Fender, so not sure if that was the bass or the cab I was hearing (I'm a hack at some of this stuff...). I didn't hear the fullness, but honestly, I didn't crank the thing, either...